Liverpool FC Forum

by **Judge** » Mon Nov 10, 2008 4:32 pm

JoeTerp wrote:
Bam wrote:
but it also wastes 2 years

Firstly two years isnt really a long time in your life.

Are you kidding?

Life is short and everyone only gets one. To waste any amount of time by being forced into national service is a crime against humanity.

is it heckers like

national service never hurt anyone. soft fu'ckers nowadays

plus there should be army boot camps for petty criminals also. it would teach them respect

by **Lando_Griffin** » Mon Nov 10, 2008 6:18 pm

Judge wrote:plus there should be army boot camps for petty criminals also. it would teach them respect

Bob on, that.

National Service in it's old guise is an old-fashioned, out-dated idea which would cause rebellion en masse if brought back into this limp-wristed world today.

However, if it was tweaked here, and oiled there, it could work. If, for instance, it was not "Everyone, no matter what, does 2 years", but "if you are convicted of more than 1 criminal offence, you do 2 years of National Service", then I have a sneaking suspicion that the country's crime rate would plummet.
This allows for your silly tw*ts who make a "mistake" by "accidentally" pinching a bar of Dairy Milk, but punishes the repeat offender - something which the gaylords in Court do not.

Give Johnny Ballbag the option of nipping his one-man crime-wave in the bud, or spending the next 2 years of his life having his sweaty a*se beasted for 15 hours a day, and I'm sure he'll soon realise that buying items, rather than stealing them, is the right way to go.

If not, there's always Afghanistan...

by **maypaxvobiscum** » Mon Nov 10, 2008 6:23 pm

but Lando do you really want to see those criminals having access to weapons?

by **Igor Zidane** » Mon Nov 10, 2008 8:10 pm

maypaxvobiscum wrote:but Lando do you really want to see those criminals having access to weapons?

Exactly the point i was going to make .

Bring back national service for everyone , get the feckers before they commit offenses . Teach them discipline and respect , teach them that they are valued if they make a contribution to society , teach them how to behave like decent people . THe situation is getting so bad that the government need a radical solution to the problems of today . Unfortunately alot of parents can't be relied on (they simply don't give a feck what little johnny is up to tonight )so the government need to sort it out .

National service would sort the little sh!tehawks out.

by **JoeTerp** » Mon Nov 10, 2008 11:57 pm

the only thing the government knows is how to f.uck something up. You honestly think that the F.ucking corrupt @ss, inept, inefficient government would do a better job at raising children or turning teenagers into adults? That is the scariest thing I have ever heard of.

The first thing children and young adults need to learn is that the government is more or less incapable of helping them and the faster they learn that, the quicker they will be to sharpen up, and if not, then they will struggle.

Imagine how many wars we would be getting into if we had a massive oversupply of service members that could never run out? Actually, I think (and would hope that) most teenagers would protest and go to jail instead of serving under conscription

by **Bam** » Tue Nov 11, 2008 12:38 am

JoeTerp wrote:the only thing the government knows is how to f.uck something up. You honestly think that the F.ucking corrupt @ss, inept, inefficient government would do a better job at raising children or turning teenagers into adults? That is the scariest thing I have ever heard of.

The first thing children and young adults need to learn is that the government is more or less incapable of helping them and the faster they learn that, the quicker they will be to sharpen up, and if not, then they will struggle.

Imagine how many wars we would be getting into if we had a massive oversupply of service members that could never run out? Actually, I think (and would hope that) most teenagers would protest and go to jail instead of serving under conscription

Well I can understand that, you being American an all.

by **Lando_Griffin** » Tue Nov 11, 2008 1:12 am

Igor Zidane wrote:
maypaxvobiscum wrote:but Lando do you really want to see those criminals having access to weapons?

Exactly the point i was going to make .

Bring back national service for everyone , get the feckers before they commit offenses . Teach them discipline and respect , teach them that they are valued if they make a contribution to society , teach them how to behave like decent people . THe situation is getting so bad that the government need a radical solution to the problems of today . Unfortunately alot of parents can't be relied on (they simply don't give a feck what little johnny is up to tonight )so the government need to sort it out .

National service would sort the little sh!tehawks out.

Unless you're going to sign up 8 year-olds, you're going to struggle to catch them before they commit any offences.

The "do you want these people having access to weapons?" debate is surely not going to be answered if National service is opened to everyone, as the little sh*tbags will still be totting guns.

Fact is, the army wouldn't let them near live ammo until they were 100% certain there'd be no risk.

by **ruskiy playmaker** » Tue Nov 11, 2008 1:43 am

JoeTerp wrote:the only thing the government knows is how to f.uck something up. You honestly think that the F.ucking corrupt @ss, inept, inefficient government would do a better job at raising children or turning teenagers into adults? That is the scariest thing I have ever heard of.

The first thing children and young adults need to learn is that the government is more or less incapable of helping them and the faster they learn that, the quicker they will be to sharpen up, and if not, then they will struggle.

Imagine how many wars we would be getting into if we had a massive oversupply of service members that could never run out? Actually, I think (and would hope that) most teenagers would protest and go to jail instead of serving under conscription

Exactly, the government is too :censored:

up these days, you'd have to be insane to let your children be raised by them. There are so many soft guys today, because the schools and the media raises them this way, not because they don't do NS.

by **SupitsJonF** » Tue Nov 11, 2008 3:28 am

Bam wrote:
JoeTerp wrote:the only thing the government knows is how to f.uck something up. You honestly think that the F.ucking corrupt @ss, inept, inefficient government would do a better job at raising children or turning teenagers into adults? That is the scariest thing I have ever heard of.

The first thing children and young adults need to learn is that the government is more or less incapable of helping them and the faster they learn that, the quicker they will be to sharpen up, and if not, then they will struggle.

Imagine how many wars we would be getting into if we had a massive oversupply of service members that could never run out? Actually, I think (and would hope that) most teenagers would protest and go to jail instead of serving under conscription

Well I can understand that, you being American an all.

Every government. Any position of power. Not just an American thing, its a human thing.

by **Lando_Griffin** » Tue Nov 11, 2008 3:41 am

I notice that it's non-British folk who think that the army is un by the Government.

In Britain, the army serves the Queen and the Queen alone. If she said "kill the Government", there'd be an awful lot of Politicians bending over to kiss their a*se goodbye.

by **Bam** » Tue Nov 11, 2008 4:40 am

SupitsJonF wrote:
Bam wrote:
JoeTerp wrote:the only thing the government knows is how to f.uck something up. You honestly think that the F.ucking corrupt @ss, inept, inefficient government would do a better job at raising children or turning teenagers into adults? That is the scariest thing I have ever heard of.

The first thing children and young adults need to learn is that the government is more or less incapable of helping them and the faster they learn that, the quicker they will be to sharpen up, and if not, then they will struggle.

Imagine how many wars we would be getting into if we had a massive oversupply of service members that could never run out? Actually, I think (and would hope that) most teenagers would protest and go to jail instead of serving under conscription

Well I can understand that, you being American an all.

Every government. Any position of power. Not just an American thing, its a human thing.

Joe can only speak for the American people though and about the American Government.

He cannot speak for every nation (GB included) and every Government on earth. Unless he knows or actually understands the extent in which the youth of today (in GB I'm talking about) has gotten so out of hand, he cannot really coment. Likewise I dont know about America, but with the country (GB and probably the World) gone PC mad, taking away parents rights to smack their kids and discipline their kids like they used to in my Mums day. Order and respect have gone out the window with it, knife crimes, drugs, thieving, armed robbery the dour list goes on to what has replaced a once respectful, disciplined hard working society.

It has gotten way out of hand and something should be done, NS would toughen these little pr.icks up imo and character build them instead of being the lazy loud mouth wasters that their rapidly turning into these days, mirrored by (generally) young parents who are on the rock n roll looking for handouts to get by in life, instead of lifting a finger and getting their @rses out there in the real world to earn a living.

Two years is not a long time, life isnt that short. Thats just pinko uni talk coming from someone who has been spoon fed all their lives by the sounds of it. Look at the bigger picture, who in their right mind would say two years is to long for NS. When people go to Uni for anything upto seven years, or to school for sixteen years.
I've done a country service over here in a remote area, It took me and my misses two years in the middle of nowhere. We had to do it, I wasnt keen. But once I was there I loved it and its been the best life experiance I've ever done. So much so that we're going back to do remote country service next year.

Two years isnt a long time, especially if you want your people to get back their values, beliefs and ethics which imo this would only help to do. Then it would be well worth it, instead of becoming a fast rotting vicious country it will inevitabley become.

The Politician, the parents wont/cant do anything about this but the Army fecking would.

by **maypaxvobiscum** » Tue Nov 11, 2008 7:24 am

i dont think its fair to blame the government, maybe Bam or Lando can give me examples on how they are predominantly at fault?. manners and proper upbringing should start in the homes itself from the very start. of course you can argue globalization, cultural imperialism and hypodermic needles as factors but it really should start from the family. sending them to camps after they commit offences might cause a different effect in the sense they garner more hatred to the government and since they are criminals, im sure they glory in breaking rules under even tighter security such as the military. they would be more determined to break rules and come in closer contact with others with similar mindset.

if NS is to be implicated, implement it with the new generation or those below the age of 16 at the time the law is created.. i mean, imagine you're one of those 18 year old punks and suddenly a new rule states you've to go to the army. it would cause a riot especially considering how indisciplined they already are.

by **Igor Zidane** » Tue Nov 11, 2008 7:26 am

It's not the government who will teach these little feckers , it's the services . The government will just be setting up the way's and means of getting them of the streets and contributing to society . They need direction and they need to feel that they can make a valued contibution to our country . Not by selling drugs or robbing people or property or by killing one another (and some of us in the process), but by people saying to them "your a man ,so act like one". National service will give them a sense of worth .

by **Bam** » Tue Nov 11, 2008 7:44 am

maypaxvobiscum wrote:i dont think its fair to blame the government, maybe Bam or Lando can give me examples on how they are predominantly at fault?. manners and proper upbringing should start in the homes itself from the very start. of course you can argue globalization, cultural imperialism and hypodermic needles as factors but it really should start from the family. sending them to camps after they commit offences might cause a different effect in the sense they garner more hatred to the government and since they are criminals, im sure they glory in breaking rules under even tighter security such as the military. they would be more determined to break rules and come in closer contact with others with similar mindset.

if NS is to be implicated, implement it with the new generation or those below the age of 16 at the time the law is created.. i mean, imagine you're one of those 18 year old punks and suddenly a new rule states you've to go to the army. it would cause a riot especially considering how indisciplined they already are.

I totally agree with you Maypax, manners and a proper upbringing should start at home. The parents of these teenage thugs are largely at fault for this, although no parent can be expected to know where, what and when their kid is doing 24/7. I understand this too, but as you've pointed out if they were brought up with morals, respect, Love and guidance I reckon at least half these little thugs wouldnt be the tearaways they are.

As for the 'Governments' part in all this I just think its become a soft touch regarding this issue. They've taken away the rights of parents who do discipline their kids with a smack if need be. Which of course never hurt me or anyone from my generation and upwards. I'd like to reiterate that there is a hell of a difference between smacking a kid and physically abusing them. Basically the Governments laws and overhauls in recent times have left teachers, Policeman and Women and parents with little rights against teenage Asbo's. Which in turn now has imo let the little scallies run wild on the streets, and the buggers know their rights and will push them to the limits.

And just to get back on topic, if for whatever reason Obama has toiled with the idea of bringing NS in. I dont blame him when looking at Britain in comparrison, he maybe doing/want to do it for different reasons to what we've discussed here in this thread, but its something Britain should be continplating for reasons discussed here.

by **maypaxvobiscum** » Tue Nov 11, 2008 7:53 am

Bam wrote:
maypaxvobiscum wrote:i dont think its fair to blame the government, maybe Bam or Lando can give me examples on how they are predominantly at fault?. manners and proper upbringing should start in the homes itself from the very start. of course you can argue globalization, cultural imperialism and hypodermic needles as factors but it really should start from the family. sending them to camps after they commit offences might cause a different effect in the sense they garner more hatred to the government and since they are criminals, im sure they glory in breaking rules under even tighter security such as the military. they would be more determined to break rules and come in closer contact with others with similar mindset.

if NS is to be implicated, implement it with the new generation or those below the age of 16 at the time the law is created.. i mean, imagine you're one of those 18 year old punks and suddenly a new rule states you've to go to the army. it would cause a riot especially considering how indisciplined they already are.

I totally agree with you Maypax, manners and a proper upbringing should start at home. The parents of these teenage thugs are largely at fault for this, although no parent can be expected to know where, what and when their kid is doing 24/7. I understand this too, but as you've pointed out if they were brought up with morals, respect, Love and guidance I reckon at least half these little thugs wouldnt be the tearaways they are.

As for the 'Governments' part in all this I just think its become a soft touch regarding this issue. They've taken away the rights of parents who do discipline their kids with a smack if need be. Which of course never hurt me or anyone from my generation and upwards. I'd like to reiterate that there is a hell of a difference between smacking a kid and physically abusing them. Basically the Governments laws and overhauls in recent times have left teachers, Policeman and Women and parents with little rights against teenage Asbo's. Which in turn now has imo let the little scallies run wild on the streets, and the buggers know their rights and will push them to the limits.

yes i heard about it on the net about how GB is so relaxed on Yahoo news. during my time i would get hit on the hands with a ruler for not doing my homework, go home, tell my parents about it, get scolded for not doing it and accept its my fault.

i also recall getting yelled at for not telling anyone i went to play football and came home 6 hours late.

now, not for all cases, but kids will go home, tell their parents, and parents despite knowing its their kids' fault will lodge a complain against the teacher. its so hypocritical cause later on they will b!tch about how their kids is out of control and doesnt listen to 'authority'. well, when a wrong deed is supported by an 'authority' itself, (the parents) against another authority (teachers) it just gives the kids more confidence that the next time they break a rule they can get away with it. in that case the parents only have themselves to blame for giving blind love.

they is a severe lack of balance where both authorities cant come to terms and the winner would ultimately be the spoilt brat.

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