Liverpool FC Forum

by **big al** » Fri Feb 15, 2008 3:07 am

oops sorry 4 more years, 4 more years, 4 more years

by **god_bless_john_houlding** » Fri Feb 15, 2008 3:09 am

Yes and now Dirk Kuyt is in the team, therefore today's squad is sh!t I assume?

by **LFC2007** » Fri Feb 15, 2008 3:28 am

For a start four of those you placed a * next to, were signed by Houllier, and it's absolutely pointless putting in those who are primarily reserve team players because they've barely, if at all, played and are still young. Alonso is a top quality player, Carson's a decent keeper, Itandje's new and he's only a backup anyway, Benayoun's a more than capable squad player at least.

Of the players you cite, you only really have a case for saying the signings of Voronin, Kuyt and Aurelio are 'Rafa's fault' as it were, IMO.

Houllier signed more turkeys than Rafa has and Rafa's signed better quality players overall.

Anyway, comparing managers is a pointless exercise.

by **god_bless_john_houlding** » Fri Feb 15, 2008 3:42 am

LFC2007 wrote:For a start four of those you placed a * next to, were signed by Houllier, and it's absolutely pointless putting in those who are primarily reserve team players because they've barely, if at all, played and are still young. Alonso is a top quality player, Carson's a decent keeper, Itandje's new and he's only a backup anyway, Benayoun's a more than capable squad player at least.

Of the players you cite, you only really have a case for saying the signings of Voronin, Kuyt and Aurelio are 'Rafa's fault' as it were, IMO.

Houllier signed more turkeys than Rafa has and Rafa's signed better quality players overall.

Anyway, comparing managers is a pointless exercise.

I haven't picked to sell any of the kids for the reason you pointed out. The Houllier signings aren't now worth a place in our squad (maybe the exception of Finnan and Hyypia while injuries and hitting) Alonso I'd sell because I want consistancy next year and a settled side. My two in the middle are Gerrard and Mascheranho with Lucas breaking through. I don't see a palce for Alonso so I'd sell him while we can still get a fair whack for him. Intandje I don't see the point in. He's no better than Martin. Good enough back up, but so is Martin, so I could easily flog Intandje. Benayoun I agree is good enough for squad, but I think we could do better and next season in a settled season they'd be rumours he wants out, because he certainly wouldn't be first choice. Kuyt/Voronin/Aurellio are all a waste of time and we'd be lucky to get 10 million back for the three (that's how much they cost all together considering two were frees)

Houllier made PLENTY of :censored:

ups, there's no questioning that. As has Benitez, and every other manager, because as I've stated somewhere else, NO MANAGER GETS IT RIGHT ALL THE TIME. But the ones Houllier got it right with, have been great signings for this club in recent years. They're wasn't many in betwee with him, Houllier's signings were great or awful. I could rattle off the good to bad but that would be time consuming and wasteful.

Like you said as a tongue in cheek to me "comparing managers is pointless"

by **Lando_Griffin** » Fri Feb 15, 2008 3:45 am

LFC2007 wrote:For a start four of those you placed a * next to, were signed by Houllier, and it's absolutely pointless putting in those who are primarily reserve team players because they've barely, if at all, played and are still young. Alonso is a top quality player, Carson's a decent keeper, Itandje's new and he's only a backup anyway, Benayoun's a more than capable squad player at least.

Of the players you cite, you only really have a case for saying the signings of Voronin, Kuyt and Aurelio are 'Rafa's fault' as it were, IMO.

Houllier signed more turkeys than Rafa has and Rafa's signed better quality players overall.

Anyway, comparing managers is a pointless exercise.

And 2 of those 3 were free...

by **LFC2007** » Fri Feb 15, 2008 3:48 am

Houllier's signings:

Jean Michel Ferri
Frode Kippe
Rigobert Song
Djimi Traore
Sami Hyypia
Vladimir Smicer
Titi Camara
Stephane Henchoz
Sander Westerveld
Erik Meijer
Dietmar Hamann
Emile Heskey
Bernard Diomede
Gary McAllister
Markus Babbel
Pegguy Arphexad
Nick Barmby
Christian Ziege
Gregory Vignal
Daniel Sjolund
Igor Biscan
Jari Litmanen
John Arne Riise
Milan Baros
Chris Kirkland
Jerzy Dudek
Nicolas Anelka (loan)
Abel Xavier
Bruno Cheyrou
El Hadji Diouf
Alou Diarra
Patrice Luzi
Salif Diao Sedan
Steve Finnan Fulham
Anthony Le Tallec
Florent S Pongolle
Harry Kewell
Carl Medjani
Paul Jones
Djibril Cissé

Rafa's signings:

Josemi Rey
Antonio Nunez
Xabi Alonso
Luis Garcia
Mauricio Pellegrino
Fernando Morientes
Scott Carson
Josh Mimms
Antonio Barragan
Boudewijn Zenden
Jose Reina Villareal
Mohamed Sissoko
Peter Crouch
Godwin Antwi
Miki Roque
Jack Hobbs
Besian Idrizaj
Ramon Calliste
Mark Gonzalez
Paul Anderson
Jan Kromkamp
Daniel Agger
David Martin
Robbie Fowler
Craig Bellamy
Gabriel Paletta
Fábio Aurélio
Jermaine Pennant
Dirk Kuyt Feyenoord
Nabil El Zhar
Astrit Ajdarevic
Daniele Padelli
Jordy Brouwer
Francisco Durán
Ronald Huth
Álvaro Arbeloa
Javier Mascherano
Lucas Pezzini Leiva Gremio
Mikel San José Domínguez
Sebastian Leto
Fernando Torres
Andriy Voronin
Yossi Benayoun
Ryan Babel
Charles Itandje
Emiliano Insúa
Martin Skrtel

by **god_bless_john_houlding** » Fri Feb 15, 2008 3:55 am

Houllier's signings (good buys IMO represented by a *)

Jean Michel Ferri
Frode Kippe
Rigobert Song
Djimi Traore
Sami Hyypia *
Vladimir Smicer * (scored some important goals, sort of Garcia mould about him)
Titi Camara *
Stephane Henchoz *
Sander Westerveld *
Erik Meijer
Dietmar Hamann *
Emile Heskey * (first season was unplayable, until Houllier got him on the left and right wing)
Bernard Diomede
Gary McAllister *
Markus Babbel *
Pegguy Arphexad
Nick Barmby *
Christian Ziege *
Gregory Vignal
Daniel Sjolund
Igor Biscan
Jari Litmanen *
John Arne Riise * (in his ealier days)
Milan Baros *
Chris Kirkland *
Jerzy Dudek * (to some extent)
Nicolas Anelka (loan) *
Abel Xavier
Bruno Cheyrou
El Hadji Diouf
Alou Diarra
Patrice Luzi
Salif Diao Sedan
Steve Finnan Fulham *
Anthony Le Tallec
Florent S Pongolle *
Harry Kewell
Carl Medjani
Paul Jones
Djibril Cissé * (to some extent)

by **god_bless_john_houlding** » Fri Feb 15, 2008 3:59 am

Rafa's signings (good ones represented by a star again)

Josemi Rey
Antonio Nunez
Xabi Alonso **
Luis Garcia * (yossi type)
Mauricio Pellegrino
Fernando
Scott Carson
Josh Mimms
Antonio Barragan
Boudewijn Zenden
Jose Reina Villareal ***
Mohamed Sissoko
Peter Crouch *
Godwin Antwi
Miki Roque
Jack Hobbs * (future Liverpool captain)
Besian Idrizaj
Ramon Calliste
Mark Gonzalez
Paul Anderson
Jan Kromkamp
Daniel Agger *****
David Martin
Robbie Fowler
Craig Bellamy * (same as Cisse in the Houllier signings bit)
Gabriel Paletta
Fábio Aurélio
Jermaine Pennant *
Dirk Kuyt Feyenoord
Nabil El Zhar
Astrit Ajdarevic
Daniele Padelli
Jordy Brouwer
Francisco Durán
Ronald Huth
Álvaro Arbeloa*
Javier Mascherano **
Lucas Pezzini Leiva Gremio **
Mikel San José Domínguez
Sebastian Leto
Fernando Torres ***
Andriy Voronin
Yossi Benayoun * (for the money has been a good buy)
Ryan Babel *
Charles Itandje
Emiliano Insúa * (possible, not guranteed to be a star)
Martin Skrtel * (promising signs)

I've tried not to go on the kids as it's impossible to tell if they're good signings or not, but Insua has impressed me.

by **god_bless_john_houlding** » Fri Feb 15, 2008 4:00 am

Overall Daniel Agger has got my vote as the best signing between the two, who's surprised there

by **LFC2007** » Fri Feb 15, 2008 4:03 am

by **god_bless_john_houlding** » Fri Feb 15, 2008 4:06 am

Fair enough, Carson deserves a star and I think he would of been a great keeper for us, if we didn't have Reina.

by **Bad Bob** » Fri Feb 15, 2008 4:06 am

god_bless_john_houlding wrote:Overall Daniel Agger has got my vote as the best signing between the two, who's surprised there

Better than Torres?

by **god_bless_john_houlding** » Fri Feb 15, 2008 4:09 am

Bad Bob wrote:
god_bless_john_houlding wrote:Overall Daniel Agger has got my vote as the best signing between the two, who's surprised there

Better than Torres?

At the moment yes Bob. Agger cost us a quater of what Torres did and has paid us back ten times over his price tag already. If Torres fu.cks off in the summer with Benitez then it's 20 million+ for one season.

If Torres remains with us for 4/5 years (at least) then he'll obviously go down as the better of the signings, but at the moment for me it is Agger.

by **The_Rock** » Fri Feb 15, 2008 4:43 am

FWIW....i think reina has been rafa's best signing...pound for pound.

I can safely say reina is the best goalkeeper in this world....He is just good in everything. Catching the ball....coming out for crosses...saving penalities...doubling as a sweeper ...throwing the ball to launch a counter-attack.

The other world class keepers have their weakness.....
Czech - not good in stopping penalities compared to reina
Casillas - dracula ....scared of crosses

vander sar - too old

so he is better than agger and torres IMO.....

by **god_bless_john_houlding** » Fri Feb 15, 2008 4:56 am

Good point Rock, Reina could be the greatest buy for Benitez. But being such a huge fan of Agger he wins the award for me

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