Liverpool FC Forum

by **Ola Mr Benitez** » Wed Jun 21, 2006 9:57 pm

43% of goals in a major tournament are scored from set plays..

Beckham may not have scored many direct free kicks in an England shirt but he has scored a few this year for Real Madrid. Not only that, if you look at our qualifying games plenty of goals came from Beckham re-starts.

As Bad Bob has said you can't blame Englands slump in form down to Beckham. Have a look at Sven, he is the one who has made this world cup so hard for England. Bad squad choice, no plan b and no passion from the bench.

The problem for me is Gerrard and Lampard playing in the same team.. you have to leave one of them out.. abd for me that would have to be Lampard left out and Gerrard getting more involved in attacking play. Hargreaves proved last night that he best position is the holding midfield role, which he plays for Bayern.

So far in the competition nobody has had more shots than Lampard... but how many has he scored?

Lets get Gerrard pushing foreward and show him how to do it.

by **oakton** » Thu Jun 22, 2006 7:55 am

The thing with Beckham is he's not consistent enough, he occasionally delivers a spectecular pass or free kick, but so what? It seems like his only option is to kick long, he does it all the time, anyone could have delivery a good ball eventually if he does it all the time.
So i'd say drop him, and play gerrard on the right, with lampard and carrick playing in the middle. Lampard to do all the free kicks.

by **stmichael** » Thu Jun 22, 2006 12:30 pm

If I was picking the side for Sunday and everyone bar Owen was fit, i'd go with:

-----------Robinson

Neville--Terry--Carra--Cole

Lennon--Gerrard©--Hargreaves--Cole

------------Rooney--Crouch

A young side full of energy and a lack of fear. Far more athletic and flexible than the side that played the other day.

As others have said, if Beckhams set-pieces aren't up to standard, then frankly he contributes absolutely nothing to the side apart from messing the shape up.

You find him dropping deep to collect the ball and hitting long balls which the better sides eat up for breakfast. I actually do rate Beckham, but Lennon is a better option i'm afraid, as he can beat his man and get defences on the back foot.

I tell you something now, if Benitez was the England boss, the side would have a much different look about it and Beckham wouldn't get a look in.

by **Ola Mr Benitez** » Thu Jun 22, 2006 12:35 pm

Lennon is now way experienced enough to play from the start in a tournament of this magnitude.

Yes he had a good game when he came on the other night, but lets face it the opposition was not that great. Lennon against a seasoned Italian, Argentinian or Brazilain left back would prove wanting.

I think Equador may also be a bridge too far for a player with single figures when it comes to International caps.

by **Ace Ventura** » Thu Jun 22, 2006 12:44 pm

oakton wrote:The thing with Beckham is he's not consistent enough, he occasionally delivers a spectecular pass or free kick, but so what? It seems like his only option is to kick long, he does it all the time, anyone could have delivery a good ball eventually if he does it all the time.
So i'd say drop him, and play gerrard on the right, with lampard and carrick playing in the middle. Lampard to do all the free kicks.

I can see the arguments for and against this but i am with the people saying keep him in the team (for now).
Lennon looked class when he came on, but that was against a very tired Trinidad & Tobago team and even though he stretched them his end product was poor. It seems to me that for now that it is best that he comes on in the latter stages of games and we go with the more experienced and steadier Beckham. His crossing is still fantastic, he just as some have said needs a bit of variation with his freekicks and general passing. It actually doesnt bother me too much when he drifts infield, movement confuses the opposition and i actually think the midfield should interchange positions a bit more, Beckham and Gerrard could easily do this during matches.
The player i would have dropped (before Owens injury) is Lampard, i have gone over this many times, but i will say it again, his constant shooting is breaking down attacks in good positions and he offers little else.
But now that we have a total lack of striking options against the better sides it looks like we will have to play a 5 man midfield, with Hargreaves protecting and Lampard and Gerrard both given the license to get forward, it actually should suit the players we have and if things were not going right we have players that can change things and offer different options in Crouch Downing Lennon & Walcott.

by **Cool Hand Luke** » Thu Jun 22, 2006 1:05 pm

I would not drop him, but I would ask him to stay out more wide, keep the full back occupied so he can’t tuck in and maybe draw in the opposition central midfielder. At the moment it is too easy to defend against England, full backs just tuck in, central midfielders just have to hold position, because both J.Cole and Beckham are coming in central. When Downing and Lennon came on in the second game they stretched the defence and Lampard starting finding space in the centre and we were playing threw them. At the moment it’s too easy to defend against England, just go compact and England wont create chances.

by **taff** » Thu Jun 22, 2006 1:06 pm

I still think he is the best option England have got and is also their captain so what message would that give and the disharmony in the camp. Dropping someone of his profile would be a mistake. I do think however that Sven should have sorted this out last year and named someone else captain probably Terry.

by **stmichael** » Thu Jun 22, 2006 1:22 pm

Biggest problem for England is that Beckham plays where he wants, not where he's told.

If I were Sven (or McLaren) it would be very simple. Beckham is picked to play RW. If he keeps coming inside and messing up the whole shape of the team, after the match, he's told that he's not playing the next game, because he can't follow basic instructions from his coach and as such is clearly unsuited for either the captaincy or a place in the team.

by **kewellandthegang** » Thu Jun 22, 2006 1:35 pm

off topic a little

but i did hear the other day that martin oneill was asked about beckham - he said he wouldnt have him as el capitain or even playing - he never got the job :suspect:

by **mitch22** » Thu Jun 22, 2006 9:21 pm

taff wrote:I still think he is the best option England have got and is also their captain so what message would that give and the disharmony in the camp. Dropping someone of his profile would be a mistake. I do think however that Sven should have sorted this out last year and named someone else captain probably Terry.

I agree , but somehow dont think McClaren will have the bottle to strip him of it and pass it on to Gerrard /Terry.

by **Big Niall** » Fri Jun 23, 2006 11:53 am

I have always thought of him as an average player but with excellent crossing ability. Take away his crossing and I wouldn't have him in a top 10 premiership team.

I think a lot of people got hoodwinked by his celebrity. He is poor defensibly (chickening out cost England against Brazil 4 years ago, and nearly 2 goals v Sweden and then he had the cheek to blame JC - I'd have decked him). He is slow, poor in the air, doesn't score from play.

Put away your OK magazine and wake up to the fact that he is the most over rated player in history.

by **2520years** » Fri Jun 23, 2006 12:04 pm

He is overrated, but I still think he brings something unique to the team. Opponents will be very glad if he's left out and we won't be as dangerous from set-pieces. Against top quality teams that might be our best chance of scoring. He also works well with Gary Neville (who's been missing for a couple of games, but is probably back now).

I'd remove him from the captaincy AFTER the World Cup.

by **taff** » Fri Jun 23, 2006 12:41 pm

He does work well with Gary Neville I agree and that is a strong point for his inclusion, but this is their last tournament together to be honest.

Its just a case of old lion young lion and SG is now the king of the tribe

Keep him on the right for this tournament and see what happens afterwards, If I was him I would give up the captaincy and remain eligible for the next Euros then thats it. removing him as captain which will be inevitable will create a media circus and disrupt McClaren and the set up.

by **woof woof !** » Fri Jun 23, 2006 12:53 pm

Beckham is one of the best crossers and dead ball specialists in the world . Very difficult to drop a player with that level of unique ability . Having said that changes are certainly required in a (so far) below par and predictable England team .

I'd be tempted to play a 5 man midfield , move Beckham inside and put Lennon wide right .

by **2520years** » Fri Jun 23, 2006 12:59 pm

woof woof ! wrote:Beckham is one of the best crossers and dead ball specialists in the world . Very difficult to drop a player with that level of unique ability . Having said that changes are certainly required in a (so far) below par and predictable England team .

I'd be tempted to play a 5 man midfield , move Beckham inside and put Lennon wide right .

I totally agree with the first part.

As for the second part, that would mean Lampard, Gerrard and Beckham in the midfield. I can't see that working very well personally. I'd prefer more structure e.g. one dedicated holding midfielder and two surging forward, one generally keeping left and one right.

Either way, we've probably got to play five in the midfield now Owen's gone home.
:down:

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