Liverpool FC Forum

by **kazza** » Tue Oct 27, 2009 1:59 pm

The point is benny I do but that is never mentioned. Everytime I reply (which is not as much as is made out) to him I hear this cr@p.

This is not the first time andy made these comments, last time it was to tell me no one likes me and I should feck off, at least this time he said please.

by **andy_g** » Tue Oct 27, 2009 2:09 pm

i really don't want to derail the thread and will shortly get back to copping a little flack from time to time for supporting lucas more than many.

but

kazza - i have nothing at all against you personally and i don't remember saying nobody likes you. how would i know? i also don't think you should feck off. neither do i think you're a meff, just that you often act like one. i can understand you having a point of view opposed to that of mick's and there is nothing wrong with that. but instead of engaging him in an argument you often seem to pop up in threads having a dig at him, his credentials, his standing as a fan, and his personality in general. what's the friggin point?

mick's a good poster and he knows his football. he's not getting carried away by a great defeat and still wants to point out that there are maybe better managers and better teams out there and that we still need to buck our ideas up if we want to make something of this season. where's the problem with that? i also happen to think that mick has gone off the ball at about the same time as the team. where once his posts were full of interesting points they now contain repetitive statements and subtle digs at other posters - and can't say i blame him for that to be honest after the way some people carp on at him like he was some kind of forum poison.

at least he's talking football in football threads though. plenty of others disagree with him and his writing style but at least they counter it by using their brains and thinking a little. all you're doing the vast majority of the time is having a pop. it might be fun for you but i don't think it is for anybody else.

by **LFC2007** » Tue Oct 27, 2009 2:13 pm

That's an awfully serious post Andy

by **JamCar05** » Tue Oct 27, 2009 2:59 pm

To answer the question beneath the thread title: yes, he really is from Brazil. Now, can be please close this thread (I honestly can't believe it has taken 106 pages to answer this rather simple question)

Oh, and the boy did very well against the mancs me thinks.

by **stmichael** » Tue Oct 27, 2009 3:53 pm

Like I've said in the past, I'd probably compare Lucas to Darren Fletcher in that they both excelled at a very young age and were getting plenty of plaudits for a number of commanding performances, partly do their natural ability and partly down to their presence and leadership.

Then when they made the step up they went through a period of their careers when they struggled to make the step up against the majority of teams they played against and drew a lot of criticism from their own fans as much as anyone. Then at around the age of 21 they both started gaining plaudits for great performances in the big games.

Darren Fletcher built on that, and although fans continued to get on his back while he was building on it, he finally came out of his shell two years later, at the age of 23, and started putting in commanding performances against all teams. Lucas is only at this stage now.

by **Reg** » Tue Oct 27, 2009 3:59 pm

LFC2007 wrote:Mick will be along shortly to pronounce the absolute truth on the matter.

But will it be a one liner? :eyebrow

by **made in UK** » Wed Oct 28, 2009 7:25 am

Talking of Lucas, I still don't rate him. He had a 'decent' game against the Mancs not brilliant though far from it. What we saw from Lucas on Sunday is probably the most (ability wise) we're ever likely to get from him.

by **account deleted by request** » Wed Oct 28, 2009 8:01 am

made in UK wrote:Talking of Lucas, I still don't rate him. He had a 'decent' game against the Mancs not brilliant though far from it. What we saw from Lucas on Sunday is probably the most (ability wise) we're ever likely to get from him.

I agree he doesn't look like he is ever going to be "THE BRAZILIAN" that we hoped for, but he is a useful squad player.

The worrying thing for me is that the mancs had more possession during the game even without playing a ball winner in midfield. (Fletcher/Hargreaves/Anderson) Admittedly they did little with it, while we created much more with lesser possession, but I still think its a concern especially at home.

It may also be the answer to why he had a reasonable game, as the physical side of his game wasn't too exposed.

by **made in UK** » Wed Oct 28, 2009 8:08 am

s@int wrote:
made in UK wrote:Talking of Lucas, I still don't rate him. He had a 'decent' game against the Mancs not brilliant though far from it. What we saw from Lucas on Sunday is probably the most (ability wise) we're ever likely to get from him.

I agree he doesn't look like he is ever going to be "THE BRAZILIAN" that we hoped for, but he is a useful squad player.

The worrying thing for me is that the mancs had more possession during the game even without playing a ball winner in midfield. (Fletcher/Hargreaves/Anderson) Admittedly they did little with it, while we created much more with lesser possession, but I still think its a concern especially at home.

It may also be the answer to why he had a reasonable game, as the physical side of his game wasn't too exposed.

His physical appearance was exposed though, he looks like Craig Bellamy's love child.

You're probably right there about the fact they didn't have a ball winner in midfield. Also he didn't have to contend with a powerhouse like Essein who maraudes through midfield like a man posessed.

But as the old saying goes, you can only play whats put infront of you and Lucas did that. Man.U (scholes or carrick) didn't have the legs and and grunt to worry Lucas too much. That oddly enough will be one of his 'easier' tests this season I think.

by **bigmick** » Wed Oct 28, 2009 9:00 am

In many ways, because you know it will start a flame war with people saying you are "playing down" our victory nobody has actually discussed how bad the Mancs were. I thought they absolutely stunk the place out, were awful and it was as insipid a performance by them as I can remember. Before anyone says it, yes I do think the way we played disrupted them, yes I think we deserve all the credit, yes the manager got the players up for it, no I'm not saying Acrington Stanley could have beat them etc etc etc.

Anyway, back to the point. They will have come into the game knowing that a draw would have killed us off. Eight points behind Chelsea and seven behind the Mancs would have left it all over for us. A defeat could concieveably (for all we know) have seen the manager come under unbearable pressure. Ferguson would have known this, they would have known this, and given that I couldn't believe their lack of urgency. I didn't think they were particularly good before the match, but I did expect them to fight for the result.

I had a quick look on the Betfair earlier and we are 12/1 for the title as of now, it would have been 40/1 had they got a draw, and 150/1 had they beat us. It really was an extremely strange performance by them, and indicative IMHo of a team which lacks leadership. I really do think that unless they spend big in January, they won't go that close to winning the league.

by **Benny The Noon** » Wed Oct 28, 2009 10:38 am

bigmick wrote:In many ways, because you know it will start a flame war with people saying you are "playing down" our victory nobody has actually discussed how bad the Mancs were. I thought they absolutely stunk the place out, were awful and it was as insipid a performance by them as I can remember. Before anyone says it, yes I do think the way we played disrupted them, yes I think we deserve all the credit, yes the manager got the players up for it, no I'm not saying Acrington Stanley could have beat them etc etc etc.

Anyway, back to the point. They will have come into the game knowing that a draw would have killed us off. Eight points behind Chelsea and seven behind the Mancs would have left it all over for us. A defeat could concieveably (for all we know) have seen the manager come under unbearable pressure. Ferguson would have known this, they would have known this, and given that I couldn't believe their lack of urgency. I didn't think they were particularly good before the match, but I did expect them to fight for the result.

I had a quick look on the Betfair earlier and we are 12/1 for the title as of now, it would have been 40/1 had they got a draw, and 150/1 had they beat us. It really was an extremely strange performance by them, and indicative IMHo of a team which lacks leadership. I really do think that unless they spend big in January, they won't go that close to winning the league.

And as for Lucas Bigmick as its a Lucas thread :;):

by **stmichael** » Wed Oct 28, 2009 3:04 pm

What I've noticed aswell is he seems to perform when his midfield partner is also playing well. Mascherano played well on Sunday and we saw Lucas have a great game. It was the same last year, if Mascherano had a stinker by his standards (which he did plenty of last year and some of this), Lucas was similarly poor. This may be due to Lucas' limitations at the moment. Whilst he's played well at times he's not yet stamped his authority on a match and can't yet take the responsibility to cover somebody who's having an off game.

I'm not sure that it's nailed on that Lucas will be the player to make way when Aquilani is chosen either. Maybe for the bigger games when you need the experience and toughness of Masch, but against some of the lesser sides Lucas could be more than adequate. There's the question of whether Aquilani will make the grade too.

Whilst Mascherano has been immense for much of his time here, his temperament can let him down at times. Lucas managed to get away without a card on Sunday, despite being penalised for a number of fouls. He seems to clear off quite sharpish without making a fuss which is a clever way to go about things.

by **JamCar05** » Wed Oct 28, 2009 3:33 pm

stmichael wrote:Like I've said in the past, I'd probably compare Lucas to Darren Fletcher in that they both excelled at a very young age and were getting plenty of plaudits for a number of commanding performances, partly do their natural ability and partly down to their presence and leadership.

Then when they made the step up they went through a period of their careers when they struggled to make the step up against the majority of teams they played against and drew a lot of criticism from their own fans as much as anyone. Then at around the age of 21 they both started gaining plaudits for great performances in the big games.

Darren Fletcher built on that, and although fans continued to get on his back while he was building on it, he finally came out of his shell two years later, at the age of 23, and started putting in commanding performances against all teams. Lucas is only at this stage now.

Do you per chance read Redcafe (manc forum) once in a while Mike? Because I was reading a bit there after our win to see their reactions (I was at work and very bored ok

), and someone wrote almost exactly the same in a thread called "Anderson Vs Lucas" (just a wee hour prior to your post on here)

Here it is (the highlighted part):

Yesterday, 14:02 #606 (permalink)
Brwned
First Team Regular
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Jairzinho: "When the ball is at Ronaldo’s feet it’s like the team has already scored half a goal." Zidane: "Scholes is undoubtedly the best midfielder of his generation."
Posts: 21,345

Lucas has excelled against us (twice), Arsenal and Chelsea, all in the space of 12 months and at the age of 22 that's an impressive feat.

Like I've been saying for a while, compare him to Fletcher.

They both excelled at a very young age and were getting plenty of plaudits for a number of commanding performances, partly do their natural ability and partly down to their presence and leadership.

Then when they made the step up they went through a period of their careers when they struggled to make the step up against the majority of teams they played against and drew a lot of criticism from their own fans as much as anyone. Then at around the age of 21 they both started gaining plaudits for great performances in the big games.

Darren Fletcher built on that, and although fans continued to get on his back while he was building on it, he finally came out of his shell two years later, at the age of 23, and started putting in commanding performances against all teams. Lucas is only at this stage now.

Obviously all players progress differently, but he might well go on to be their Darren Fletcher and a lot of people will look very silly for calling him a poor player, or even worse to say 'he's not better than Greening', in a couple of years.

http://www.redcafe.net/f7/anderson-vs-lucas178762/index16.html

------------------------------------------
A bit uncanny the resemblance :lookaround

Anyway, not meaning to have a dig at you or anything, I just think it is fair to credit your sources if indeed that's where you've got it from.

by **andy_g** » Wed Oct 28, 2009 3:58 pm

uh oh

by **account deleted by request** » Wed Oct 28, 2009 5:12 pm

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