Liverpool FC Forum

[Fowler_E7]

I think Rafa knows Sissokos short comings just like the rest of us, thats why he signed Mascherano, next season i reckon it will be Sissoko for away games and most European games and Mascherano playing the Domestic home games, and rotated on the away games.

[Earlsy]

Sissoko,or Sudoko as Ray houghtan was calling him the other night on the Irish coverage of the game , is not the next viera or alonso or gerrard or anybody but he will definately improve. He's only 22( i think) and he has had a spate of ridiculous injuries in his  1 and 3 quarter years at the club.From nearly going blind to dislocating his shoulder,all in the space of about 6 months, his luck has been bad. But we all saw what a power house hewas in the first game against Barcelona. He has extendable limbs, he is in perpetual motion and he tackles like a tank. His passing can be shocking, but that is something that will definately improve with a run of games alongside quality passers,which we have in abundance. He either gets hailed as the next Viera or declared not fit to even walk in his shadow. The onlything Vieraand Momo have in common is that their both tall and black, the comparisons should stop there, but they won't so I want reflect on Viera a little.History reckons he arrived to Arsenal as an unknown 21 year old,plucked from the Milan reserves and went on over the next few years to become one of the greatest midfielders the premeirship has ever seen.Wrong! Viera was more eye catching more than impressive from the start, and this was mainly because of his passing style,a.k.a. jamie redknapp style of not being afraid of the ball and spraying it about.He had nothinglike the physical or defensive aspect to his game the same way sissoko does. Viera did'nt become the viera we know today until Petit arrived. Petit was a world class player at his best and his ability and  experience acted as a foil for Viera to develop his confidence and ability. The last memory I have of Viera was french hardman Robert Pires robbinghim of the balland setting fabregas away to bang in the first against juventus  in the quarter final of the champions league.Anyway,goin a bit of the point, we don't need momo to pin the ball fiftyyards or anything like it,I know thats not the complaint,we'd at this stage settle for five yards. I just reckon that he can definitely sharpen up that aspect of his game and  under rafa and I think he will. Again the passes wont be akin the Kaiser's but with a controlled range of passing and improved first touchI think he could become a top,top,defensive midfielder.

[66-1112520797]

Yes, if he learned to have composure we would indeed have a heck of a player on our hands but I don't see that really happening.

If he cannot trap a ball and pass it five yards at this age he's never likely to learn it in 2, 3 or 5 years time.

Don't get me wrong, Momo is a formidable part of our squad and he's a type of player we can use to break up the opposition, but football isn't just about stopping the other team playing. To win Championships you need to go out and be be creative, and with Sissoko in our side for 30 or so league matches, we aren't going to win the league.

I think thats pretty much spot on, he is a vital player to have in the squad when you are playing against top sides away from home.
But when you are dominating posession and need someone with a bit of creativity to unlock tight defences then there is no place for Momo.

He is great at what he does but shouldnt be playing in the majority of games, there are 3 better ball playing centre midfielders at the club.

Its a bit of a catch 22 with Momo, enough people on here say we need him against the likes of United, Chelsea and Arsenal away. Mainly because he's so good at hunting the ball down and doesnt given the opposition time on the ball. Thats true enough, but I'd tend to think the opposite of him, i.e play him against your Boltons your Evertons and the Blackburns of this world.

Against Man U the other day one thing stood out for me about Momo. He cannot pass to save his life, so on one hand you may have him winning the ball but on the other he gives it away very very cheaply. Against top sides like ManU Chelsea and Arsenal the last thing you should be doing is giving the ball away.

I'd have Masch in, instead of Momo against the "bigger" footballing sides. Its all about possesion and what you do with. I mean if you've got Hyypia, Riise or Agger knocking long balls up for the best part of 90 minutes against these sides. Then you have Momo in midfield giving the ball away too. Your hardly ever going to be in possesion of the ball, and sometimes this is why we look a bit like a Bolton side against the the other three as we just pump the long balls. We dont really look like a footballing side. We need players like Alonso on the ball more who can pick a pass and a quality one at that, players who are comfortable in possesion especially against the "bigger"sides.

Momo's game would be better suited to playing the' up em and at em'  teams like Bolton. Where physical grunt is more needed and the football less beautiful so to speak.

[65-1173565005]

Yes, if he learned to have composure we would indeed have a heck of a player on our hands but I don't see that really happening.

If he cannot trap a ball and pass it five yards at this age he's never likely to learn it in 2, 3 or 5 years time.

Don't get me wrong, Momo is a formidable part of our squad and he's a type of player we can use to break up the opposition, but football isn't just about stopping the other team playing. To win Championships you need to go out and be be creative, and with Sissoko in our side for 30 or so league matches, we aren't going to win the league.

I think thats pretty much spot on, he is a vital player to have in the squad when you are playing against top sides away from home.
But when you are dominating posession and need someone with a bit of creativity to unlock tight defences then there is no place for Momo.

He is great at what he does but shouldnt be playing in the majority of games, there are 3 better ball playing centre midfielders at the club.

Its a bit of a catch 22 with Momo, enough people on here say we need him against the likes of United, Chelsea and Arsenal away. Mainly because he's so good at hunting the ball down and doesnt given the opposition time on the ball. Thats true enough, but I'd tend to think the opposite of him, i.e play him against your Boltons your Evertons and the Blackburns of this world.

Against Man U the other day one thing stood out for me about Momo. He cannot pass to save his life, so on one hand you may have him winning the ball but on the other he gives it away very very cheaply. Against top sides like ManU Chelsea and Arsenal the last thing you should be doing is giving the ball away.

I'd have Masch in, instead of Momo against the "bigger" footballing sides. Its all about possesion and what you do with. I mean if you've got Hyypia, Riise or Agger knocking long balls up for the best part of 90 minutes against these sides. Then you have Momo in midfield giving the ball away too. Your hardly ever going to be in possesion of the ball, and sometimes this is why we look a bit like a Bolton side against the the other three as we just pump the long balls. We dont really look like a footballing side. We need players like Alonso on the ball more who can pick a pass and a quality one at that, players who are comfortable in possesion especially against the "bigger"sides.

Momo's game would be better suited to playing the' up em and at em'  teams like Bolton. Where physical grunt is more needed and the football less beautiful so to speak.

sHUT UP YOU KUNT.

[orlandored]

Yes, if he learned to have composure we would indeed have a heck of a player on our hands but I don't see that really happening.

If he cannot trap a ball and pass it five yards at this age he's never likely to learn it in 2, 3 or 5 years time.

Don't get me wrong, Momo is a formidable part of our squad and he's a type of player we can use to break up the opposition, but football isn't just about stopping the other team playing. To win Championships you need to go out and be be creative, and with Sissoko in our side for 30 or so league matches, we aren't going to win the league.

I think thats pretty much spot on, he is a vital player to have in the squad when you are playing against top sides away from home.
But when you are dominating posession and need someone with a bit of creativity to unlock tight defences then there is no place for Momo.

He is great at what he does but shouldnt be playing in the majority of games, there are 3 better ball playing centre midfielders at the club.

Its a bit of a catch 22 with Momo, enough people on here say we need him against the likes of United, Chelsea and Arsenal away. Mainly because he's so good at hunting the ball down and doesnt given the opposition time on the ball. Thats true enough, but I'd tend to think the opposite of him, i.e play him against your Boltons your Evertons and the Blackburns of this world.

Against Man U the other day one thing stood out for me about Momo. He cannot pass to save his life, so on one hand you may have him winning the ball but on the other he gives it away very very cheaply. Against top sides like ManU Chelsea and Arsenal the last thing you should be doing is giving the ball away.

I'd have Masch in, instead of Momo against the "bigger" footballing sides. Its all about possesion and what you do with. I mean if you've got Hyypia, Riise or Agger knocking long balls up for the best part of 90 minutes against these sides. Then you have Momo in midfield giving the ball away too. Your hardly ever going to be in possesion of the ball, and sometimes this is why we look a bit like a Bolton side against the the other three as we just pump the long balls. We dont really look like a footballing side. We need players like Alonso on the ball more who can pick a pass and a quality one at that, players who are comfortable in possesion especially against the "bigger"sides.

Momo's game would be better suited to playing the' up em and at em'  teams like Bolton. Where physical grunt is more needed and the football less beautiful so to speak.

sHUT UP YOU KUNT.

youre adopted arent you

[66-1112520797]

I bumped this to show people my views on Momo ^^ earlier.

[Igor Zidane]

I pretty much agree with bamaga man on this one. I think the debate about momo will be resolved if not this season but certainly next.

Mascherano will imo resolve the debate, because he's gonna be in the middle of the park alot more than momo, he's far more cultured .

For starters he can control a ball and spot a pass when needed, he is also more than capable of doing the dirty work , anyone who's seen him play at his best i.e the world cup can see that. As much as i love momo ,for his work rate and determination , Mascherano will bring far  much more to the team than momo ever will in my opnion. As a well known ex member of the forum used to say , if momo hasn't learned to control and pass a ball by now ,he never will.

[mighty mo]

when mascherano is settled and match fit, momo will not get a look in IMHO,mascherano has over 20 caps for argentina at the age of 22 and was a mainstay of there world cup campaign, he can't be worse than momo.

[Rafa D]

I admit it is going to get very interesting for us over the next 6 months. Momo has been brilliant for us since he came here, he is always chasing and harrying the opposition for the ball and wherever the ball is, you can guarentee that Momo will not be far away. His passing is not the best and he seems to stall on the ball a bit but lets not be too critical of the lad. He is still only 21 years old and he is a monster. He seems very suited to the phyisical side of the Premiership and if you watch our games, when he is missing from the team it takes us a lot longer to get the ball back off the opposition.

He is blowing hot and cold in the last few games, brilliant against barce, terrible against Man Utd. I do think he has a big future at liverpool as every team needs someone like him in there squad.

However the arrival of Maschereno is going to be a ? over Momo's starting place. As someone pointed out, 22 caps at 22 is phenomenol, especially when you consider the quality players Argentina have. He ran the midfield for them at the World Cup and so far the lad looks good. I can see him having a very good season next year. But its a good problem for Rafa to have IMO.

[JC_81]

A few people are being a bit harsh on Momo here imo - especially the analogy used by someone saying he's the 2007 Carlton Palmer, that's way over the top.

There's not a better player in the Premiership at winning the ball, simple as that.  And while he is undoubtedly limited on the ball, he's still very young and I've no doubt that he can be taught to retain the ball better.  He never has to be able to pass it like Alonso, but experience and knowing which pass to play can eventually compensate for his technical deficiencies.  We have to accept that he'll never be a creative or goalscoring midfielder.

I don't think he should start every game for us, especially at Anfield where we are usually on top of teams and don't have such a need for a ball winner.  At home against lesser sides I'd sacrifice him for the more creative Alonso-Gerrard central pair.  But for every away game and every game against the big sides he'd be my first name on the team sheet.

People who don't understand football can criticise his displays against Barce and Man U for losing possession, but those that understand the game can see that his presence, workrate and aggression in the centre allowed us to dominate arguably the best 2 club sides in Europe this season (really pains me to praise the scum here), only for our strikers to let us down and let us end up with two 0-1 defeats.

The reason we aren't going to win the league this season isn't because Sissoko can't pass, it's because our forwards haven't scored enough and neither have the likes of Pennant and Gonzalez who you'd have expected to chip in with a few more.

[66-1112520797]

I'd still stand by my opinion John and its not because I know nothing about football mate. But like I said earlier for me Momo is best deployed against your "typical British" sides like Bolton, Everton and the likes. His physical presence  is most definately needed against sides like that.

Against the bigger sides where domination of possesion is more often than not needed I'd play Gerrard and Xabi. Its almost opposite to what you said. Dont forget both Stevie and Xabi or even Mascha can get stuck in. But at retaining possesion and not giving it away cheaply is a definate need against the likes of United and what not. I dont really see the point in having Momo who is brilliant at winning the ball against them, but in the same breath giving it away unneccessarily. I think possesion is paramount and what you do with it is fundamental to cracking top sides, and also he doesnt offer nowhere near the creativity Gerrard or even Xabi does.

[JC_81]

I'd still stand by my opinion John and its not because I know nothing about football mate. But like I said earlier for me Momo is best deployed against your "typical British" sides like Bolton, Everton and the likes. His physical presence  is most definately needed against sides like that.

Against the bigger sides where domination of possesion is more often than not needed I'd play Gerrard and Xabi. Its almost opposite to what you said. Dont forget both Stevie and Xabi or even Mascha can get stuck in. But at retaining possesion and not giving it away cheaply is a definate need against the likes of United and what not. I dont really see the point in having Momo who is brilliant at winning the ball against them, but in the same breath giving it away unneccessarily. I think possesion is paramount and what you do with it is fundamental to cracking top sides, and also he doesnt offer nowhere near the creativity Gerrard or even Xabi does.

I take your point mate.

I agree possession is paramount, especially against the top sides, but neither Alonso nor Gerrard can stop a team playing like Sissoko can.  I think in the games Sissoko has played this season not only has he stifled the creative talents of our opponents, but even with him in the side we have had more than enough possession of the ball ourselves in order to crate something.

I just think people look at our side and correctly label us as a side that doesn't score enough goals.  But that's not because we (Sissoko) have been giving the ball away cheaply, not dominated possession and therefore not been able to carve out enough chances to win games.  We are a side that always creates chances if you look at it.  But we are a side that lacks strikers that will put teams to the sword.  Even against the top teams at home (Man U then Barce), we have dominated and created chances, with Sissoko in the team, only for us to squander enough chances to win 3 or 4 games.

No one complains that Makelele doesn't score or make chances for Chelsea, yet he still is regarded as the best defensive midfielder around.  And I'm sorry but Vieira was never a great passer of the ball, just economical in his distribution.  We need to put things in perspective, Sissoko is a very good player and we're lucky we have him, even if some areas of his game need fine tuning.

The bottom line is that our strikers are the problem right now and there is still room for improvement down the flanks.  In all other areas of the pitch we are as strong as any side in the world.

[66-1112520797]

The bottom line is that our strikers are the problem right now and there is still room for improvement down the flanks.  In all other areas of the pitch we are as strong as any side in the world.

Good post John and I agree entirely about the flanks and the strikers, but while we're on the subject of Sissoko who is probably one of the least of our positional problems. Its not just creating though that causes the problems when giving possesion away. Its also in our own third, a loose ball can be easily picked up by the likes of Ronaldo (United) Messi (Barca) and in the blink of an eye you could be a goal down. Now that didnt happen in either of those games but it could of a can do if he continues to give possesion away.
I believe the other three of our midfielders are less suceptable to giving the ball away in our own third as they looked much steadier on the ball. Thats all really, the fact he doesnt create much going forward doesnt phase me atall I know his game is all about breaking down attacks, making the challenges and adding energy to the midfield. Which I hold in high regard as a key position, but with that needs to come  the ability of picking a pass. Even if its a simple lay off a-la Hamman would be fine but recently he hasnt shown even the composure to do that, which could be costly.

[JC_81]

the fact he doesnt create much going forward doesnt phase me atall I know his game is all about breaking down attacks, making the challenges and adding energy to the midfield. Which I hold in high regard as a key position, but with that needs to come  the ability of picking a pass. Even if its a simple lay off a-la Hamman would be fine but recently he hasnt shown even the composure to do that, which could be costly.

The point about Hamann is a good one (although Hamann was in fact a very good passer of the ball, long and short).

I'd even look at someone like Neil Lennon for Celtic.  Never scores or creates anything, yet not much gets past him.  He breaks up play, never gives the ball away and gives his team a platform on which to build.  Sissoko could become a better version of that type of player, he has a far better engine, better aerially, better in the tackle and is more aggressive.  He wins tackles he has no right to win.  If you could harness his attributes and add a bit of composure and the ability to know when to just pick a simple pass sideways or back rather than always looking forward, then we'd have a hell of a midfielder.  Thankfully I think Sissoko's shortcomings can be ironed out in training and with experience.

[66-1112520797]

the fact he doesnt create much going forward doesnt phase me atall I know his game is all about breaking down attacks, making the challenges and adding energy to the midfield. Which I hold in high regard as a key position, but with that needs to come  the ability of picking a pass. Even if its a simple lay off a-la Hamman would be fine but recently he hasnt shown even the composure to do that, which could be costly.

The point about Hamann is a good one (although Hamann was in fact a very good passer of the ball, long and short).

I'd even look at someone like Neil Lennon for Celtic.  Never scores or creates anything, yet not much gets past him.  He breaks up play, never gives the ball away and gives his team a platform on which to build.  Sissoko could become a better version of that type of player, he has a far better engine, better aerially, better in the tackle and is more aggressive.  He wins tackles he has no right to win.  If you could harness his attributes and add a bit of composure and the ability to know when to just pick a simple pass sideways or back rather than always looking forward, then we'd have a hell of a midfielder.  Thankfully I think Sissoko's shortcomings can be ironed out in training and with experience.

I hope they can be (ironed out) we'd have one hell of a midfielder on our hands. And the Vieria comparisons would soon come flying back. He is young still and thats something to look forward too. He is still a fantastic buy in my book and I'm glad he's playing on our side than against.