Youth development.... - reserve/youth team discussion

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Postby Igor Zidane » Tue Aug 12, 2008 6:39 pm

Fo Dne wrote:
JoeTerp wrote:Astrit was given permission to find a new club, but for some reason or another (maybe nobody good wanted him) he seems to be back. Maybe hit attitude will sharpen up. Marvin Pourie seems to suffer from similar attitude problems.

Also, always felt sorry for Parsonage because he looked really promising as a U16 playing in the first youth cup win, and then could hardly get a game last year at the academy.

Ben wasn't good enough to be fair. He's not a bad player but nowhere near good enough. Could definately play in the footy leagues though, quick and skillfull. Tends to try to do to much at times though...

Stu , you got any thoughts on the young lads that have been playing pre-season. I think young steven darby has stood out for me . One thing i will say about all the youngsters i've seen so far in pre-season is that they all look like confident lads and didn't shirk any responsibility when they came on . THey wanted the ball and tried to use it well . Quite impressed by the lot of them really.
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Postby JC_81 » Tue Aug 12, 2008 11:44 pm

I still think Nemeth is the best young prospect we have.  His movement is excellent, touch not bad and finishing is really good.  He hasn't had as much of a chance in pre-season as some of the others (like Pacheco) because he was away with Hungary.  He's definitely my pick of the bunch.  I'd like to see him loaned out though.  He's one who won't improve by playing more reserve team football imo, he's already proven he's too good for that level.

Plessis is probably the one who is closest to the first team.  Keeps it simple and is the most physically developed of the bunch for his age.  His problem is that he has Gerrard, Mascherano, Alonso and Lucas ahead of him.  With Masch and Lucas at the Olympics though, don't be surprised if he gets into the starting line-up for a few games early season.  At best he will swap places with Lucas in the pecking order this season.

I must be missing something with Darby though, I haven't been overly impressed (admittedly I haven't seen all of the pre-season games).  Spearing, Insua and Pacheco all look like they have a bit more about them.  Spearing could also do with being loaned out this season imo.  Pacheco and Insua need to do some developing physically yet, so I'd keep them here this season.
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Postby stmichael » Thu Aug 28, 2008 12:18 pm

We still have problems in that Rafa once again isrefusing to work with the Academy director (he has a problem with Piet Hamberg, I don't know what it is), and his own 'academy' at Melwood is growing to the point where it's becoming very, very difficult for players from the 18s to get games with the reserves now. Only two players were moved up a year early this time, McKay-Steven and Steven Irwin, and neither of those will be first choice for the reserves and will struggle to get many games.

At the moment, Everton have a 16 and a 17 year old in their FIRST TEAM. Ok I realise that's because they are desperate, but a 16 or 17 year old scouse lad at Liverpool is only going to play Academy football.
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Postby JoeTerp » Thu Aug 28, 2008 3:31 pm

stmichael wrote:We still have problems in that Rafa once again isrefusing to work with the Academy director (he has a problem with Piet Hamberg, I don't know what it is), and his own 'academy' at Melwood is growing to the point where it's becoming very, very difficult for players from the 18s to get games with the reserves now. Only two players were moved up a year early this time, McKay-Steven and Steven Irwin, and neither of those will be first choice for the reserves and will struggle to get many games.

At the moment, Everton have a 16 and a 17 year old in their FIRST TEAM. Ok I realise that's because they are desperate, but a 16 or 17 year old scouse lad at Liverpool is only going to play Academy football.

I am currently very concerned about the log jam at some positions in the reservers and U18s. I have been impressed by the talent of almost every player that I have seen in attacking positions for both teams, but it is so hard to develop without consistently playing or by starting off at a very young age with so much pressure to perform or else you will lose your spot.

The reserve strikers this year are: Pacheco, Nemeth, Saric, with Eccleston probably getting some games. Don't forget Simon and Weijl who will probably have to move to the wings or play as second strikers. Nemeth and Simon (who misses the cut off by 6 months) are the only one of that bunch who isn't elligible for U18 action this season.

Then in the U18s there is Pourie (goal scoring machine despite bad rep for poor attitude), Dalle Valle (really highly rated, looks very talented), Adam Pepper who is also held in very high regard and scored a lot of goals for the U16s is now playing CM instead of striker so he can get on the pitch, Thomas Ince is moving out to the wings so he can play, and James Ellison even though he has actually looked decent, is clearly a class behind everybody else.


Then on the wings as mentioned there is Gary Mackay-Steven on the left along with VERY VERY highly rated Gerardo Bruna, and Kacaniklic has been the most impressive U18 so far to me, and he has played in a few ressie pre-season matches, and when Ince has been deployed out there for the U18s he has put in some very nice crosses.  And it looks like Weijl will be deployed on the left sometimes for the ressies as well. Oh yea and we have Ray Putterrill still here and Hammill and Leto out on loan. And that is just people who can play on the left. Also Butchman has looked impressive for the U18s, but hopefully he might be able to get game time at left back (which is where I thought he played in the Germany youth set up)

On the right there is El Zhar who seems to be coming along nicely, Anderson on loan, Amoo the striker turned right winger, Ryan Crowther (doesn't look good enough imo), and sometimes Flynn plays out there.

Don't even get me started with our Gk situation which has lots of young players: Bouzanis, Gulacsi, Hansen, Martin on loan, and the U18s have Duyan, Chamberlain, and Oldfield. FFS we still haven't gotten rid of Itandje yet.
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Postby Fo Dne » Thu Aug 28, 2008 3:36 pm

Igor Zidane wrote:
Fo Dne wrote:
JoeTerp wrote:Astrit was given permission to find a new club, but for some reason or another (maybe nobody good wanted him) he seems to be back. Maybe hit attitude will sharpen up. Marvin Pourie seems to suffer from similar attitude problems.

Also, always felt sorry for Parsonage because he looked really promising as a U16 playing in the first youth cup win, and then could hardly get a game last year at the academy.

Ben wasn't good enough to be fair. He's not a bad player but nowhere near good enough. Could definately play in the footy leagues though, quick and skillfull. Tends to try to do to much at times though...

Stu , you got any thoughts on the young lads that have been playing pre-season. I think young steven darby has stood out for me . One thing i will say about all the youngsters i've seen so far in pre-season is that they all look like confident lads and didn't shirk any responsibility when they came on . THey wanted the ball and tried to use it well . Quite impressed by the lot of them really.

Nar, Spearing looks the best of a bad bunch for me and obviously now El Zhar seems to have something about him at least.

Spearing lacks the technical attributes to succeed at this level though I would think. Can't see Darby doing anything, looked clueless to me positionally and in terms of over lapping.
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Postby Fo Dne » Thu Aug 28, 2008 3:36 pm

john craig wrote:I still think Nemeth is the best young prospect we have.  His movement is excellent, touch not bad and finishing is really good.  He hasn't had as much of a chance in pre-season as some of the others (like Pacheco) because he was away with Hungary.  He's definitely my pick of the bunch.  I'd like to see him loaned out though.  He's one who won't improve by playing more reserve team football imo, he's already proven he's too good for that level.

Plessis is probably the one who is closest to the first team.  Keeps it simple and is the most physically developed of the bunch for his age.  His problem is that he has Gerrard, Mascherano, Alonso and Lucas ahead of him.  With Masch and Lucas at the Olympics though, don't be surprised if he gets into the starting line-up for a few games early season.  At best he will swap places with Lucas in the pecking order this season.

I must be missing something with Darby though, I haven't been overly impressed (admittedly I haven't seen all of the pre-season games).  Spearing, Insua and Pacheco all look like they have a bit more about them.  Spearing could also do with being loaned out this season imo.  Pacheco and Insua need to do some developing physically yet, so I'd keep them here this season.

Plessis is :censored:.
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Postby Rush Job » Fri Aug 29, 2008 4:49 am

JoeTerp wrote:
stmichael wrote:We still have problems in that Rafa once again isrefusing to work with the Academy director (he has a problem with Piet Hamberg, I don't know what it is), and his own 'academy' at Melwood is growing to the point where it's becoming very, very difficult for players from the 18s to get games with the reserves now. Only two players were moved up a year early this time, McKay-Steven and Steven Irwin, and neither of those will be first choice for the reserves and will struggle to get many games.

At the moment, Everton have a 16 and a 17 year old in their FIRST TEAM. Ok I realise that's because they are desperate, but a 16 or 17 year old scouse lad at Liverpool is only going to play Academy football.

I am currently very concerned about the log jam at some positions in the reservers and U18s. I have been impressed by the talent of almost every player that I have seen in attacking positions for both teams, but it is so hard to develop without consistently playing or by starting off at a very young age with so much pressure to perform or else you will lose your spot.

The reserve strikers this year are: Pacheco, Nemeth, Saric, with Eccleston probably getting some games. Don't forget Simon and Weijl who will probably have to move to the wings or play as second strikers. Nemeth and Simon (who misses the cut off by 6 months) are the only one of that bunch who isn't elligible for U18 action this season.

Then in the U18s there is Pourie (goal scoring machine despite bad rep for poor attitude), Dalle Valle (really highly rated, looks very talented), Adam Pepper who is also held in very high regard and scored a lot of goals for the U16s is now playing CM instead of striker so he can get on the pitch, Thomas Ince is moving out to the wings so he can play, and James Ellison even though he has actually looked decent, is clearly a class behind everybody else.


Then on the wings as mentioned there is Gary Mackay-Steven on the left along with VERY VERY highly rated Gerardo Bruna, and Kacaniklic has been the most impressive U18 so far to me, and he has played in a few ressie pre-season matches, and when Ince has been deployed out there for the U18s he has put in some very nice crosses.  And it looks like Weijl will be deployed on the left sometimes for the ressies as well. Oh yea and we have Ray Putterrill still here and Hammill and Leto out on loan. And that is just people who can play on the left. Also Butchman has looked impressive for the U18s, but hopefully he might be able to get game time at left back (which is where I thought he played in the Germany youth set up)

On the right there is El Zhar who seems to be coming along nicely, Anderson on loan, Amoo the striker turned right winger, Ryan Crowther (doesn't look good enough imo), and sometimes Flynn plays out there.

Don't even get me started with our Gk situation which has lots of young players: Bouzanis, Gulacsi, Hansen, Martin on loan, and the U18s have Duyan, Chamberlain, and Oldfield. FFS we still haven't gotten rid of Itandje yet.

Keep us updated Joe, ive no LFCTV subscription, have to pull me finger out.
I know you put time in watching/reviewing the ressies and youth and i value your opinion on them more than anyone elses, your to youth what Mick is to rotation, Owzat to stats and Peewee to sh!te, (sorry mate)
:D

You perform a great service to anyone interested in the state of our youth, keep up the good work. :)
Last edited by Rush Job on Fri Aug 29, 2008 4:56 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby stmichael » Fri Aug 29, 2008 10:43 am

Fo Dne wrote:Plessis is :censored:.

Have to agree with you Stu.

Everytime he got the ball against Sunderland you would have thought it was a hand grenade.
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Postby bunglemark2 » Fri Aug 29, 2008 11:07 am

stmichael wrote:
Fo Dne wrote:Plessis is :censored:.

Have to agree with you Stu.

Everytime he got the ball against Sunderland you would have thought it was a hand grenade.

Can't say I think he did all that badly to be honest. He did the simple things and he did them well. Didn't give the ball away, retained possession. He's big and long enough to stick out a leg and break up a play from the opposition...
Give him time.
I have to say, I saw quite a bit of the reserves last season and he stuck out. Granted it's the reserves, but I can see him faring a whole lot better than say Spearing.
Don't know if Rafa intends to give any of the others a run out or in which competition, but hopefully once we're 3-0 up away to Manure we might see one or two of them on for the last 10-15 minutes... :buttrock
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Postby stmichael » Tue Sep 02, 2008 1:43 pm

am going to the liverpool-boro reserve team game at the riverside tonight. looking forward to it. hopefully riera and flora will both be playing.
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Postby LegBarnes » Tue Sep 02, 2008 1:45 pm

stmichael wrote:
Fo Dne wrote:Plessis is :censored:.

Have to agree with you Stu.

Everytime he got the ball against Sunderland you would have thought it was a hand grenade.

Its because he played half of first half with injury.
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Postby JoeTerp » Tue Sep 02, 2008 2:39 pm

stmichael wrote:am going to the liverpool-boro reserve team game at the riverside tonight. looking forward to it. hopefully riera and flora will both be playing.

The Reds XII in full is: Peter Gulacsi, Philipp Degen, Stephen Darby (cap), Mikel San Jose Dominguez, Ronald Huth, Martin Kelly, Gerardo Bruna, Jay Spearing, Jordy Brouwer, Daniel Pacheco, Vincent Weijl. Subs: Daniel Ayala, Dean Bouzanis, Andras Simon, Steven Irwin, Ryan Crowther.

That lineup is ridiculous.

3 right backs in Darby, Degen, and Kelly OR 3 centre halfs in Kelly San Jose and Huth. Weijl I thought was a second striker type play when we signed him but I have only seen ressie pre-season clips of him playing wide left (but I think he is two footed) which is also where Bruna plays.  But there is a way to make some kind of sense of it:
                                 Gulacsi
  Darby          Kelly                      Huth          Degen
Weijl            Spearing              San Jose        Bruna
                  Brouwer                Pacheco




WHy the fukc is Jordy Brouwer still at the Club          :angry:   he sucks, and with all this new attacking talent he needs to make way. I think that Saric and Nemeth both have knocks right now, but no reason why Simon or  Eccleston can't start.   Where the hell are Insua and Plessis?
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Postby JC_81 » Tue Sep 02, 2008 5:54 pm

Fo Dne wrote:
john craig wrote:I still think Nemeth is the best young prospect we have.  His movement is excellent, touch not bad and finishing is really good.  He hasn't had as much of a chance in pre-season as some of the others (like Pacheco) because he was away with Hungary.  He's definitely my pick of the bunch.  I'd like to see him loaned out though.  He's one who won't improve by playing more reserve team football imo, he's already proven he's too good for that level.

Plessis is probably the one who is closest to the first team.  Keeps it simple and is the most physically developed of the bunch for his age.  His problem is that he has Gerrard, Mascherano, Alonso and Lucas ahead of him.  With Masch and Lucas at the Olympics though, don't be surprised if he gets into the starting line-up for a few games early season.  At best he will swap places with Lucas in the pecking order this season.

I must be missing something with Darby though, I haven't been overly impressed (admittedly I haven't seen all of the pre-season games).  Spearing, Insua and Pacheco all look like they have a bit more about them.  Spearing could also do with being loaned out this season imo.  Pacheco and Insua need to do some developing physically yet, so I'd keep them here this season.

Plessis is :censored:.

Did I say he was a world beater di.ckhead?

No.

I said I wouldn't be surprised if he got into the starting XI within the first few games of the season.  And guess what?  I was right.
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Postby stmichael » Wed Sep 03, 2008 11:13 am

JoeTerp wrote:WHy the fukc is Jordy Brouwer still at the Club          :angry:   he sucks, and with all this new attacking talent he needs to make way.

Yeah, why is he still here?  :D


I'll tell you what though. The reserves will pi$$ that league again this season. I would gladly pay to watch that week in week out, as it makes a refreshing alternative to the dross being served up by the first team week in week out at the moment. I was very impressed with the way the young lads pass the ball about and move, Weijl was impressive and I also thought Patches and Kelly were good.

Apart from one flap in the second half I also thought the keeper looked very composed and had good hands, those few weeks training with Reina has done him good by the looks of it.

The only real negative was Ayala who was clumsy and was fortunate not to be sent off imo. Anyway, a decent start for the lads.

Highlights:

Brouwer 1-0

http://www.mediafire.com/download.php?fjzmjj6opu4

Pacheco Skill
Pacheco Run and Shot Off Post
Spearing Turn
Weijl Turn and Nutmeg
Weijl Dummy and Cross
Weijl Stepover and Cross, Pacheco Turn then some nice Quick Short Passing

http://www.mediafire.com/download.php?xt0zjfflhxm
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Postby bunglemark2 » Wed Sep 03, 2008 1:56 pm

stmichael wrote:
JoeTerp wrote:WHy the fukc is Jordy Brouwer still at the Club          :angry:   he sucks, and with all this new attacking talent he needs to make way.

Yeah, why is he still here?  :D


I'll tell you what though. The reserves will pi$$ that league again this season. I would gladly pay to watch that week in week out, as it makes a refreshing alternative to the dross being served up by the first team week in week out at the moment. I was very impressed with the way the young lads pass the ball about and move, Weijl was impressive and I also thought Patches and Kelly were good.

Apart from one flap in the second half I also thought the keeper looked very composed and had good hands, those few weeks training with Reina has done him good by the looks of it.

The only real negative was Ayala who was clumsy and was fortunate not to be sent off imo. Anyway, a decent start for the lads.

Highlights:

Brouwer 1-0

http://www.mediafire.com/download.php?fjzmjj6opu4

Pacheco Skill
Pacheco Run and Shot Off Post
Spearing Turn
Weijl Turn and Nutmeg
Weijl Dummy and Cross
Weijl Stepover and Cross, Pacheco Turn then some nice Quick Short Passing

http://www.mediafire.com/download.php?xt0zjfflhxm

Mate, trying to play that in Windows Media Player but I'm getting a black screen. Didn't download it, rather I opened it.
Any ideas ?
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