Liverpool FC Forum

The big picture is the league table, PLUS
- the cup runs
- the academy
- the commercial side of the team
- the squad

The totality is all this....

Our performance in the league may be depressing, but it does not invalidate all other points. The club is indeed moving forward.

Even the much maligned txfers, look more than likely to come good in the end.

A year ago Barry and Lescott were being used as an example of City wasting money; same with Dzeko, but see where they are now...

Players cannot always be judged on the basis of instant impact...

sgs wrote:The big picture is the league table, PLUS
Our performance in the league may be depressing, but it does not invalidate all other points. The club is indeed moving forward.

League performance is the most accurate view of how good the squad is. League performance also gives access to the hugely important Champions League. If we want to be a top club we really need to get back into the Champions league.

Cups are ofcourse nice but its not a reflection of how good the team is. If it was we would not have played against Cardiff in the final.

mart wrote:

sgs wrote:The big picture is the league table, PLUS
Our performance in the league may be depressing, but it does not invalidate all other points. The club is indeed moving forward.

League performance is the most accurate view of how good the squad is. League performance also gives access to the hugely important Champions League. If we want to be a top club we really need to get back into the Champions league.

Cups are ofcourse nice but its not a reflection of how good the team is. If it was we would not have played against Cardiff in the final.

cups are still difficult to win though, look at man city, for all their wealth and the money they`ve spent there`s a decent chance that they wont win anything this season. if we manage to win the league cup and the f.a cup (long way to go i know) it will be a tremendous achievement.
turning your nose up at trophies is the height of arrogance, there are plenty of clubs that havent won anything in their entire existance stretching back over a 100 years or more.

ycsatbjywtbiastkamb wrote:

mart wrote:

sgs wrote:The big picture is the league table, PLUS
Our performance in the league may be depressing, but it does not invalidate all other points. The club is indeed moving forward.

League performance is the most accurate view of how good the squad is. League performance also gives access to the hugely important Champions League. If we want to be a top club we really need to get back into the Champions league.

Cups are ofcourse nice but its not a reflection of how good the team is. If it was we would not have played against Cardiff in the final.

cups are still difficult to win though, look at man city, for all their wealth and the money they`ve spent there`s a decent chance that they wont win anything this season. if we manage to win the league cup and the f.a cup (long way to go i know) it will be a tremendous achievement.
turning your nose up at trophies is the height of arrogance, there are plenty of clubs that havent won anything in their entire existance stretching back over a 100 years or more.

If we win the FA Cup, which I have a strong feeling we will, I'd happily trade both cups for a 4th spot in the league and I guess the owners would as well. The cups are a nice bonus but it's all about the league position and getting into champions league where the big bucks are. This is maybe not true to you but it sure as hell is to the players and more importantly the owners.

heimdall wrote:

If we win the FA Cup, which I have a strong feeling we will, I'd happily trade both cups for a 4th spot in the league and I guess the owners would as well. The cups are a nice bonus but it's all about the league position and getting into champions league where the big bucks are. This is maybe not true to you but it sure as hell is to the players and more importantly the owners.

Why would anyone trade two domestic cups for a fourth place? Its a daft hypothetical argument.
Two trophies in a season would be magnificent, so why try to downgrade and undermine it by saying that simply qualifying for the CL would be better?
Its a bit disrespectful and silly to me

put it another way, if Arsenal finish 4th, would they swap their 4th place for 2 domestic cups?  I highly doubt it. In fact, Wenger said as much a couple of seasons ago

7_Kewell wrote:put it another way, if Arsenal finish 4th, would they swap their 4th place for 2 domestic cups?  I highly doubt it. In fact, Wenger said as much a couple of seasons ago

That's why they have won Sh*t in years. I'm not sure their fans approve it either.

7_Kewell wrote:put it another way, if Arsenal finish 4th, would they swap their 4th place for 2 domestic cups?  I highly doubt it. In fact, Wenger said as much a couple of seasons ago

What do you think their fans or players would say ? They have not won anything for 7 years !

heimdall wrote:If we win the FA Cup, which I have a strong feeling we will, I'd happily trade both cups for a 4th spot in the league and I guess the owners would as well. The cups are a nice bonus but it's all about the league position and getting into champions league where the big bucks are. This is maybe not true to you but it sure as hell is to the players and more importantly the owners.

of course the owners want champions league footy, they bought the club to make money, i doubt if they could name a single liverpool player 5 years ago never mind know anything about the history of the club, it wouldnt even surprise me if they`d never heard of the club 5 years ago.
they arent footy fans they are business people, they want the club to be where the money is.
for me though i grew up in an era where winning trophies was what this club existed for, i understand that you need to be in the CL to attract the top players but even so i`d take winning the league cup and f.a cup over finishing 4th any day.
they are both major trophies that go onto our honours list, a 4th place finish doesnt, a 100 years of 4th place finishes isnt anything to be proud about but a 100 years of winning trophies is.

7_Kewell wrote:put it another way, if Arsenal finish 4th, would they swap their 4th place for 2 domestic cups?  I highly doubt it. In fact, Wenger said as much a couple of seasons ago

Wenger gets royally shafted every year in the CL so I wouldnt take much notice of him.
I know an arsenal fan friend of mine who says he would rather win a cup final than come 4th

7_Kewell wrote:put it another way, if Arsenal finish 4th, would they swap their 4th place for 2 domestic cups?  I highly doubt it. In fact, Wenger said as much a couple of seasons ago

what if we offered them 2 domestic cups and charlie adam?

andy_g wrote:

7_Kewell wrote:put it another way, if Arsenal finish 4th, would they swap their 4th place for 2 domestic cups?  I highly doubt it. In fact, Wenger said as much a couple of seasons ago

what if we offered them 2 domestic cups and charlie adam?

2 domestic cups, charlie adam and a date with Kerry?

Thommo's perm wrote:

heimdall wrote:

If we win the FA Cup, which I have a strong feeling we will, I'd happily trade both cups for a 4th spot in the league and I guess the owners would as well. The cups are a nice bonus but it's all about the league position and getting into champions league where the big bucks are. This is maybe not true to you but it sure as hell is to the players and more importantly the owners.

Why would anyone trade two domestic cups for a fourth place? Its a daft hypothetical argument.
Two trophies in a season would be magnificent, so why try to downgrade and undermine it by saying that simply qualifying for the CL would be better?
Its a bit disrespectful and silly to me

4th is a lot better than two cups that no one rates anymore reasons...
1. You get in the champions league.
2. You have a chance of winning the european cup.
3. You attract better signings in the summer from europe who want CL football.
4. It what the other big clubs only aim for. These days you only get judged on League and CL success.
5. The club will earn more cash.
6. It will stop a top 4 club manager getting the sack if they dont comfortably get 4th spot as they should be doing, being the most succesful club in the. EPL which should be a minimum requirement at LFC, no matter who is in charge.

Its a no brainer

spiceboys2014 wrote:

Thommo's perm wrote:

heimdall wrote:

If we win the FA Cup, which I have a strong feeling we will, I'd happily trade both cups for a 4th spot in the league and I guess the owners would as well. The cups are a nice bonus but it's all about the league position and getting into champions league where the big bucks are. This is maybe not true to you but it sure as hell is to the players and more importantly the owners.

Why would anyone trade two domestic cups for a fourth place? Its a daft hypothetical argument.
Two trophies in a season would be magnificent, so why try to downgrade and undermine it by saying that simply qualifying for the CL would be better?
Its a bit disrespectful and silly to me

4th is a lot better than two cups that no one rates anymore reasons...
1. You get in the champions league.
2. You have a chance of winning the european cup.
3. You attract better signings in the summer from europe who want CL football.
4. It what the other big clubs only aim for. These days you only get judged on League and CL success.
5. The club will earn more cash.
6. It will stop a top 4 club manager getting the sack if they dont comfortably get 4th spot as they should be doing, being the most succesful club in the. EPL which should be a minimum requirement at LFC, no matter who is in charge.

Its a no brainer

So you would trade two cup final wins at wembley, another two trophies at a club which exists to win trophies, for a fourth spot in the league?
Seriously?

I can't stop wondering how did some of you miserable fools ever became football fans. It's like winning titles doesn't make you happy.