Liverpool FC Forum

by **Benny The Noon** » Tue Jun 29, 2010 6:41 am

Kevin Keegan :laugh:

by **Igor Zidane** » Tue Jun 29, 2010 8:32 am

I'm a bit lost with this thread to be honest .

Can i ask , what people want from there manager , players , owners and fans for next season ?
After you've gave your answer , can you then have honset think and say what you expect ?

Do you think it is fair to expect any manager to come in and improve on last season with the tools he will have at hand ? If you are willing to accept that 7th or there abouts will be a good season for the new manager , why all of a sudden is mediocrety ok ,when it wasn't last season ?

From a purley footballing point of view (if Roy gets the job ) can you see us playing expansive attacking football , with the tools he'll have remember ? or do you think that there's a good chance that ROY will revert to type ,the type of footy his teams have produced for 30 years . Safety first at the back (fair enough ) flood the midfield and one up front . When we are defending it will be a rigid 10 men behind the ball and when we are attacking it will be a rigid one man upfront with midfield supporting if they can . THAT'S AT HOME BY THE WAY as for away games well his record speaks for itself .

If your happy to accept these things then ROY is your man and in purley footballing terms we'll come back to this in 6 months time and see what you think then . Last season was a :censored:

season for all concerned no doubt about it ,but like i said last season when people wanted rid of the manager before everything else . You better get used to it . I'm honestly not looking forward that much to the football we'll see next year , my expectations are realistic and unfortunately i can't see us improving atall . So there you go last season the manger was sacked because we finished 7th , this season it will be seen as a good season for the new manager to finish 7th . Mad that innit ?

by **Ciggy** » Tue Jun 29, 2010 8:39 am

Igor Zidane wrote:I'm a bit lost with this thread to be honest .

Can i ask , what people want from there manager , players , owners and fans for next season ?
After you've gave your answer , can you then have honset think and say what you expect ?

Do you think it is fair to expect any manager to come in and improve on last season with the tools he will have at hand ? If you are willing to accept that 7th or there abouts will be a good season for the new manager , why all of a sudden is mediocrety ok ,when it wasn't last season ?

From a purley footballing point of view (if Roy gets the job ) can you see us playing expansive attacking football , with the tools he'll have remember ? or do you think that there's a good chance that ROY will revert to type ,the type of footy his teams have produced for 30 years . Safety first at the back (fair enough ) flood the midfield and one up front . When we are defending it will be a rigid 10 men behind the ball and when we are attacking it will be a rigid one man upfront with midfield supporting if they can . THAT'S AT HOME BY THE WAY as for away games well his record speaks for itself .

If your happy to accept these things then ROY is your man and in purley footballing terms we'll come back to this in 6 months time and see what you think then . Last season was a season for all concerned no doubt about it ,but like i said last season when people wanted rid of the manager before everything else . You better get used to it . I'm honestly not looking forward that much to the football we'll see next year , my expectations are realistic and unfortunately i can't see us improving atall . So there you go last season the manger was sacked because we finished 7th , this season it will be seen as a good season for the new manager to finish 7th . Mad that innit ?

Best post in this topic and I agree with every single word of it. And if they thought Rafa was defensive minded they have seen nothing yet as to what we will witness under Roy !!!

by **Redman in wales** » Tue Jun 29, 2010 9:21 am

Igor Zidane wrote:I'm a bit lost with this thread to be honest .

Can i ask , what people want from there manager , players , owners and fans for next season ?
After you've gave your answer , can you then have honset think and say what you expect ?

Do you think it is fair to expect any manager to come in and improve on last season with the tools he will have at hand ? If you are willing to accept that 7th or there abouts will be a good season for the new manager , why all of a sudden is mediocrety ok ,when it wasn't last season ?

From a purley footballing point of view (if Roy gets the job ) can you see us playing expansive attacking football , with the tools he'll have remember ? or do you think that there's a good chance that ROY will revert to type ,the type of footy his teams have produced for 30 years . Safety first at the back (fair enough ) flood the midfield and one up front . When we are defending it will be a rigid 10 men behind the ball and when we are attacking it will be a rigid one man upfront with midfield supporting if they can . THAT'S AT HOME BY THE WAY as for away games well his record speaks for itself .

If your happy to accept these things then ROY is your man and in purley footballing terms we'll come back to this in 6 months time and see what you think then . Last season was a season for all concerned no doubt about it ,but like i said last season when people wanted rid of the manager before everything else . You better get used to it . I'm honestly not looking forward that much to the football we'll see next year , my expectations are realistic and unfortunately i can't see us improving atall . So there you go last season the manger was sacked because we finished 7th , this season it will be seen as a good season for the new manager to finish 7th . Mad that innit ?

I’ll give it a go….

Can i ask , what people want from there manager , players , owners and fans for next season ?
After you've gave your answer , can you then have honset think and say what you expect ?

From my manager I want him to build up a good squad as finances will allow. Identify the problem areas and solve them first. We have lying owners, we know that. Time and time again they break their promises. So on that basis, if one position needs filling more than any other, sign someone for that position first, and don’t rely on the owners saying that there is more money for other signings, as they have a history of lying. Then if there is more, go for the 2nd position most in need of new blood. Etc etc.

Once the manager has his squad, he should be able to motivate players and get the best out of them in their respective positions. He will need the fight balance of skill and hard work in the team, and set up a team that is hard to beat and has attacking purpose every time it gets the ball.

From the players – I want the to play for the liverbird that sits on the left hand side of their chest. If their head every starts to drop, they need to stop for a second, look at that badge, look at the Kop, listen to the fans and play their heart out.

The oweners – well easy one they just need to :censored:

off.

Next season – Really does depend on the playing personell we have here (what happens to gerrard, torres etc) – If all still here (except for mash as I think he was going anyway) – I would expect to improve on 7th, top 4 would be a great season for us next year as we have no money to invest in the squad like the other teams do.

As for the fans – whoever the manager is, he should be backed by the fans. One thing I would like from the fans is to be more vocal at matches. I have to admit that living down in London, I cant get to as many games as I would have liked, but the 3 or 4 I do go to per season, I think (to me) it seems quieter than a couple of years ago (and that was quieter than a couple of years before that)

Do you think it is fair to expect any manager to come in and improve on last season with the tools he will have at hand ? If you are willing to accept that 7th or there abouts will be a good season for the new manager , why all of a sudden is mediocrety ok ,when it wasn't last season ?

Firstly – we don’t know what tools he will have. Only time will tell. So its all just speculation, mostly based on previous years. If he can keep the same squad and/or add to it than 7th is not good enough, mediocrity is not OK. Top 4 would be a good season. If on the other hand key members of the squad leave (for whatever reason) and we don’t get any money to re-invest then 7th would seem okay simply because he will have matched last seasons efforts with less “tools” at his disposal.

From a purley footballing point of view (if Roy gets the job ) can you see us playing expansive attacking football , with the tools he'll have remember ? or do you think that there's a good chance that ROY will revert to type ,the type of footy his teams have produced for 30 years . Safety first at the back (fair enough ) flood the midfield and one up front . When we are defending it will be a rigid 10 men behind the ball and when we are attacking it will be a rigid one man upfront with midfield supporting if they can . THAT'S AT HOME BY THE WAY as for away games well his record speaks for itself .

Purely from a footballing view – if Roy gets the job, with Gerrard and Torres, Babel and Kuyt etc at his disposal, I think we’ll play better football than we did against Wolves, Bolton, Sunderland, Fulham, Blakcburn, Stoke, and Wigan last season. WITH THE TOOLS AT HIS DISPOSAL he wont play the same way he does when he’s the fulham manager. Do Fulham have ANY world class players? – no. Liverpool is a different kettle of fish.

Lets be honest now. None of us KNOW how Roy will play, how he will set up his team at Liverpool. Some people think that he’ll play the same way as he did at Fulham, others think it’ll be different because he’ll have better players to work with. Only time will tell.

last season the manger was sacked because we finished 7th , this season it will be seen as a good season for the new manager to finish 7th . Mad that innit ?

last season the manger was sacked because we finished 7th with the tools he had at his disposal.

this season it will be seen as a good season for the new manager to finish top 4 with the same tools, or 7th with less. (but that’s out of his hands)

by **maypaxvobiscum** » Tue Jun 29, 2010 9:32 am

Do you think it is fair to expect any manager to come in and improve on last season with the tools he will have at hand ?

if that is the case, why is it that some on here have already seem to have concluded that Roy will make us a mid-table club while if another manager came in, say...Capello or Lippi, it wouldnt be the case? i understand that a big name manager will get the fans and players of this and other clubs excited to stay or join us but that doesnt mean a manager who isnt a household name cannot fulfill his potential at a bigger club.

Safety first at the back (fair enough ) flood the midfield and one up front . When we are defending it will be a rigid 10 men behind the ball and when we are attacking it will be a rigid one man upfront with midfield supporting if they can . THAT'S AT HOME BY THE WAY

well rafa wasnt exactly adventurous with his tactics was he? constantly playing 2 defensive midfielders, harping on the importance of tracking back, relying so often on the individual brilliance of Torres and hoping Gerrard will blast some stunner in the rescue the day, etc.

we'll come back to this in 6 months time and see

why 6 months when rafa was given 6 years?

last season when people wanted rid of the manager before everything else .

but rafa once brought us to 2nd place didnt he? and to 2 european cup finals. why is it that the hatred for the owners seem ignore the shortcomings of the manager himself? im not supporting the owners but im just saying purely for footballing both on and off the pitch (transfers) reasons, irregardless of who the owners are, rafa had to go.

this season it will be seen as a good season for the new manager to finish 7th

man utd and chelsea are bound to be in the top 4. arsenal shouldnt have an issue either. this leaves a champions league team in the shape of Spurs, moneybags Man City and Aston Villa, who while not being exactly a major rival, they are capable of taking points off the above mentioned teams including us. hence we will be having a bigger challenge to get into the top 4 then ever before.

by **andy_g** » Tue Jun 29, 2010 9:42 am

i'm not sure that people are saying that 7th (for example) would be acceptable next season under a new manager. i think its mostly an acceptance that a bunch of people have right royally fukked up in the last year and we have been left with no decent managerial prospects and the possibility that a bunch of our best players might do one. under these circumstances a mediocre manager achieving a mediocre league position with a mediocre squad might just be what we are looking at. i don't think anyone really wants it and deep down we are all hoping against hope that something good is going to happen... but the scary thing is that just about keeping in touch with the top 4 might be seen as an achievement come the end of next season.

fukking sucks, doesn't it?

by **jacdaniel** » Tue Jun 29, 2010 9:49 am

Next season – Really does depend on the playing personell we have here (what happens to gerrard, torres etc) – If all still here (except for mash as I think he was going anyway) – I would expect to improve on 7th, top 4 would be a great season for us next year as we have no money to invest in the squad like the other teams do.

As for the fans – whoever the manager is, he should be backed by the fans. One thing I would like from the fans is to be more vocal at matches. I have to admit that living down in London, I cant get to as many games as I would have liked, but the 3 or 4 I do go to per season, I think (to me) it seems quieter than a couple of years ago (and that was quieter than a couple of years before that)

You just confirmed Igor's point. 4th would be a great season next year but this year it was the minimum requirement? So why were so many people criticising Rafa all along? Did we just expect too much from him?

For the record, i agree with you that top 4 would be great considering the money we have compared to other teams. And i think we would of got fourth this year had it not been for injuries to key personnel and poor form from our Captain. (not that he shouldn't be allowed to have a bad season either).

but i believe Rafa would of sorted it out next season. With Roy onboard... im not so sure but ill still support him.

by **Redman in wales** » Tue Jun 29, 2010 9:55 am

jacdaniel wrote:You just confirmed Igor's point. 4th would be a great season next year but this year it was the minimum requirement? So why were so many people criticising Rafa all along?

not really.

I never said 4th was a MINIMUM requirement last season.

Champions league football is what we should be aiming for with the current squad, Rafa failed. If Roy can get it with the current squad, then its not a failure. Simples.

by **jacdaniel** » Tue Jun 29, 2010 10:04 am

Redman in wales wrote:
jacdaniel wrote:You just confirmed Igor's point. 4th would be a great season next year but this year it was the minimum requirement? So why were so many people criticising Rafa all along?

not really.

I never said 4th was a MINIMUM requirement last season.

Champions league football is what we should be aiming for with the current squad, Rafa failed. If Roy can get it with the current squad, then its not a failure. Simples.

Failing to qualify once in his 6 years here doesn't warrant a sacking though. (especially when the wallet is getting lighter each season).

Champions league footy is what we should be aiming for but when key personnel suffer from injuries and key players struggle for form and fitness.. it makes it more difficult.

If Roy gets the job, i want him to do well and wish him all the best. But.. i cant help feeling that what was a failure for Rafa will be seen as a great season for Roy.

by **Redman in wales** » Tue Jun 29, 2010 10:12 am

jacdaniel wrote:Champions league footy is what we should be aiming for but when key personnel suffer from injuries and key players struggle for form and fitness.. it makes it more difficult.

it does make it more difficult, but if you're alluding to Rafa's last season in charge then thats a whole different debate (ranging from buying the right players, spending money wisely, tactics, motivating players etc) - one which doesn't belong in this thread

failure for Rafa will be seen as a great season for Roy - Only if he has less "tools" to work with. The same players, plus money for newa ones and 7th next season will be seen as a failure too.

by **Paul C** » Tue Jun 29, 2010 10:13 am

ConnO'var wrote:I agree with you mate....

Let's look at the potential squad should we lose our 3 big guns.

Reina
Johnson Carra/Skrtel Agger/Skrtel Insua/Agger
?? ? Lucas
Kuyt/Maxi Aquilani Reira
Kuyt/Ngog/Nemeth?

Looking at it, we'd be short of 1 holding midifielder and cover just about all over the place.
We'll need cover for Aquilani, Johnson, another centre back, another left/right midfielder.

The question is whether we can get the required coverage for a limited budget that I believe will be available to the new manager.... will be tough methinks....

But the base squad should be good enough to challenge for the same league position that we obtained last year..... and I think Roy can probably extract the best out of these current crop of players.

Reira? I'd have Babel in over him, and you haven't included Dani Pacheco in that side, I honestly hope that lad gets some first team minutes this season under the new manager because he is such a tallent! :bowdown

by **dundreamin** » Tue Jun 29, 2010 11:13 am

i carnt believe this people saying if we come 4th it would be classed as a success. B.ullshit we want to be FIRST. No matter what we play to win. We are LIVERPOOL FOOTBALL CLUB. AND DONT FORGET IT

by **stmichael** » Tue Jun 29, 2010 11:20 am

dundreamin wrote:i carnt believe this people saying if we come 4th it would be classed as a success. B.ullshit we want to be FIRST. No matter what we play to win. We are LIVERPOOL FOOTBALL CLUB. AND DONT FORGET IT

You're living in cloud cuckoo land mate given the current circumstances at the Club. So if Roy fails to break into the top 4 next season, will we be hearing cries of 'Roy out' like we did with Rafa on here?

I don't agree with the appointment but it's blatantly a convenient appointment for the owners. It's not a long term thing. I see it a bit like Mark Hughes at Man City whereby he'll probablybe in charge until the new owners (who I don't expect to arrive anytime soon) come in and replace with a 'better' manager.

If there's less feuds, less bickering, less embarrassing statements, less moaning about what we don't have, less claims of 'turning down bigger offers to stay at Liverpool', less confusing tactics, substitutions, selections and transfer targets, less Media witch-hunts... and more stability within the team, more agreement, more trust, more likability and more spirit... then I'd rather have a season or two under Hodgson trying something new than have another season under what Rafa became which was very very distracting and messy for all to see.

If Roy does well, he may keep his job under new owners, if he doesn't they will replace him. Simple.

by **Scottbot** » Tue Jun 29, 2010 11:30 am

Igor Zidane wrote:Do you think it is fair to expect any manager to come in and improve on last season with the tools he will have at hand ? If you are willing to accept that 7th or there abouts will be a good season for the new manager , why all of a sudden is mediocrety ok ,when it wasn't last season ?

From a purley footballing point of view (if Roy gets the job ) can you see us playing expansive attacking football , with the tools he'll have remember ? or do you think that there's a good chance that ROY will revert to type ,the type of footy his teams have produced for 30 years . Safety first at the back (fair enough ) flood the midfield and one up front . When we are defending it will be a rigid 10 men behind the ball and when we are attacking it will be a rigid one man upfront with midfield supporting if they can . THAT'S AT HOME BY THE WAY as for away games well his record speaks for itself .

So there you go last season the manger was sacked because we finished 7th , this season it will be seen as a good season for the new manager to finish 7th . Mad that innit ?

Mate, we don't know what tools the manager will have at hand as yet though do we? If we lose Gerrard, Torres and Masch and Hodgson is given just £20 million of that money to spend then I guess the answer to your question is probably a yes (so far as the league goes) because Hodgson will have achieved the same results with both hands tied behind his back. If the club can keep it's best players, or at least re-invest a good chunk of monies raised then the answer would be an emphatic no. It would be completely unnacceptable. It's all relative surely?

As for the purely footballing point of view, everybody seems to be an expert on how Hodgson teams play their football all of a sudden? But has anyone really been paying that much attention all these years? Anyone recall how his Swiss team played when they got the last 16 in the World Cup or qualified for the Euros in 96? How did the Inter team he managed in 96-98 play? I'm no expert but I don't believe him to be an out an out defensive coach, and I don't think we're destined to play one up front and flood the midfield in every game either, incidentally that is exactly how we have set up the past three years. I believe Hodgson played two up-front for much of his time at Fulham? Does anyone on this board really know? Am sure Zamora and Dempsey played as a front two often enough. Danny Murphy is not the toughest tackling centre-middie in the world and he looked washed up a couple of season ago but he is a cultured player who has found a new lease of life under Hodgson. I also don't understand the knock on defensive coaches when Rafa (and Houllier before him) were essentially defensive coahes themselves. The football we have played under Rafa has (for the most part) been pragmatic and functional, at times we were excellent going forwardn but let's not pretend we have been pretty on the eye these past 5 years becuase it's not true.

by **Igor Zidane** » Tue Jun 29, 2010 11:47 am

Not going to russian doll here so i'll just answer a few of the good points thrown back .

Redman and and MAXI .

Roy hodgson has been a manager for 30 years , so he was a manager well before fulham . He's managed inter and Blackburn and the swiss national side aswell as a whole host of other sides . He's a steady eddie , he's DOES NOT and never has played free flowing attacking expansive footy.You will get % football with him , No risk taking ,no letting the shackles off . If you were p!ssed with rafa about it (and rightly so sometimes) you better be prepaired for a whole lot more and worse . He's good at what he does , he seems a great footballing man and i've nothing agaisnt him personally , but lets not delude ourselves into thinking that he's been brought in to move the club forward . He's been brought in to steady the ship, not to rock the boat and to look after things on the itch , whilst our owners and directors systematically strip the club of all assets before selling .

All i'm asking is realism . Rafa's gone it's the past . You've got to get your heads around the fact ,that we CANNOT compete for the forseable future . No matter who the manager is. The club is fecked from top to bottom ,from inside to out . When the players start to get sold .Don't blame the manager or the previuos manger . Lay the blame squarely where it belongs ,the owners and directors.

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