Liverpool FC Forum

by **115-1073096938** » Sat Jun 19, 2004 1:26 am

glenbuck benetiz inherited a team and a structure that he did not create

He done the same at Tenerife, Valencia and Extremunda...

Two promotions, two league titles and a Uefa Cup.

by **adayinthelife** » Sat Jun 19, 2004 1:30 am

Hey big al this guy Benitez is a winner and he will prove you and any other doubters wrong very quickly imo.

He inherited a very good squad at Valencia no doubt about that but they had not won a league title for over 30 years and he then preceeded to win it twice in 3 years.

IMO the spanish league is the most skillful and Valencia's players have been hugely impressive in comparison to us under houllier.

The main reasons houllier failed was our inability to beat the so called weaker teams home and away due to our play being so predictable.

While defensively Valencia have proved outstanding the last few seasons they also attacked with devastating speed and skill.

Speed and skill which was seriously lacking under houllier and will be adressed very quickly under Benitez and the players will have to adapt or they will be replaced.

If you had watched our game v Valencia at Anfield a few years ago you could not fail to be impressed as they totally outplayed us with short passing of outstanding quality and intelligent movement off the ball.

This guy will be a huge success and so much for him not speaking english as on his 1st day as manager he already speaks better english then ranieri ever managed in his time at chelsea.

by **big al** » Sat Jun 19, 2004 1:32 am

glenbuck, thats a cheap and if i may say totally arogant thing to say. Is this Orwell big brother or Huxleys brave new world. I disagree with you and Have choosen a democratic forum to express my veiws. I say these things now so that later know one will say your a rat deserting a sinking ship. Later if he does well you can smugly gloat and say what a fol big al is. But to question my loyalty to liverpool is not on cheap its an inane judgement based on purely subjective assumptions but I forgive you:p

by **big al** » Sat Jun 19, 2004 1:36 am

adayinthelife fine good points well made but he still phoned McClareon to ask him why English players had team spirit when Spanish players don't. He still phoned a Manc any scouser on any street could have explained it to him.

by **glenbuck patriot** » Sat Jun 19, 2004 1:46 am

big al wrote:glenbuck, thats a cheap and if i may say totally arogant thing to say. Is this Orwell big brother or Huxleys brave new world. I disagree with you and Have choosen a democratic forum to express my veiws. I say these things now so that later know one will say your a rat deserting a sinking ship. Later if he does well you can smugly gloat and say what a fol big al is. But to question my loyalty to liverpool is not on cheap its an inane judgement based on purely subjective assumptions but I forgive you:p

SH1T MAN, take it has it was meant IN GOOD HUMOUR!, I'm not saying anything detremental, NOT QUESTIONING YOUR LOYALTY IN ANY SHAPE OR FORM, just disagreeing with your post, your obviously passionate about your point of view as I am of mine, IMO it's GOOD for the club, appointing a Manager with a proven track record at the highest level!

You may have the Horse you can take it to the Water, BUT TO MAKE IT DRINK IS ANOTHER MATTER!

YES, Benitez MAY have inherited a team, Paisley DID in the 70's, but he took it on to Greater thing's just like Benitez'... Valencia hadn't WON LA LIGA for 30 yrs.... That's a (proven track record to me, I welcome his appointment with open arms!)

by **big al** » Sat Jun 19, 2004 1:57 am

Only Two foreign managers have ever really done well in the premiership, one is genuis Wenger, the other had multi millions to spend. Benetiz is neither, he will fall , simply because football in the UK and Ireland are cultures and worlds apart from Europe.

by **Dalglish** » Sat Jun 19, 2004 2:06 am

Big Al ? Give the man a chance !!!!!!

Benitez has overcome 2 of the richest clubs in his league (Real and Barca) , he's done it ona budget, often having to well his best players to balance the books and his team has outplayed and outfought LFC on 3 occasions.

I realise he may not be everyones first choice but lets give hima chance here hey ?

by **Dalglish** » Sat Jun 19, 2004 2:10 am

He inherited a team that has consistently had to sell many of it's players, so using your theory IF he wins the title in the next couple of seasons you will no doubt be giving the credit to Houllier ? You can't have it both ways

by **begintoend** » Sat Jun 19, 2004 10:08 am

So BigAl, you think that Beni will fail huh.
Than in your opinion : Who will succeed? Who will take over without the credit of what GH built? Who has better credentials than Beni and is willing to come over?
Even if Beni wins EPL next year, you will claim its not his efforts? Houllier won nothing with the current crop. Its about the standards of football. (Probably you'll have to read up 1st). We will bring ourselves closer to the standards needed to challenge Ars and Manc. Something those shortlisted mgrs isn't able to provide.

IMO Beni is the best choice there is. He will prove himself well as he has proven having Valencia.
I repeat : Cuper has a valencia that wins nothing! Nothing means nothing, no matter how good you think the team is!
Beni inherited this team and in his style transformed the Valencia C.F to become champions and Cup winners! That's a good manager for you.

by **JohnBull** » Sat Jun 19, 2004 10:28 am

Big Al I do think that you are a mile away from the mark here.

Benetiz is NO Houllier-Thank God- and out of the available managers I Now firmly believe that he was the best move.
The first team senior players who've spat their dummies out because Curbs never came should never have been asked their opinions in the first place.That was the boards job and despite having the weakest board for years they have made the right descision this time. The Gerrard move has come with the help of his new bessie mate Lampard and the agents.
In many ways it will be good that Benitez will have a clean slate to work with and looking at the man's track record he will build a team his way - in much the same way as Shanks and Paisley-and have a style and pattern that's been sadly missing over the past few years.
There has been far too much player power at Anfield since we lost Paisley and certainly not enough real bosses who were not "mates" with the players.
I've seen enough player hugging over the past 15 years to last me a lifetime- they are there to do a job and they get bloody well paid for doing it.
I cannot think of one player in our first team squad who could progress to being a manager, so why do they think that they can do the job now?

I was one of the O'Neil supporters and still think he would have done a good job with us (aswell as Curbs and possibly Allardice) but we have now got Benitez who has all the traits of the good managers (underachieved as a player but realised he had a brain and learnt the managerial side of the job to achieve success) and I have high hopes for the future.
If Gerrard/Owen or anyone else wants to jump ship then let them and get as much as we can for them. Give Bene the proceeds and our support and we will succeed. He's only been here a couple of weeks and he's broken down the cliques within the coaching staff and seen that the potential within the youth sides is unbelievable.
The future is red and with Benitez.

by **big al** » Sat Jun 19, 2004 12:47 pm

I understand all the opinions expressed here and I know so many people including myself want Benetiz to succeed. However I firmly beleieve that by bringing in a non British manager they have fell into the same trap with Houllier. Houllier had good managerial abilities which I have no doubt will make him successful in management on the continent. But he lacked understanding of the british game and most importantly he lacked passion. Houllier was clam and controlled at a time when people needed him to be explosive and emotional. Teams that acheieve over the odds in British football, do so because they have a team spirit which carries them, even when faced by stroger opposition. That's why the FA Cup is one of the best competitions around. You never know which team will lift their game and defeat gaints. Houllier never played in the English league he never understood the emotions from a footballers point of veiw, Another foreign manager who over analyses everything is for me a mistake, Benetiz worked hard toget to the top in Spain he took a year out to study football tactics in England and Italy. My problem is that there are some things you can't learn from books or by observation, some things have to be learned from experience. Benetiz has phoned Steve McClareon and asked about passion and british team spirit, he dosent understand it because he has never experienced it. The very thing every Liverpool fan complained was lacking in the squad and Houllier, passion born and learned from experience is missing. I understand so many of you will be annoyed by this post but I've made my point for Liverpools sake I hope I'M wrong!

by **JohnBull** » Sat Jun 19, 2004 3:38 pm

I wouldn't put too much importance on the McClaren call. It was reported in the Spanish press as Benetiz praising the "English Passion" rather than asking how do you get it. He was making the point that too many overseas players lack it.
Bene is a totally different proposition to Houllier who had little or no managerial experience (technical director for the national youth teams is NOT managing).

We've had too many managers who wanted to be mates with their squads and ,at the end of the day, bosses cannot be mates.

I could never imagine Shanks,Paisley,Cloughie,Revie,Fergie, Wenger etc etc
ever looking unpon one of their players as a "mate". Benitez seems to be in the same kind of cast.

Just out of interest - out of all those managers I've named there was only 1 who forecast that one of his players would be a great manager of the future.
Cloughie forecast Martin O'Neil.

by **zarababe** » Sat Jun 19, 2004 4:01 pm

So there's no passion in Spain.?? You lot are really having a serious debate. not! ... How many Endglidh manager's do you know who have one the championship and have made a significant if not winning mark in Europe? Curbishley, Allardyce are not in the same bracket as the top European Managers. If we had appointed either of them or even O'Neil.. what would that have said about the Club's ambition? Lets languish in the abyss for another 5 years or so?

In terms of player power.. I agree the last thing any club should start doing is singling out one or two players for special treatment. If Owen wanted Benitez and Gerrard wanted Curbishley (reportedly) is that a point scored, a view heard, therfor whose most important to the club?

Gerrad and Owen are not bigger than the club. Gerrad can be refused a transfer if he puts in a request...his disappointemnt is natural after finishing 4th and 30 points behind the winners. epable.. he put out an important view to the board who have acted. Owen will sign and Gerrard will stay...

Chelski have no history or passion...their being linked with every player in Portugal so keep the faith ....the club will move upwards under the tutledge of Senor Benitez.

by **JohnBull** » Sat Jun 19, 2004 4:19 pm

If it hadn't been for some Belgium safety officer being bribed the Hysel would never have happened as it did and the English dominence over Europe would have continued far longer than any other country has achieved. With previously inexperienced British managers like Shanks and Paisley and Clough and that Villa guy I can never remember etc etc.

By the way Zarab overseas players in Spain are not Spanish,
just as overseas players in England aren't English. I think he meant "overseas" where ever they're playing.

by **zarababe** » Sat Jun 19, 2004 4:29 pm

Oh and I suppose the fighting Englsih fans were bribed to have a punch-up.. too.. it wasn't their fault they wanted to kick-******?

I didn't realise we were going that far back...! That really is grappling at straws now!

By the way the Manc's did win the Champions League? Chelski didn't do to bad neither...so we're not really that far behind .. in real terms that is!

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