Liverpool FC Forum

by **C-R** » Sat Sep 10, 2011 6:57 pm

@ ACE - excellent post, couldnt have put it better, if only u had kennys ear

by **Thommo's perm** » Sat Sep 10, 2011 7:52 pm

He looks like a nervous school kid being asked to stand up and read in front of the class
He needs to grow a pair and stop being such a fanny

by **red till i die!!** » Sat Sep 10, 2011 8:01 pm

aCe' wrote:If he cant step it up then he needs to be dropped. Simple as that for me. Hes had 20 good minutes or so in the 5 games hes played so far and its simply not good enough imo. We have lost Meireles mainly because of him imo, and players like Maxi and Spearing who have both done a good job when called into the side are finding their opportunities very limited while he gets a free pass into the starting 11.

For me, I think the only reason he makes the starting 11 is his price tag. He offers very little at either end, and the amount of times he loses the ball or wastes possession (given the fact that he rarely attempts ambitious passes) is simply staggering. If we dropped Carroll (which was a bold move by Kenny and one that needed to be done) then surely Henderson should be on the bench from here on in until he can prove his worth...

agree with most of that but you cannot blame him for the departure of merieles.
dalglish has to put his hand up over that one.
he dumped his togs when 1 on 1 there today and one thing im sure of is that merieles wouldnt have.
hendo is one for the future and merieles was the one for now and kk made a mistake letting him go.

by **tubby** » Sat Sep 10, 2011 8:07 pm

Funny so many should come here and moan about him when against Bolton he had a stormer. Typical fickle folk on here.

by **Thommo's perm** » Sat Sep 10, 2011 8:09 pm

tubby wrote:Funny so many should come here and moan about him when against Bolton he had a stormer. Typical fickle folk on here.

Im talking in general and not about today
His whole demeanour and attitude is too meek for me
He is a good player with potential to be great if he mans up a bit.

by **aCe'** » Sat Sep 10, 2011 8:11 pm

red till i die!! wrote:
aCe' wrote:If he cant step it up then he needs to be dropped. Simple as that for me. Hes had 20 good minutes or so in the 5 games hes played so far and its simply not good enough imo. We have lost Meireles mainly because of him imo, and players like Maxi and Spearing who have both done a good job when called into the side are finding their opportunities very limited while he gets a free pass into the starting 11.

For me, I think the only reason he makes the starting 11 is his price tag. He offers very little at either end, and the amount of times he loses the ball or wastes possession (given the fact that he rarely attempts ambitious passes) is simply staggering. If we dropped Carroll (which was a bold move by Kenny and one that needed to be done) then surely Henderson should be on the bench from here on in until he can prove his worth...

agree with most of that but you cannot blame him for the departure of merieles.
dalglish has to put his hand up over that one.
he dumped his togs when 1 on 1 there today and one thing im sure of is that merieles wouldnt have.
hendo is one for the future and merieles was the one for now and kk made a mistake letting him go.

Obviously I didnt mean he was to blame for Meireles leaving, but his signing and Kenny's insistence on starting him regardless of his abilities are what (imo) led to Meireles deciding he'd be better off at Chelsea. Kenny surely takes responsibility (perhaps blame might be harsh since the outcomes are yet to be determined) for both decisions but I have to say I dont agree with either.

by **tubby** » Sat Sep 10, 2011 8:17 pm

Thommo's perm wrote:
tubby wrote:Funny so many should come here and moan about him when against Bolton he had a stormer. Typical fickle folk on here.

Im talking in general and not about today
His whole demeanour and attitude is too meek for me
He is a good player with potential to be great if he mans up a bit.

Too early yet imo to be making those sort of assumptions, even general ones. Common sense suggests he should be given at least a season but judging from comments here even that might be a stretch. The least people could give him till was xmas before making him the new scapegoat.

by **metalhead** » Sat Sep 10, 2011 8:23 pm

He just needs some self confidence in himself that he can make it in top level IMO

by **aCe'** » Sat Sep 10, 2011 8:32 pm

tubby wrote:
Thommo's perm wrote:
tubby wrote:Funny so many should come here and moan about him when against Bolton he had a stormer. Typical fickle folk on here.

Im talking in general and not about today
His whole demeanour and attitude is too meek for me
He is a good player with potential to be great if he mans up a bit.

Too early yet imo to be making those sort of assumptions, even general ones. Common sense suggests he should be given at least a season but judging from comments here even that might be a stretch. The least people could give him till was xmas before making him the new scapegoat.

Yea, brilliant idea... Lets put Flanagan, Robinson and Shelvey in there as well and give them a season to see how it goes as well...

If a player isnt performing they dont deserve to be in the starting 11. Sure they might need time to adapt and get used to the tactics and style of play but theres a place and time for that (training, cup games, easy games..etc) . He should have been eased into the side especially given his age and lack of experience. Atm, whatever potential he has hes not showing, and performances like the ones hes put out arent doing him OR THE TEAM any favors.

by **Thommo's perm** » Sat Sep 10, 2011 8:37 pm

tubby wrote:
Thommo's perm wrote:
tubby wrote:Funny so many should come here and moan about him when against Bolton he had a stormer. Typical fickle folk on here.

Im talking in general and not about today
His whole demeanour and attitude is too meek for me
He is a good player with potential to be great if he mans up a bit.

Too early yet imo to be making those sort of assumptions, even general ones. Common sense suggests he should be given at least a season but judging from comments here even that might be a stretch. The least people could give him till was xmas before making him the new scapegoat.

Not too early at all. I have seen the lad talking and playing and I feel he should be more cocky and confident and less timid. I am certain that he can become a hell of a player but he must have more self-belief.
And I am not trying to make him the new scapegoat, I am just commenting on my observations

by **tubby** » Sat Sep 10, 2011 11:14 pm

aCe' wrote:
tubby wrote:
Thommo's perm wrote:
tubby wrote:Funny so many should come here and moan about him when against Bolton he had a stormer. Typical fickle folk on here.

Im talking in general and not about today
His whole demeanour and attitude is too meek for me
He is a good player with potential to be great if he mans up a bit.

Too early yet imo to be making those sort of assumptions, even general ones. Common sense suggests he should be given at least a season but judging from comments here even that might be a stretch. The least people could give him till was xmas before making him the new scapegoat.

Yea, brilliant idea... Lets put Flanagan, Robinson and Shelvey in there as well and give them a season to see how it goes as well...

If a player isnt performing they dont deserve to be in the starting 11. Sure they might need time to adapt and get used to the tactics and style of play but theres a place and time for that (training, cup games, easy games..etc) . He should have been eased into the side especially given his age and lack of experience. Atm, whatever potential he has hes not showing, and performances like the ones hes put out arent doing him OR THE TEAM any favors.

We didn't spend 20mil on Flanno, Robinson or Shelvely put together. Anyway he looked to be alright against Bolton. People forget he has gone from Sunderland to Liverpool.

No your right. Let's just bench him now and crush any confidence he had. We are sure to get our 20mil worth then. Or maybe it's so you can brag we have a 20mil player on our bench? I get it now.

Besides with Stevie coming back Kenny may well put Stevie out on the right so he doens't have to bench Adam as well.

by **stmichael** » Sat Sep 10, 2011 11:18 pm

tubby wrote:Besides with Stevie coming back Kenny may well put Stevie out on the right so he doens't have to bench Adam as well.

That's what's I'd do but there isn't a hope in hell of that happening.

by **aCe'** » Sun Sep 11, 2011 6:50 am

tubby wrote:We didn't spend 20mil on Flanno, Robinson or Shelvely

Atm, hes not performing anywhere near the level needed at a club like ours. 20mill or 50mill it shouldnt matter... For what its worth, i think we got the got the valuation wrong and Kenny is just making matters worse by persisting with the kid when we have decent options on the bench.

The whole benching him would crush his confidence theory is nonsense imo. Young players who arent ready should never be thrown in the deep end to learn faster. Does the player no favors and more importantly it does the team no favors. The Lucas situation in his first season or so starting is a prime example of that. He was started despite being obviously nowhere near the quality needed, and the team paid for it by massively struggling through the middle, while the players development took a significant blow with fans and pundits turning against him.

by **redtrader74** » Sun Sep 11, 2011 7:59 am

He is playing with very little confidence, which was made clear by the way he took his chance yesterday at Stoke. The problem is does Kenny have the balls to bench both him and Carrol? Because the media, and they do affect decisions, will have a field day, '£55m flops'. this is when prices do matter btw.

At the moment we do not have fit replacements for him, and because of this Henderson has been played more than he should have, the guy is young and ideally would have been introduced bit by bit into the team. The sooner Johnson and more importantly Gerrard are back the easier it will be for Kenny to drop him.

by **aCe'** » Sun Sep 11, 2011 8:26 am

redtrader74 wrote:He is playing with very little confidence, which was made clear by the way he took his chance yesterday at Stoke. The problem is does Kenny have the balls to bench both him and Carrol? Because the media, and they do affect decisions, will have a field day, '£55m flops'. this is when prices do matter btw.

At the moment we do not have fit replacements for him, and because of this Henderson has been played more than he should have, the guy is young and ideally would have been introduced bit by bit into the team. The sooner Johnson and more importantly Gerrard are back the easier it will be for Kenny to drop him.

To be honest Im not buying into the whole we dont have fit replacements talk.

Henderson has been playing an advanced midfield role and we have/had quite a few who could play the same position yet we decided to stick with him. Meireles, Aquilani, Cole, Maxi, and even Kuyt, Downing and Bellamy would all have been better options at the positions hes played. Big gamble that hasnt quite paid off yet relying on him (more so than Adam, Carroll and Downing) to step it up from day 1. Makes the Meireles and Aquilani sales all that much worse imo given the timing.

The return of Gerrard for me will definitely mean the end of Henderson down the middle and will hopefully give our central midfield a much needed boost.

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