Liverpool FC Forum

by **bigmick** » Sat Oct 09, 2010 12:14 pm

When the song about the "best midfield in the world" was being sung, was the midfield we ended up with better or worse than that one?

by **dawson99** » Sat Oct 09, 2010 12:14 pm

bigmick wrote:I ask the question again, is the squad I've written down a good return after six seasons? Dispute my read on players by all means, tell me that you actually think we had top players in all positions if you like, even tell me that after six seasons the team had constantly improved and the one which Rafa had finished up with was his best squad if you want, I'm all ears.

The quality of the squad is not important, unless its Roy buying.. the only thing important is net spend

by **Ben Patrick** » Sat Oct 09, 2010 12:14 pm

Zara, why are we comparing ourselves to anyone else ?

To suit your excuses ?
What do Roys signings have to do with how Rafa shaped the squad before him ?

Like mick said, he had years. He had money.
He changed the whole squad.

The squad is to be blunt - sh!te.

But it's not his fault :laugh:

by **zarababe** » Sat Oct 09, 2010 12:18 pm

bigmick wrote:I can't beleive even his disciples are still banging on about Benitez in the transfer market. His last two major signings cost 40 million quid and were Robbie Keane and Alberto Aquilani.

Next.

Precisely.. you get what ya pay for.. where's Kean now.. umm celtic, spurs or is it..

we paid, what for us, was top notch money .. for players who couldn't cut it, that was the strength of our pound.

so ... if we bought Villa for £40m.. now that would have been different.. but would the board sanction that.. :lookaround

and wouldn't you have said,.. but we need a left back, right-sided midfielder etc etc .. so that's what he did with his lot !

As a 'disciple' of Liverpool Football Club.. I have said Benitez needed to leave.. however his successor is struggling and many Liverpool Supporters predicted that.

Any how Mick I'm with you.. I think this team is good enuff to be top 4 no?

So what's goin on then ?

by **bigmick** » Sat Oct 09, 2010 12:45 pm

zarababe wrote:Any how Mick I'm with you.. I think this team is good enuff to be top 4 no?

So what's goin on then ?

Providing we don't get too many injuries, the team is good enough to challenge for the top four IMHO. Obviously a serious injury to either Gerrard or Torres would leave us in desperate trouble as we don't have any cover, but if those two play most of the time we are in the top five or six in terms of team I guess.

If we don't achieve that, then at the end of the season you ask questions of the manager. If he doesn't manage to convince you that better things are coming up from the team inthe future, you get rid. Simple really, no point in denying the sky is blue after all.

by **Ciggy** » Sat Oct 09, 2010 12:53 pm

zarababe wrote:Yes.. even Torres was bought through a bank loan

Isn't it interesting... we are on the verge of the biggest judgement about our club and there is a discussion on here 'still' about what Benitez did.

Given the frustrating antics of the current 'custodians' .. can people honestly not imagine what it must be like to work with these- when even someone like Broughton (upright and proper - massive reputation) has had to come out 'guns blazing' in 'public' (very unlike the Liverpool way - probably not 'his' way either) because of the lies and deceit by these 'custodians'..

I fully accept Rafa had to go.. because he's own sanity had been tested by these, frustrating his efforts and making him sell to buy etc, is that how we want our great club to operate.. well that's how it has been.

Roy Hodgson was appointed by these 'custodians', again a mesure of their class and 'ambition' for the club.. so I don't blame Roy, what he thought was the chance of a life-time and lets face it, any owner with an ounce of 'ambition' would not have appointed him, so lets not delude our selves, that the boardroom debacles and financial constraints did not affect Benitez, that for every £25m + player that Man Utd and Chelsea bought and strenghthened their hands, we got 'what we got' for what we could afford to 'raise' ..

That's the current market for club's like us, but with the financial clout unlike ours... £80m Ronaldo, £30m Alonso, £25m Masch, £40m Villa, £25m D Silva, £30m Tevez......

Wake-up !

Good post girl agree 100% but you and I are wasting our time, with the rafa haters Roy lovers, p!ssing me off big time, the clubs in its worst state ever and they still want to feckin argue about Rafa.

They call us a disgrace for not behaving in the liverpool way People in glass houses shouldnt throw stones an all that.

The reason they are up Roys hole is because they hounded rafa out and wont admit they are wrong.

Anyway Im going out Ive just had the worst week of my life worrying about my club, whilst you gobsh!tes just want to give Rafa dogs abuse.

YOU REAP WHAT YOU SOW, AND YOU CAN STICK ROY UP YER @RSES YOU GOT WHAT YOU WANT DEAL WITH IT !!!

by **dawson99** » Sat Oct 09, 2010 12:55 pm

great post from a fan, stick roy up yer ar$e.. lovely...

I remember people saying that about Wafa last season were crucified.

Now you're upset with us for having a go at the ex manager.. f*cking laughable as always

by **Ben Patrick** » Sat Oct 09, 2010 1:10 pm

The thing is ciggy, i dont hate Rafa or love Roy.

You clearly cant get over Rafa going and wont back Roy that's the difference.

You have ignored my questions about the state of our squad and made excuses about the owners and Zara has about what united and Chelsea have spent.
While i agree we cant compete with what others spend, does that mean that we shouldnt get the best out of what we have ?
Like i have said previously 95% of football clubs are on a tight budget and cant just but who they want. Do they all go backwards ?
Or do some managers make the most of what they have got ?
I am in agreement about Hodgson at this moment in time he is struggling big time and we are playing terribly.
I am concerned.
I hope he changes tactics and turns it around but if he doesnt then he needs moving on.
That's not me being OTT, all i care about is what;s best for the club.
Like you do, i know that.

I just dont get why everyone is so obsessed with Rafa.
I think he needed to go.
Roy coming in might not have been the right move, i will agree with that. But cross my fingers that he proves everyone wrong.

by **mart** » Sat Oct 09, 2010 1:13 pm

dawson99 wrote:Zara, you do understand that with football its about quality, not quantity? You have made my point, he was spending on average 2.9m per player, youd never get decent stuff with that

cheers for the help

Since we have a very thin squad we obviously lack in the quantity department as well. We are very vulnerable to injuries, especially on Torres. Thanks for proving his point yet again.

by **Thommo's perm** » Sat Oct 09, 2010 1:35 pm

Ben Patrick wrote:The thing is ciggy, i dont hate Rafa or love Roy.

You clearly cant get over Rafa going and wont back Roy that's the difference.

You have ignored my questions about the state of our squad and made excuses about the owners and Zara has about what united and Chelsea have spent.
While i agree we cant compete with what others spend, does that mean that we shouldnt get the best out of what we have ?
Like i have said previously 95% of football clubs are on a tight budget and cant just but who they want. Do they all go backwards ?
Or do some managers make the most of what they have got ?
I am in agreement about Hodgson at this moment in time he is struggling big time and we are playing terribly.
I am concerned.
I hope he changes tactics and turns it around but if he doesnt then he needs moving on.
That's not me being OTT, all i care about is what;s best for the club.
Like you do, i know that.

I just dont get why everyone is so obsessed with Rafa.
I think he needed to go.
Roy coming in might not have been the right move, i will agree with that. But cross my fingers that he proves everyone wrong.

You have hit the nail on he head.
People are obsessed. Obsessed with Benitez, his spend, his sqad, his sacking, his legacy. They come from the point of view that hes a victim and that Roy isnt good enough to tie his laces. Even though he won nothing since a penalty shoot out for the fa cup against mighty west ham in 2006. Nilch, nothing, zero.
Oh yes it was the owners. They stifled him, squoze all the life and ambition out of him to the point where he had just given up. Really? How sh'it does that make him then that in the two seasons before he went he spent millions and still couldnt win anything?
Enter Roy. The managers manager. Not outspoken or controversial. Not confrontational or arrogant. Not foreign and not inheriting the spine of a winning team. Obviously not up to the job. Cue the disrespect and outrageous behaviour of the people who care most about the state were in. Those indignant, pi'ssed off, have a right to express my opinion, moaning, boring, repetative, moral high ground Rafapologists who say theyre speaking on behalf of concerned supporters. The irony is overwhelming. I am not a Roy lover but I respect his knowledge and experience. I dont know how things will turn out. Its been said if hes not up to he job then get rid. I agree. But I have no intention of keeping quiet while those who are shouting the loudest are chatting sh'ite.
Roy is our manager. For now. When he has had a "reasonable" length of time to sort the problems out I will either be for him or against him.
I will give him a chance, because thas the type of Red I am

by **maypaxvobiscum** » Sat Oct 09, 2010 1:47 pm

i think there are some posters who needs a little lesson in economics. its not my field, but im clearly more clued up then some here. so..................

the issue here is net spend. net spend, IMO is a farce. it a a flawed defense for the simple reason that it hides the fact that there was no or minimal profit made. when you sell a player, the idea behind it is to make a profit which can be used to buy a better player or to contribute to the club's funds.

i'll give you an example. the sale of Stephen Warnock for 2.5million. and the purchase of Dossena for 7million. it is obvious which defender is better. hence, by paying 3 times more for a player who is worth lesser today and was not an improvement, it is bad business. and how many times have we seen players leaving with their replacements far less capable?

hence, it goes on and on which forces the club to buy players from free transfers such as Voronin, Zenden and Degen. if the money was used more wisely initially, the mentioned players would never had had the chance to play for Liverpool.

another purchase to note is Diego, bought for 3million to serve as a back up GK. im pretty sure there were alternative options who had played in the english league for years and were available on free.

by **maypaxvobiscum** » Sat Oct 09, 2010 1:50 pm

Ben Patrick wrote:I have asked both Zara and ciggy a question.

Has Rafa created/shaped a good squad ?

Do me a favour and dont say he has brought in this or that and net spend is this or that.

Just a simple answer.

no. i strongly feel that there were many players who were sold with their replacements being far less capable.

by **maypaxvobiscum** » Sat Oct 09, 2010 1:58 pm

bigmick wrote:The squad.

We've got a good goalkeeper, no question.

We haven't got a really top class centre half. The best we had during Rafa's six years was one who was left for him. The second best ditto, and we moved him on to Germany.

We have a good right back IMHO.

We didn't have a good left back when Rafa left.

We did have two good central midfielders when Rafa left. One of them was here when he arrived, and the other couldn't wait to feck off. The back up was/is rubbish.

We did have a decent left midfielder, but he had fallen out with the manager and the club and had to be flogged off.

We have a serviceable right midfielder who was actually bought as a striker but failed there. No back up to speak off.

We have one top class striker and extremely questionable back up.

In terms of youngsters coming through, we are extremely thin on the ground.

A good return after six years? Lets be serious here.

we had Warnock, Bellamy, Sissoko. 3 players who should've never been allowed to leave.

by **Thommo's perm** » Sat Oct 09, 2010 2:04 pm

maypaxvobiscum wrote:
bigmick wrote:The squad.

We've got a good goalkeeper, no question.

We haven't got a really top class centre half. The best we had during Rafa's six years was one who was left for him. The second best ditto, and we moved him on to Germany.

We have a good right back IMHO.

We didn't have a good left back when Rafa left.

We did have two good central midfielders when Rafa left. One of them was here when he arrived, and the other couldn't wait to feck off. The back up was/is rubbish.

We did have a decent left midfielder, but he had fallen out with the manager and the club and had to be flogged off.

We have a serviceable right midfielder who was actually bought as a striker but failed there. No back up to speak off.

We have one top class striker and extremely questionable back up.

In terms of youngsters coming through, we are extremely thin on the ground.

A good return after six years? Lets be serious here.

we had Warnock, Bellamy, Sissoko. 3 players who should've never been allowed to leave.

Crouch, Murphy and of course Alonso

by **Igor Zidane** » Sat Oct 09, 2010 2:32 pm

Some

being spouted on here as usual . Re-writers of history out in force i see . :laugh:

You couldn't make it up . For six season's we were a mid table side . Did absolutley feck all , not a thing , mid table mediocrity . How on gods earth did the waiter last so long .

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So after a few months with roy, was sacking rafa - The right thing to do?

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