Liverpool FC Forum

by **Scottbot** » Wed Feb 23, 2005 12:38 am

I still believe Dudek is a good keeper but i think he has now got to the stage where he has made TOO many costly errors within a fairly short space of time. I get the impression Jerzy doesn't have the bottle to put them behind him. Not many keepers do - Seaman was able to overcome several high profile gaffs in his career and Smeichel made his fair share over the years but Jerzy isn't made of quite the same metal.

This will be a BIG test of Rafas' man management skills. I was glad to see him back him after the game. I just hope he says the right things to the lad during the week.

Expect to see Dudek playing elsewhere next season plus think we will see Canizares or Cudicini between the Anfield posts.

by **banana** » Wed Feb 23, 2005 1:15 am

stu_the_red wrote:
Carson is not ready yet

How the ****** would you know?

Well, look at his birth certificate lad. just a kid he is.
look at his level of experience. only a handful of first team games

is it so hard?

a goalkeeper needs a cool head, and a lot of experience

benitez has also said that carson is one for the future. he is not ready yet. still i'd play him ahead of kirkland since i think kirkland is a dog and a f@ck up. i cannot imagine him being worse than kirkland, no matter his age and experience.

pecking order:
1. Dudek (preferably a new signing in the summer)
2. Carson ( play him in the cups and every now and then for a few years)
.xx
.xx
.xx
.xx
.xx
.xx
10th Kirkland

by **Santa** » Wed Feb 23, 2005 1:27 am

Let's sign Peter Shilton. He have what you called...

a cool head, and a lot of experience

You are just sore we put on a good game tonight don't ya? So go on and spread your defeatist gospel here :angry:

by **YoungAdam** » Wed Feb 23, 2005 1:29 am

Screw away goals we're 2 in front.

by **mrcool2003** » Wed Feb 23, 2005 1:33 am

stu_the_red wrote:That mistake will cost us the tie. I would think.

I don't think its done his chances of staying our first choice any good either. One mistake to many now for me i'm affraid. It was poor reactions to a poor shot once again.

ure being very negative aren't you? im sure you never thought we'd be 3-1 up going into the 2nd leg

by **115-1073096938** » Wed Feb 23, 2005 1:36 am

Well, look at his birth certificate lad. just a kid he is.
look at his level of experience. only a handful of first team games

is it so hard?

a goalkeeper needs a cool head, and a lot of experience

benitez has also said that carson is one for the future. he is not ready yet. still i'd play him ahead of kirkland since i think kirkland is a dog and a f@ck up. i cannot imagine him being worse than kirkland, no matter his age and experience.

pecking order:
1. Dudek (preferably a new signing in the summer)
2. Carson ( play him in the cups and every now and then for a few years)
.xx
.xx
.xx
.xx
.xx
.xx
10th Kirkland

Right, i'm sorry but thats ******.

If your good enough. You're old enough. All these managers who play players out of position "for experience" and don't think they should play young players because they are to young are simply talking out of there ******.

Rooney is 18 and top class. Owen at 17 was top class. Fowler at 18 was top class. Young players only gain experience and become better by playing, so stop talking out of your ****** as usual you bafoon.

Are you telling me young players can't have a cool head? Also, experience doesn't make you a good player, never has and never will. Experience makes you a better player.

Some of the ****** you come out with is truely shocking, a wise man once said "i think some people are stupid, then they open there mouths and it removes all doubt".

by **A.B.** » Wed Feb 23, 2005 2:18 am

I agree with you Stu.

However you ought to be more optimistic about the second leg. There was many out there who didn't think we would win and we proved them wrong. Ok we let in a goal we shouldn't had but we shouldn't let that stand in our away. If we are good enough to go further in the Champions League then we should be able to get the result in Germany.

by **112-1077774096** » Wed Feb 23, 2005 2:21 am

goalkeepers tend to get more consistent when they are older, have you both not noticed that, can either of you name a world class keeper at age 18 or 19

by **banana** » Wed Feb 23, 2005 2:21 am

stu_the_red wrote:
Well, look at his birth certificate lad. just a kid he is.
look at his level of experience. only a handful of first team games

is it so hard?

a goalkeeper needs a cool head, and a lot of experience

benitez has also said that carson is one for the future. he is not ready yet. still i'd play him ahead of kirkland since i think kirkland is a dog and a f@ck up. i cannot imagine him being worse than kirkland, no matter his age and experience.

pecking order:
1. Dudek (preferably a new signing in the summer)
2. Carson ( play him in the cups and every now and then for a few years)
.xx
.xx
.xx
.xx
.xx
.xx
10th Kirkland

Right, i'm sorry but thats ******.

If your good enough. You're old enough. All these managers who play players out of position "for experience" and don't think they should play young players because they are to young are simply talking out of there ******.

Rooney is 18 and top class. Owen at 17 was top class. Fowler at 18 was top class. Young players only gain experience and become better by playing, so stop talking out of your ****** as usual you bafoon.

Are you telling me young players can't have a cool head? Also, experience doesn't make you a good player, never has and never will. Experience makes you a better player.

Some of the ****** you come out with is truely shocking, a wise man once said "i think some people are stupid, then they open there mouths and it removes all doubt".

So what. Rooney, Owen and Fowler were not goalkeepers. There's a big difference between being a young striker and being a young goalkeeper. I've played a fair bit of football in my days, and I've watched a handful of games. So you don't need to try to lecture me boy. And I say there is a difference between a wee young kid between the posts, and a more mature one. Call it experience, call it the X factor. There is a difference. And let's establish a fact. Most first choice goalkeepers are in the age bracket 27-35 years. Coincedence? Hell no. But I do not say that Carson isn't a good keeper. What I say is he need more time. I think it is best for his career to sit tight and be patient. Throw him to the dogs now, and they eat him alive. A couple of mistakes, a few headlines and pretty soon he lose his sleep, his motivation and his self confidence. Possibly ruin a potentially good career and a nice lad. Let's all be patient with this one, he deserves it.

by **LFC #1** » Wed Feb 23, 2005 2:22 am

closest i could get would be Casillas. who is about 24.

by **Santa** » Wed Feb 23, 2005 2:28 am

when he burst to Real's first XI a couple of seasons back, he was immense. Didn't see Dudek getting more consistency as he gets older tho...

by **el_stinger** » Wed Feb 23, 2005 2:49 am

I think you'll be amazed at Carson's abilities at the moment. He was looking very fresh for Leeds, and I think its time to pass the torch starting with the next Prem League match up. Start his Carreer early.

by **115-1073096938** » Wed Feb 23, 2005 2:55 am

So what. Rooney, Owen and Fowler were not goalkeepers. There's a big difference between being a young striker and being a young goalkeeper. I've played a fair bit of football in my days, and I've watched a handful of games. So you don't need to try to lecture me boy. And I say there is a difference between a wee young kid between the posts, and a more mature one. Call it experience, call it the X factor. There is a difference. And let's establish a fact. Most first choice goalkeepers are in the age bracket 27-35 years. Coincedence? Hell no. But I do not say that Carson isn't a good keeper. What I say is he need more time. I think it is best for his career to sit tight and be patient. Throw him to the dogs now, and they eat him alive. A couple of mistakes, a few headlines and pretty soon he lose his sleep, his motivation and his self confidence. Possibly ruin a potentially good career and a nice lad. Let's all be patient with this one, he deserves it.

Don't talk such balls.

a 19 year old Paul Robinson was keeping a 32 year old Nigel Martyn out of a very good leeds side.

Age is ****** all in any position. Ability is and always will be first and foremost.

There is no knowledge that is not power. Ever heard that saying?

Goalkeepers with talent are the same as young players with talent. It doesn't matter weather you are 20 or 32. If you're good enough, you're old enough. Don't be such a ******wit for christs sake.

You really haven't got a clue about the game, come over to ****** england and lets see how good a standard ur really at you little tart. I'd kick ****** lumps out of ya. You're a bloody no-body with no knowledge who doesn't even support a team on his own ****** CONTINENT let alone city yet you claim to know the ins and outs better than MATCH GOING locals.

What pillock!!!

by **ivor_the_injun** » Wed Feb 23, 2005 2:56 am

The away goal has changed the complexion of the tie, but let's not forget that they've now got 2 of their first choice midfielders suspended. Biscan and Hamann were bossing them completely, so god only knows what Hamann and Stevie will do to their second string choices. Yes, they're a tough proposition at home, but on our day we can do serious damage to any team whether it's going toe-to-toe or on the counter, so I'm far from pessimistic.

It's such a shame that we haven't got the 3 goal cushion, and I'm as frustrated as anyone with Dudek's timing, but let's not forget that his 2 very good saves earlier in the half avoided a scoreline that could very easily have been 2-1 or even 2-2. Obviously everyone's entitled to jump all over Jerzy for the blunder, but to be honest I wouldn't put my shirt on any of our three keepers to get through 90 mins without doing something stupid, so it's not as if dropping him is the obvious thing to do.

by **ivor_the_injun** » Wed Feb 23, 2005 3:02 am

Oh, and on the subject of top quality keepers only coming through in their mid-to-late 20s/early 30s?

Petr Cech. Aged 22. Has been world class for the last 3 years.

Some have it early, some have it late. Maybe Carson's got it now - I'm sure we'll see sooner or later.

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