Liverpool FC Forum

by **Dundalk** » Mon Dec 08, 2008 1:14 am

Fo Dne wrote:
Dundalk wrote:
LegBarnes wrote:If i say you got torres that is 190/200 I say owen is a 185/200 player and defo is around 165/200. ok understand my scaling ?

Maybe his day he might be up there but lets face it his day is well and truly over.

So out of 200 you are giving Nando 190. He is currently the best forward in World football and has just won the Euro 2008 with Spain, scoring the winning goal in the final.

You then mark Owen only 5 points behind this man??

Fabio Cappello must be a very stupid man - he has a player who is fit and almost as good as the Fernando Torres and he STILL wont pick him

But he will pick Defoe

Oh get your own opinion for sake. No-one gives a toss about some bloody italian managing a team hardly anyone on here gives a flying one about. Defoe is nowhere near as good as Owen, never has been, never will be. FACT!

Can you not read?

by **Fo Dne** » Mon Dec 08, 2008 1:31 am

john craig wrote:Owen is definitely one of the players we should be looking at in January (if we have any money at all that is).

Other players we should be taking into consideration imo are:

Valencia
Guttierez (quality imo - I know he isn't long signed for Newcastle though)
Martins
Gudjohnson (cu.nt but a good player)
Heinze
Tuncay (very underrated imo)
Eboue (not long on his contract, far from flavour of the month at Arsenal, but still quality when actually played in his best position, which is right back)
Benny McCarthy (Out of the team at Blackburn, but has proved can score goals in the Premiership and could be a decent short term signing)

A controversial list, but we have to be fairly realistic. Personally I don't think Rafa will be allowed to bring anyone in unless he sells. Ideally he'd like to offload Pennant I reckon. If he doesn't then I can't see us getting anyone. Despite his injuries and the history I have to agree Owen would probably be the best deal we could hope for in January, but he would have to take a massive wage cut and I just can't see it.

Valencia, absoloute no no. Nowhere near good enough. Wright-Phillips is twice the player and I wouldn't thank you for him so Valencia's a definate no for me.

Martins I wouldn't touch with a barge pole. A decent player, not a great one, much in the mould of Yakubu. Another player for me who'd be found out at Liverpool.

McCarthy, absoloutely not. Again like Valencia is rediculously overated. Decent at best.

Tuncay, underated, has quality. Wouldn't agree though. Although I think he's more suited than the other players you mentioned simply because he has technique and intelligence which is something that Liverpool fans especially seem to pick up on.

Gudjohnson, would have him all day. But would Rafa? Probably not. We've got Kuyt after all!

by **Kharhaz** » Mon Dec 08, 2008 1:48 am

Fo Dne wrote:
john craig wrote:Owen is definitely one of the players we should be looking at in January (if we have any money at all that is).

Other players we should be taking into consideration imo are:

Valencia
Guttierez (quality imo - I know he isn't long signed for Newcastle though)
Martins
Gudjohnson (cu.nt but a good player)
Heinze
Tuncay (very underrated imo)
Eboue (not long on his contract, far from flavour of the month at Arsenal, but still quality when actually played in his best position, which is right back)
Benny McCarthy (Out of the team at Blackburn, but has proved can score goals in the Premiership and could be a decent short term signing)

A controversial list, but we have to be fairly realistic. Personally I don't think Rafa will be allowed to bring anyone in unless he sells. Ideally he'd like to offload Pennant I reckon. If he doesn't then I can't see us getting anyone. Despite his injuries and the history I have to agree Owen would probably be the best deal we could hope for in January, but he would have to take a massive wage cut and I just can't see it.

Valencia, absoloute no no. Nowhere near good enough. Wright-Phillips is twice the player and I wouldn't thank you for him so Valencia's a definate no for me.

Martins I wouldn't touch with a barge pole. A decent player, not a great one, much in the mould of Yakubu. Another player for me who'd be found out at Liverpool.

McCarthy, absoloutely not. Again like Valencia is rediculously overated. Decent at best.

Tuncay, underated, has quality. Wouldn't agree though. Although I think he's more suited than the other players you mentioned simply because he has technique and intelligence which is something that Liverpool fans especially seem to pick up on.

Gudjohnson, would have him all day. But would Rafa? Probably not. We've got Kuyt after all!

And therein lies the basis of the owen debate. Some will, some wont. The fact that you would take Gudjohnson "All day", I wouldnt, the fact that you mentioned Kuyt in the same sentence, would Gudjohnson be a poor mans Kuyt?

You asked the question about whether we should sign owen back, and opinions were given. Accept that there is a difference of opinion, you would accept Owen back, I for one wouldnt, you put that its down to me "the only thing you're worried about is the amount of game time Kuyt won't get if we sign Owen", no it isnt, far from it. Its down to Owen being constantly injured, in it for the money and the fact that, whoever he is under contract with doesnt matter with him. Yes he could be available and is stalling with Newcastle, he has done it to us, and im not as forgiving. Nor will the Newcastle fans be when he signs for another club able to match his wages. He is no longer Liverpool FC material. You have players like Torres taking a paycut to join us, with Owen you wouldnt get that. With Owen you would get, injuries, high wage expenditure and regret, the latter being one we have suffered before.

Try to belittle my opinion all you like, the facts are there, and also as Reg highlighted, in his last couple of seasons for us he was poor. It still stands, signing Owen would be a bad move.

by **Dundalk** » Mon Dec 08, 2008 1:51 am

Couldnt agree more Kharhaz

by **bigmick** » Mon Dec 08, 2008 2:00 am

Well as I've said on another thread, if we don't sign Owen then we've certainly got to sign somebody else IMHO. We currently only have two strikers in the managers eyes, Keane and Torres. Whatever anybody thinks about Babel, he clearly isn't going to get a game up top so you can't count him. Equally, only an extreme optimist would count on Egg Nog making any meaningful contributions anytime soon, while once again whatever anyone thinks of Kuyt, he is our right midfielder in our current strongest team.

Usually teams have four viable strikers, and we currently have two if we're honest. One of those is injured short to medium term, and one of them is about as much use as me based on current form. My feeling is that we actually need two strikers, but one in January is an actual minimum to my mind. Given the fact (hopefully) that we are going to be in the thick of a title race with "win every match" pressure on our shoulders, I can't really think of anyone better than Owen who will be available at the price to be perfectly honest. I know some fans (myself included sometimes) can't forgive him for the way he fecked off, but this is our first title challenge for fecking ages and I for one am prepared to put all that aside if it means we can bring the title home (like Owen will give a feck what I think but you know what I mean

)

The flies in the ointment are obviously his wages, but I am always one to harbour silly feelings about the goodness in all human spirit. Surely given the cash he's made it wouldn't be beyond the realms of possibility for him to try and get by on 50 grand a week or so. I know it's a pittance and all that but I'd have a go at it for a week or two if he doesn't fancy it. The other stumbling block is how often he's going to play. It appears to me that our very best team probably only includes one striker, and that's going to be Torres. That said, given the Spaniards fragility (and indeed Owens) there's a fair chance that on the occasions either of them are fit, they'll be able to get a game.

I think it makes sense to all concerned and I'd go for it. I like Johns list, and particularly Tuncay who I think will move onto much bigger and better things than Middlesboro before too much longer.

by **bigmick** » Mon Dec 08, 2008 2:30 am

No doubt it's been mentioned on the thread already that we have a couple of ex strikers in the Premiership at the moment that I would take all day long at the club, both as back ups and first choices. Peter Crouch scored again at the Weekend and after a sluggish start now has 7 league goals in Fifteen matches I think it is. Not bad for a striker in a non top four team, and I have no doubt that he'll continue to score on a regular basis, as indeed he would have done at Liverpool had he played more regularly.

Djibril Cisse (don't laugh) looks like a player who has developed a fair bit to me. He is moving better, more intelligently and opening the door for the pass much better. He still posesses absolutely blistering pace, is finsihig with more consideration and as a third choice off the bench striker I'd have him back absolutely all day long. I know I would be in the significant minority (probably of one) in that opinion, but I am absolutely convinced that such an impact player would be worth his wieght in gold should we to the run-in still in contention. We really are in one of those situations where you could sign an Owen or a Cisse for a couple of mill' and they could literally pay back their transfer fee with one significant contribution.

DISCLAIMER-I AM NOT SAYING WE SHOULD RE-SIGN CROUCH NECESSARILY, NOR THAT WE SHOULD BUST THE BANK TO SIGN CISSE. NEITHER AM I SAYING WE SHOULD SELL TORRES TO FUND THE TWO PURCHASES, GIVE BABLE AWAY FREE, SACK RAFA FOR SELLING CROUCH, MAKE LUCAS CAPTAIN OR ANYTHING SIMILARLY OFF THE WALL.

by **Octsky** » Mon Dec 08, 2008 2:36 am

for the right price 2-3 mil, rafa and sammy will be crazy not to consider bringing owen back,
i bet they are discussing it right now! so it may very likely happen.
well, we can give the deggen a 2 mil signing on fee, i dont see why we cant spend it on owen.

by **Bad Bob** » Mon Dec 08, 2008 3:33 am

I can't help but think of the job Larsson did for the Mancs a few seasons back when he arrived in January (or was it delayed until Feb.?). Anyway, a seasoned veteran who knew his trade and who was content to play a supporting role in a title run. It was a savvy bit of business to bring him in and that's the kind of business we need to be thinking about doing in January. As many have said, Owen's always in amongst the goals, knows how to perform in the league and is probably one of the few proven quality strikers we can realistically afford. It just makes sense to me to let bygones be bygones and take a punt.

by **LegBarnes** » Mon Dec 08, 2008 6:12 am

Bad Bob wrote:I can't help but think of the job Larsson did for the Mancs a few seasons back when he arrived in January (or was it delayed until Feb.?). Anyway, a seasoned veteran who knew his trade and who was content to play a supporting role in a title run. It was a savvy bit of business to bring him in and that's the kind of business we need to be thinking about doing in January. As many have said, Owen's always in amongst the goals, knows how to perform in the league and is probably one of the few proven quality strikers we can realistically afford. It just makes sense to me to let bygones be bygones and take a punt.

Spot on.

by **Bermenstein** » Mon Dec 08, 2008 8:33 am

I've already said "no" to Owen coming back, because it seems almost imposible that Rafa will U-turn his decision on him.

But If I was to flick SKysports news on in early January to see the headline "Liverpool sign Michael Owen", I reckon I would be happy. Just like when Robbie Fowler re-signed it was a total surprise and there was a buzz about his return. I know they left in different circumstances though......

by **The_Rock** » Mon Dec 08, 2008 10:10 am

Bermenstein wrote:I've already said "no" to Owen coming back, because it seems almost imposible that Rafa will U-turn his decision on him.

But If I was to flick SKysports news on in early January to see the headline "Liverpool sign Michael Owen", I reckon I would be happy. Just like when Robbie Fowler resigned it was a total surprise and there was a buzz about his return. I know they left in different circumstances though......

Precisely........

Fowler was a big reason why we got the records points tally under benitez a couple of seasons ago..If i am not wrong, he scored couple of winners (thus turning potential goaless draws into wins).

I am sure owen could do a similar job.

Rooney is gonna be suspended for manure next match...but they got tevez to back him up.

When torres is injured we play Kuyt as a lone striker.....

See the difference...

by **neil** » Mon Dec 08, 2008 10:38 am

Kharhaz wrote:
Fo Dne wrote:
john craig wrote:Owen is definitely one of the players we should be looking at in January (if we have any money at all that is).

Other players we should be taking into consideration imo are:

Valencia
Guttierez (quality imo - I know he isn't long signed for Newcastle though)
Martins
Gudjohnson (cu.nt but a good player)
Heinze
Tuncay (very underrated imo)
Eboue (not long on his contract, far from flavour of the month at Arsenal, but still quality when actually played in his best position, which is right back)
Benny McCarthy (Out of the team at Blackburn, but has proved can score goals in the Premiership and could be a decent short term signing)

A controversial list, but we have to be fairly realistic. Personally I don't think Rafa will be allowed to bring anyone in unless he sells. Ideally he'd like to offload Pennant I reckon. If he doesn't then I can't see us getting anyone. Despite his injuries and the history I have to agree Owen would probably be the best deal we could hope for in January, but he would have to take a massive wage cut and I just can't see it.

Valencia, absoloute no no. Nowhere near good enough. Wright-Phillips is twice the player and I wouldn't thank you for him so Valencia's a definate no for me.

Martins I wouldn't touch with a barge pole. A decent player, not a great one, much in the mould of Yakubu. Another player for me who'd be found out at Liverpool.

McCarthy, absoloutely not. Again like Valencia is rediculously overated. Decent at best.

Tuncay, underated, has quality. Wouldn't agree though. Although I think he's more suited than the other players you mentioned simply because he has technique and intelligence which is something that Liverpool fans especially seem to pick up on.

Gudjohnson, would have him all day. But would Rafa? Probably not. We've got Kuyt after all!

And therein lies the basis of the owen debate. Some will, some wont. The fact that you would take Gudjohnson "All day", I wouldnt, the fact that you mentioned Kuyt in the same sentence, would Gudjohnson be a poor mans Kuyt?

You asked the question about whether we should sign owen back, and opinions were given. Accept that there is a difference of opinion, you would accept Owen back, I for one wouldnt, you put that its down to me "the only thing you're worried about is the amount of game time Kuyt won't get if we sign Owen", no it isnt, far from it. Its down to Owen being constantly injured, in it for the money and the fact that, whoever he is under contract with doesnt matter with him. Yes he could be available and is stalling with Newcastle, he has done it to us, and im not as forgiving. Nor will the Newcastle fans be when he signs for another club able to match his wages. He is no longer Liverpool FC material. You have players like Torres taking a paycut to join us, with Owen you wouldnt get that. With Owen you would get, injuries, high wage expenditure and regret, the latter being one we have suffered before.

Try to belittle my opinion all you like, the facts are there, and also as Reg highlighted, in his last couple of seasons for us he was poor. It still stands, signing Owen would be a bad move.

/\ /\ /\ /\
what he said.

by **stmichael** » Mon Dec 08, 2008 1:25 pm

28 goals in 50 starts for a rubbish team like Newcastle. Everyone makes excuses for Keane and Kuyt when they don't score, saying they haven't had good enough service. Well don't tell me Owen regularly gets better service playing up front for that shower of no hopers than our strikers get at Liverpool. Cast iron, guaranteed goals for a ridiculously low fee. No brainer for me. The priority is winning the title and he would improve our chances of doing so.

by **Sabre** » Mon Dec 08, 2008 1:36 pm

bigmick wrote:Djibril Cisse (don't laugh) looks like a player who has developed a fair bit to me. He is moving better, more intelligently and opening the door for the pass much better. He still posesses absolutely blistering pace, is finsihig with more consideration and as a third choice off the bench striker I'd have him back absolutely all day long.

I laugh because bear in mind I haven't seen the lad much since he left, I just remember him at home.

But tell me, would Cisse accept a secondary role? and would he be ready to show that improvement if he's not given week in, week out football?

I know Owen would because he did that at Real Madrid and everytime he was given a chance to play he scored.

by **neil** » Mon Dec 08, 2008 1:41 pm

owens panicking about not being in the england squad, thats the only team he cares about.

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