Is it time for the unthinkable? - Caretaker manager time?

Liverpool Football Club - General Discussion

Postby bigmick » Mon Mar 15, 2010 3:24 pm

Igor Zidane wrote:
bigmick wrote:People have been carded and banned before for posting an opinion about the managers future in threads where they weren't supposed to. I'm not advocating that course of action of course as it was as utterly ridiculous then as it would be now, but this thread as RIW pointed out is not really about the ownership of the club.

As I said earlier, you can bet your life that each time the team underperforms to an extreme level (and defeats to Wigan and Lille certainly come into that category) then stories of a horrific nature about the future of the club hit the headlines. If it's not some mad Thai who is going to buy the club, it's some Arab who likes kicking the sh!t out of people. It's always either that, or the club have been talking to GHlen Roeder as a potential new candidate for the managers job as he's the only one in World Football who'll take it on.

I don't buy it. Get a top manager in and tell him he has zero money to spend, but he can keep the players he already has. We'd launch a sustained title challenge next season, new owners or no new owners.

What TOP manager would come if you told him he had zero budget ?

Well Ferguson stayed at Man Utd despite having to generate a profit of 62 million quid last Summer. Wenger had to generate 25 million quid, and has to do so most seasons. Ancellotti was allowed to sign only one player. Rafa was told to generate his own transfer budget, and was allowed to spend all of it plus a bit more.

The only team who spent hugely were Man City. Even , Aston Villa had to sell their best player, Everton had to sell their best defender etc etc.

The days of football managers being given bucketloads of cash to spend are largely over. If Rafa had spent the 20 million quid which he spunked on Aquilani a bit wiser, we might now look like a better team than we do. Any top manager would come to Liverpool, hopefully if the job does come up we get somebody really special.
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Postby account deleted by request » Mon Mar 15, 2010 3:29 pm

bigmick wrote:I don't buy it. Get a top manager in and tell him he has zero money to spend, but he can keep the players he already has. We'd launch a sustained title challenge next season, new owners or no new owners.

This is the point that I totally believe. I THINK THE TEAM HAS UNDERPERFORMED MASSIVELY this season, and while I am willing to accept that last season was something of an anomaly as we had more than our share of good luck etc etc I still believe we have a good enough team to have made a title challenge this season.

We need someone who can get the best out of our team, someone who can adapt the formation when we have injury problems or players are out of form.

In our present circumstances (no money) we need a manager who can inspire the players to perform to their best level week in week out.

Yes we need new owners to build on what we have, but we need a new approach to get the best out of what we already have.
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Postby RED BEERGOGGLES » Mon Mar 15, 2010 3:36 pm

Redman in wales wrote:Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't there a thread consisting of 760 pages of people wanting the owners out? - All discussions about ousting the owners are in there.

Yes this seems to be one of the many variants on the splintered thread scheme as championed by some posters ,why  ? ... I am simply at a loss to explain   ???
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Postby RED BEERGOGGLES » Mon Mar 15, 2010 3:39 pm

s@int wrote:
bigmick wrote:I don't buy it. Get a top manager in and tell him he has zero money to spend, but he can keep the players he already has. We'd launch a sustained title challenge next season, new owners or no new owners.

This is the point that I totally believe. I THINK THE TEAM HAS UNDERPERFORMED MASSIVELY this season, and while I am willing to accept that last season was something of an anomaly as we had more than our share of good luck etc etc I still believe we have a good enough team to have made a title challenge this season.

We need someone who can get the best out of our team, someone who can adapt the formation when we have injury problems or players are out of form.

In our present circumstances (no money) we need a manager who can inspire the players to perform to their best level week in week out.

Yes we need new owners to build on what we have, but we need a new approach to get the best out of what we already have.

Saint while you consider last season as an anomaly ,surely in retrospect such a description could be used to describe this season also    ???
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Postby Igor Zidane » Mon Mar 15, 2010 3:40 pm

heimdall wrote:
Igor Zidane wrote:
heimdall wrote:
Igor Zidane wrote:
heimdall wrote:
Igor Zidane wrote:
heimdall wrote:
Igor Zidane wrote:I give up . Seriously . Concentrate on rafa all you like . The owners are the biggest problem at our football club and all your @sred about is the manager and his faults . Do what you want then . We'll have a new manager next season ,some of our best players gone a shItty budget and shItty owners . You've made the bed you can lie in it . Not saying no more on the issue , youse are obviuosly not @rsed in the slightest .All your interested in is being proven right and want to ram it home . Feck the bigger problems as long as Rafa is not here we are happy .Fine .

Do you not understand that it's the managers fault that we won't get 4th, it is the managers fault that as a result the top players will leave, it is the manager who will lead this club into mid table mediocrity uinless a very wealthy benefactor is bought.

In short RAFA IS THE PROBLEM, I know that doesn't suit your agenda of hate against the owners but it is the reality.

F.uck right of you ,you complete tIt .Not interested in your pathetic take on things . Your a feckin wa'nker mate plain a simple .

LOL you amuse me. Now where do I sign up for SOS  :D

Really that was easy spiritofshankly.com .

By the way soft ollies i do have a personal opinion and mY personal opinion of you is that you are a wind up merchant with the sole intention of causeing as much animosity in this place as possible and the sooner you or me are banned the better . YOU SCRUFFY NORWEGIAN INBRED TW@T .

scruffy  ???
inbred  ???

You don't know me so how can you call me scruffy and I assume you are being racist by calling me inbred, becuase you don't know me or my family personally, thank god, so I must assume you are casting aspersions on all Norwegian people which I actually take a lot of offence at and which is quite ironic and amusing as there is a lot of evidence to suggest that a lot of Scousers have Viking ancestory.

Quite astonishing outburst form you especially considering you are representative of SOS.  :no

No i'm not a representative of SOS . I'm a member that is all and as i said quite clearly it was and is my personal opinion . Now run along . FECKIN SH!T STIRRING BELL.

No I'm not going anywhere, and quite honestly I am shocked my your racist and xenophobic remarks, I honestly thought you were better than that.

Racist and xenaphobic ! Where pray tell ? All i was suggesting was that you where Norwegian and inbred and  FECKIN BIG :censored: STIRRING C.UNT .
UP THE PURPS !!!
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Postby Ciggy » Mon Mar 15, 2010 3:44 pm

Igor Zidane wrote:FECKIN BIG SH!T STIRRING C.UNT .

I concur, deliberately goes out of his way to wind people up!!!
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Postby Igor Zidane » Mon Mar 15, 2010 3:45 pm

bigmick wrote:
Igor Zidane wrote:
bigmick wrote:People have been carded and banned before for posting an opinion about the managers future in threads where they weren't supposed to. I'm not advocating that course of action of course as it was as utterly ridiculous then as it would be now, but this thread as RIW pointed out is not really about the ownership of the club.

As I said earlier, you can bet your life that each time the team underperforms to an extreme level (and defeats to Wigan and Lille certainly come into that category) then stories of a horrific nature about the future of the club hit the headlines. If it's not some mad Thai who is going to buy the club, it's some Arab who likes kicking the sh!t out of people. It's always either that, or the club have been talking to GHlen Roeder as a potential new candidate for the managers job as he's the only one in World Football who'll take it on.

I don't buy it. Get a top manager in and tell him he has zero money to spend, but he can keep the players he already has. We'd launch a sustained title challenge next season, new owners or no new owners.

What TOP manager would come if you told him he had zero budget ?

Well Ferguson stayed at Man Utd despite having to generate a profit of 62 million quid last Summer. Wenger had to generate 25 million quid, and has to do so most seasons. Ancellotti was allowed to sign only one player. Rafa was told to generate his own transfer budget, and was allowed to spend all of it plus a bit more.

The only team who spent hugely were Man City. Even , Aston Villa had to sell their best player, Everton had to sell their best defender etc etc.

The days of football managers being given bucketloads of cash to spend are largely over. If Rafa had spent the 20 million quid which he spunked on Aquilani a bit wiser, we might now look like a better team than we do. Any top manager would come to Liverpool, hopefully if the job does come up we get somebody really special.

:laugh: Alright mick fair enough . We'll see . So yer think were in with a chance of getting Fergie or wenger then or Ancelloti for that matter ?
UP THE PURPS !!!
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Postby Igor Zidane » Mon Mar 15, 2010 3:53 pm

Right i'm out of this thread as i'm getting wound up by that pr!ck Heimdall . I shall leave you lot to debate  the manager and how :censored: he is and wether he will still be :censored: once he's gone and if Lucas will be any better under fergie or wenger . As long as you don't debate the real problems now ,lets not get side tracked by silly conversations regarding the future of the club .
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Postby account deleted by request » Mon Mar 15, 2010 3:58 pm

RED BEERGOGGLES wrote:
s@int wrote:
bigmick wrote:I don't buy it. Get a top manager in and tell him he has zero money to spend, but he can keep the players he already has. We'd launch a sustained title challenge next season, new owners or no new owners.

This is the point that I totally believe. I THINK THE TEAM HAS UNDERPERFORMED MASSIVELY this season, and while I am willing to accept that last season was something of an anomaly as we had more than our share of good luck etc etc I still believe we have a good enough team to have made a title challenge this season.

We need someone who can get the best out of our team, someone who can adapt the formation when we have injury problems or players are out of form.

In our present circumstances (no money) we need a manager who can inspire the players to perform to their best level week in week out.

Yes we need new owners to build on what we have, but we need a new approach to get the best out of what we already have.

Saint while you consider last season as an anomaly ,surely in retrospect such a description could be used to describe this season also    ???

I was willing to accept last season as being an anomaly .....AS SUGGESTED BY THE PRO-RAFALITES mate  :D I am quite happy that that is the level we should be attaining EVERY YEAR.

For me last season was all about momentum. We won a few early games that could have gone either way, gained momentum and were on a roll until we had our usual midseason blip and then when all seemed lost, gained momentum again after our incredible performance against Madrid.

We are a much better team than we are showing at the moment mate. I have thought since the end of 2006 that we have underperformed badly in the league, and while last season may have flattered us a little, I think its not unreasonable to expect around 80+ points a season.
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Postby maguskwt » Mon Mar 15, 2010 3:59 pm

bigmick wrote:Rafa was told to generate his own transfer budget, and was allowed to spend all of it plus a bit more.

Really? Let's see, in 2009 we sold Keane for 15 million, Alonso for 30 million and arbeloa for 3 million, to a total of 48 million. And we bought Aquilani for 20 million and Glenn Johnson for 17 million and the Greek for 1.5 million, which is 38.5 million. All of it plus a bit more?  :;):

And I'm sure if you take into account all the players rafa bought and sold at a profit, I'm sure you will find that after 5 years Rafa has spent reasonably well.
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Postby RED BEERGOGGLES » Mon Mar 15, 2010 4:20 pm

s@int wrote:I was willing to accept last season as being an anomaly .....AS SUGGESTED BY THE PRO-RAFALITES mate  :D I am quite happy that that is the level we should be attaining EVERY YEAR.

For me last season was all about momentum. We won a few early games that could have gone either way, gained momentum and were on a roll until we had our usual midseason blip and then when all seemed lost, gained momentum again after our incredible performance against Madrid.

We are a much better team than we are showing at the moment mate. I have thought since the end of 2006 that we have underperformed badly in the league, and while last season may have flattered us a little, I think its not unreasonable to expect around 80+ points a season.

Mate we all want to see vibrant flowing inventive football being played ,me no less than most but surely a new manager would simply mask our deficiencies  it would be tantamount to erecting a chandelier in a coggy watchman's hut the same crumbling foundations would still be in place ,but all the more unstable for the glamorous adornment ,I just think that while its not being entirely unreasonable to expect 80 points ,I just think given the turmoil the club is currently enduring that it should be termed  infeasible rather than unreasonable mate
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Postby fivecups » Mon Mar 15, 2010 4:28 pm

bigmick wrote:That doesn't alter the fact however that the manager has been a disaster.

Don't see that at all. This season has been a disaster, not the past 6.
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Postby Reg » Mon Mar 15, 2010 4:32 pm

fivecups wrote:
bigmick wrote:That doesn't alter the fact however that the manager has been a disaster.

Don't see that at all. This season has been a disaster, not the past 6.

The sensationalists will say whatever they have to make their point.  You´d think this club started yesterday....  :idea
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Postby account deleted by request » Mon Mar 15, 2010 4:40 pm

Imagine for a moment the unthinkable..... Rafa had walked at the end of last season. We had managed by hook or by crook to persuade Dalglish/Hiddink/Mourinho (my own preferences) to take over. No more money than Rafa got maybe even bought the same players Rafa did (yes even Aquilani) The team is then set up for the season correctly, motivated as all teams are by a new manager, momentum achived by early victories ..... we are on a roll. We then qualify for the CL knockout stages (NOT BEYOND THE BOUNDS OF POSSIBILITIES SURELY?) somehow manage to overpower Reading in the FA CUP. Success breeds success, our owners are no longer having to worry about money to the same extent as they have guaranteed CL MONEY, we are a much more attractive club for investors and for commercial investment.

Yes we would still have the long term problem of owners who are lying money grabbing tw@ts, but at least we would be acquiring what I would imagine was the MINIMUM budgeted for, which would be CL progression, a run in one of the cups and a top 4 place to secure our future.

The turmoil whilst ultimately the responsibility of our owners has been exacerbated by our performances ON THE FIELD this season ..... have no doubts about that mate.
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Postby Redman in wales » Mon Mar 15, 2010 4:41 pm

maguskwt wrote:
bigmick wrote:Rafa was told to generate his own transfer budget, and was allowed to spend all of it plus a bit more.

Really? Let's see, in 2009 we sold Keane for 15 million, Alonso for 30 million and arbeloa for 3 million, to a total of 48 million. And we bought Aquilani for 20 million and Glenn Johnson for 17 million and the Greek for 1.5 million, which is 38.5 million. All of it plus a bit more?  :;):

And I'm sure if you take into account all the players rafa bought and sold at a profit, I'm sure you will find that after 5 years Rafa has spent reasonably well.

we didn't receive the full £15 Million for keane though. We just cancelled the installments that we owed spurs. we probably only received a fraction of that amount.  Though that was the january transfer window.

Working on a season-by-season basis, we've roughly broken even with Aquilani, Johnson and Soto coming in for Alonso, Arbeloa and dossena
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