Liverpool FC Forum

by **mart** » Mon Oct 11, 2010 4:00 pm

maguskwt wrote:
bigmick wrote:
supersub wrote:
bigmick wrote:It remains to be seen whether or not it was the right move to plump for Roy (or Woy as you and the posse insist on calling him),

It appears that you are the poster who has used the phrase Woy the most on this forum and that the word Wafa is the most re-occurring, mis-pronounced name of any of our former or current managers...I would ask that a little respect be shown to previous and current managers please by posse and non-posse members...whoever they are

Not really sure how to take that one SS. I've NEVER used "Woy" apart from in that post, and I've never used "Wafa" ( I didn't know anybody esle had either to be honest).

Ah well, straight over my head but it's hardly the first time lets be honest.

Funny I've never called Roy "Woy" and here you are accusing me of doing just that...

BigMick loves to play the victim in most of his posts.

by **bigmick** » Mon Oct 11, 2010 4:05 pm

maguskwt wrote:Funny I've never called Roy "Woy"

Really

You need to get with the programme mate or you'll be getting kicked out of the group :laugh:

.

by **maguskwt** » Mon Oct 11, 2010 4:09 pm

bigmick wrote:
maguskwt wrote:If you don't honestly deny the sky is blue bigmick, then surely you must agree Rafa is a better manager... 2 la liga titles. 1 champions league title, one uefa cup title and one FA cup title proves that...

No I don't deny the sky is blue Magus, there's been far too much of that going on on here over the years. Based on their respective records, you'd obviously go for Benitez if you were starting from scratch, but it is by no means as simple as that.

Clearly deciding who was going to be our manager for the next couple of seasons wasn't "starting from scratch", far from it. It could in fact be argued that Benitez had not only taken the club as far as he could, but he was well underway with the journey back again as well. Clearly he had to go (I know some of the "moonies" on here will never see it, but for any even slightly impartial judge it was an absolute no brainer), and then the only question then is who you replace him with.

It remains to be seen whether or not it was the right move to plump for Roy (or Woy as you and the posse insist on calling him), but per se measuring any incumbent on how many La Liga titles they had won is a silly way of judging it. If you went with that criteria, you would NEVER EVER get rid of Benitez regardless of how much of a nonsense he had made of the job after six seasons. While I can appreciate that to you and your fellow clan members this is a perfect scenario, it's no way to run a football club.

When Barcelona promoted Pep Guardiola from reserve team coach to first team coach he hadn't won any La Liga titles either, he has now. When the Mancs promoted Ferguson from Aberdeen, his league success had been in Scotland. You can't say that any more. When Arsenal plucked Wenger from the Japanese A league, no doubt people of your ilk would have dismissed any achievements he had.

It doesn't matter which way you spin it around, you can only win the league you are competing in at the time. As such, Roys record is extremely impressive. No manager rips it up everywhere he goes, certainly not even your Guru Magus. I must dig back through that thread where I detailed his successes and failures. All I can say is, it's a good job you lot weren't Valencia fans when he first got the job there, he'd have been sacked long before he won any La Liga titles.

I'm all for Pep Guadiola kind of appointment Mick. You see, I'm not sure whether you see the difference or not in what you are comparing to in all your high horseness, but instead of getting a fresh approach, new ideas, energy and inspiration in appointing a young and promising manager like Guadiola or Joachim Lowe, we get Mr I'm-not-gonna-change-my-approach-after-it-served-me-well-for-35-years Hodgson, we get face-in-my-palm-for-85-minutes-then-make-a-desparate-substitution Roy. And btw, Arsene Wenger and Alex Ferguson were in their mid 40's when they took over their respective clubs and had benefit of the doubt on their side. Roy Hodgson is at the twilight of his career with no major trophy to show for. Only extremely naive people would believe that Roy Hodgosn could turn the team around. He was an interim manager, someone to steady the ship, that was all he was. But even that task he is failing, he isn't steadying the ship, he is taking it down with him...

by **JBG** » Mon Oct 11, 2010 4:12 pm

Whats the big deal about calling him "Woy" anyways? Its a bit like people who say "Jonathan Woss." Its hardly the worst slur in the world and people also use it as a term of endearment. I remember that Fulham fans used to say it as a sign of affection for their manager.

Its making an issue out of nothing.

by **maguskwt** » Mon Oct 11, 2010 4:18 pm

JBG wrote:Whats the big deal about calling him "Woy" anyways? Its a bit like people who say "Jonathan Woss." Its hardly the worst slur in the world and people also use it as a term of endearment. I remember that Fulham fans used to say it as a sign of affection for their manager.

Its making an issue out of nothing.

by **JBG** » Mon Oct 11, 2010 4:22 pm

maguskwt wrote:
JBG wrote:Whats the big deal about calling him "Woy" anyways? Its a bit like people who say "Jonathan Woss." Its hardly the worst slur in the world and people also use it as a term of endearment. I remember that Fulham fans used to say it as a sign of affection for their manager.

Its making an issue out of nothing.

But seriously, even Rafa's most fervant supporters made light of his accent and curious command of the English language.

Almost every foreign player/manager/coach over the past 10 years have said they havent a clue what Carra is saying.

by **supersub** » Mon Oct 11, 2010 5:31 pm

bigmick wrote:
supersub wrote:
bigmick wrote:It remains to be seen whether or not it was the right move to plump for Roy (or Woy as you and the posse insist on calling him),

It appears that you are the poster who has used the phrase Woy the most on this forum and that the word Wafa is the most re-occurring, mis-pronounced name of any of our former or current managers...I would ask that a little respect be shown to previous and current managers please by posse and non-posse members...whoever they are

Not really sure how to take that one SS. I've NEVER used "Woy" apart from in that post, and I've never used "Wafa" ( I didn't know anybody esle had either to be honest).

Ah well, straight over my head but it's hardly the first time lets be honest.

But bigmick you have used the term Woy many times as if the "Posse" refers to our manager in such a way...as far as Wafa goes , I never said you used that term, I just merely pointed out that it has been in use more than the word Woy and I'm sure it's not the "Posse" that uses such affectionate language for Benitez.......

You do tend to use selective memory when an arguement best suits you, Sir.....but that seems to be the bigmick way :;):

by **Thommo's perm** » Mon Oct 11, 2010 9:44 pm

JBG wrote:Whats the big deal about calling him "Woy" anyways? Its a bit like people who say "Jonathan Woss." Its hardly the worst slur in the world and people also use it as a term of endearment. I remember that Fulham fans used to say it as a sign of affection for their manager.

Its making an issue out of nothing.

Didnt you know? Its a term of endearment. Only people who like the manager call him "Woy" to show their affection for him

tweet tweet mate

:wwww

by **Benny The Noon** » Mon Oct 11, 2010 11:10 pm

You only replace a manager if there is credible improvement available - there was no one better than Rafa available so it was a wrong for him to go and the proof is in the pudding from what we have seen . When you replace a manager with an inferior manager then things get worse and they have got worse - they are facts that cannot be denyed . People said during the summer that rafa should only go if someone better could come in but the reply from certain people was " anyone but rafa " and " plenty managers would come to us " and " plenty managers could easily get us into top 4 " - well guys you got your wish .

by **NANNY RED** » Mon Oct 11, 2010 11:14 pm

Benny The Noon wrote:You only replace a manager if there is credible improvement available - there was no one better than Rafa available so it was a wrong for him to go and the proof is in the pudding from what we have seen . When you replace a manager with an inferior manager then things get worse and they have got worse - they are facts that cannot be denyed . People said during the summer that rafa should only go if someone better could come in but the reply from certain people was " anyone but rafa " and " plenty managers would come to us " and " plenty managers could easily get us into top 4 " - well guys you got your wish .

Is Correctamundo

by **neil** » Mon Oct 11, 2010 11:22 pm

is the fact that we were :censored:

last year- losing 19 times- simply not registering with you guys? no ifs or buts, :censored:

, same as this year, :censored:

, why debate whether last years :censored:

was better than this years :censored:

, both

,

.

by **Thommo's perm** » Mon Oct 11, 2010 11:24 pm

Benny The Noon wrote:You only replace a manager if there is credible improvement available - there was no one better than Rafa available so it was a wrong for him to go and the proof is in the pudding from what we have seen . When you replace a manager with an inferior manager then things get worse and they have got worse - they are facts that cannot be denyed . People said during the summer that rafa should only go if someone better could come in but the reply from certain people was " anyone but rafa " and " plenty managers would come to us " and " plenty managers could easily get us into top 4 " - well guys you got your wish .

Good point
But there is no evidence whatsoever that things would have got better had Benitez stayed. There is more to prove that things would have got worse
This is not a defense of Hodgson, merely a reasonable argument for Benitezes departure

by **Kharhaz** » Mon Oct 11, 2010 11:54 pm

Thommo's perm wrote:
Benny The Noon wrote:You only replace a manager if there is credible improvement available - there was no one better than Rafa available so it was a wrong for him to go and the proof is in the pudding from what we have seen . When you replace a manager with an inferior manager then things get worse and they have got worse - they are facts that cannot be denyed . People said during the summer that rafa should only go if someone better could come in but the reply from certain people was " anyone but rafa " and " plenty managers would come to us " and " plenty managers could easily get us into top 4 " - well guys you got your wish .

Good point
But there is no evidence whatsoever that things would have got better had Benitez stayed. There is more to prove that things would have got worse
This is not a defense of Hodgson, merely a reasonable argument for Benitezes departure

Absolutely. The question would we be worse of if Rafa stayed? well, we have to add in the "would this happen?" question.

Would Gerrard have stayed?

Would Torres?

Would Rafa have signed players of the calibre of Meireles or Cole?

To me the answers to all of the above, are no. Under Rafa the team became stagnant, depressed and boring, and still are under Roy. I hope we do get good investment because the tripe that is at this club currently needs kicking out on their @ss.

by **NANNY RED** » Tue Oct 12, 2010 12:13 am

Would Rafa have signed Cole YES

Would Rafa have signed Konchesky and Poulson , no fecking chance,

Would Stevie and Fernando have stayed, YES .IMO and thats all that he has fell out with this and that peoples opinions, Did any of them ask for a move, NO

by **Kharhaz** » Tue Oct 12, 2010 12:25 am

NANNY RED wrote:Would Rafa have signed Cole YES

Would Rafa have signed Konchesky and Poulson , no fecking chance,

Would Stevie and Fernando have stayed, YES .IMO and thats all that he has fell out with this and that peoples opinions, Did any of them ask for a move, NO

Thats what keeps the forum going. The difference in opinion.

With regards to Poulson, I bet he would. He would be resigned to losing Mascherano and look towards a player who his scouts would recommend.

For me we needed a change, we still do. If Roy carries on with the same stubborn "my tactics work" attitude then all we have done is swapped like for like. And roy should go. However, we should give him the chance. I would say until christmas. If there is no sign of any improvement anywhere on the pitch then he has to go. The club is like a farcical fiction novel at the minute, and Roy shouldn't be made the scapegoat.

Liverpool FC Forum

So after a few months with roy, was sacking rafa - The right thing to do?

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