Liverpool FC Forum

[ycsatbjywtbiastkamb]

united get a lot of decisions go their way but all big clubs do, we were the same in the 70`s and 80`s, opposing fans back then used to harp on all the time about all the pens we were awarded at the kop end and evertonians in particular still go on to this day about some of the big calls that went our way in 70`s derby games.
for instance everton blatantly got ripped off in the 77 F.A  cup semi final against us and that was back in the day when F.A cup finals were like CL finals these days.
i watch a bit of the spanish footy on sky and some of the decisions that go real madrid and barcelona`s way are shocking as well.
it`s easy to start asking why is david gill on the board of the F.A but the fella before him was noel white, white was there for years and he was on the board here at liverpool (although i do seem to remember united moaning about his appointment to the F.A)
as much as i cant stand the man lets not forget that ferguson has always been a supporter of the labour party, ferguson was a trade union convener in the glasgow shipyards in the 60`s which is about as left wing and tough an environment as you can get.
he`s not one of these celebrities who jumped on the labour bandwagon when tony blair started all this cool britania sh*te, ferguson was heavily involved in the trade union movement before the beatles made it big.
he probably does throw his weight around behind the scene`s in english football but i`m not convinced there`s any organised conspiracy or corruption or any of that rubbish.
a lot went our way when we were top dogs and i`d like to think any luck (pens etc) we got we earned by being so attack minded and i bet united fans feel the same these days.
at the end of the day the main reason united have done so well over the past 20 years is that they have had great sides.

Fu*king hell mate, if I didnt know any better I'd think you'd lost yer marbles, or was a closet manc!
The man is an absolute cu'nt who has bullied and intimidated his way through english football for 25 years. I wont deny that he has, from time to time had some good sides, and even some great players. But anyone who follows football knows that he has not won his trophies purely on merit, like we have. He has put the sh'its up the FA, the media and as the article points out very clearly, the referees.
Every season bar none, he and/or his team are involved in a scandal or controversy. Last season being the evra disgrace, which knocked us for 6 and virtually derailed us. Read the piece properly and tell me who else holds such sway over the people who make decisions in matches? Who else chooses which referees are allowed to officiate their teams games because I'm fu'cked if I know anyone else who can dictate like that purple nosed tw@t. He is the most successful manager of the premiere league era, no doubt, but that doesnt make him an honourable person.
An arrogant, surly, offensive, nasty, ignorant, sly, hypocritical pr'ick and anyone who admires him doesnt know the meaning of honour or fairness

i said i cant stand the man and i said he probably throws his weight around behind the scene`s but you`ve got to be off your head if you think the reason they`ve won so much over the past 20 years is because refs give them the odd decision.
they have had fantastic teams and fantastic players like cantona, keane, scholes, giggs, schmeichel, stam, ronaldo, rooney, pallister, van nistelrooy, ferdinand, solskjaer etc etc
plus they have had a tremendous mental strength to come back from impossible positions (how many times have they been 2 down with 10 minutes to go and won 3-2 over the years? i`ve seen our players mentally throw the towel in loads of times when we are 1 down to a wigan or reading at anfield with 20 minutes still to go) and the mental strength to go to tough places and come away with 3 points.
united have won something like 8 out of their last 10 away games at stoke where as we havent won their in a decade in the league.
thats not down to refs mate.

[Thommo's perm]

Youre missing the point, which is what the atricle says you will do. "The odd decision"? Of course, its all a big coincidence and we should laugh it off. My ar'se!
If purple nose can gain 6 points at least a season (usually more) by his behaviour then its enough to win trophies and to me is cheating.
I have said they have had some good and great players, but it is crystal clear to me that they probably wouldnt have won half of what they have without assistance, whether deliberate or not. He has a "win at all costs" mentality which means he has no time for honesty or integrity. He has a history of disgraceful, spiteful and mean actions, the preston case being typical of the cu'nt. You can wax lyrical all you want but they will always be inferior to us in my eyes and this article proves what I have thought all along: he is a despicable tw@t and they will fall to bits without him

[ycsatbjywtbiastkamb]

Youre missing the point, which is what the atricle says you will do. "The odd decision"? Of course, its all a big coincidence and we should laugh it off. My ar'se!
If purple nose can gain 6 points at least a season (usually more) by his behaviour then its enough to win trophies and to me is cheating.
I have said they have had some good and great players, but it is crystal clear to me that they probably wouldnt have won half of what they have without assistance, whether deliberate or not. He has a "win at all costs" mentality which means he has no time for honesty or integrity. He has a history of disgraceful, spiteful and mean actions, the preston case being typical of the cu'nt. You can wax lyrical all you want but they will always be inferior to us in my eyes and this article proves what I have thought all along: he is a despicable tw@t and they will fall to bits without him

i`m not denying the man is a **** but he is a tremendous football manager.
look what he did up in scotland, how many managers could take a club like aberdeen and not only overtake celtic and rangers to be the dominant force in scotland but win a european trophy too.
they won the cup winners cup back in the day when only 1 team qualified for the european cup so some top teams were in that tournament the year they won it.
real madrid, barcelona, bayern munich, inter milan, red star belgrade, PSG, galatasary, john toshacks swansea side and spurs were just some of the teams in the tournament and aberdeen had a tough run, they knocked bayern munich out in the quarters and beat real madrid in the final. remember we are talking about frigging aberdeen here! and they werent spending big money, all their players were scottish.
we know only too well ourselves how hard it is to turn around giant club who have spent 2 decades in the wilderness so the job he has done at united has been phenominal as well.
he hasnt been that successfull over his entire career because of conspiracy theories, the **** knows how to manage football teams.
i remember he was actually heavily linked with us when fagan retired after heysel, after what he did in scotland loads of clubs down here were trying to get him (arsenal, spurs etc) and the word in the press was that he only wanted to manage liverpool or united but we went for kenny instead. a year later atkinson went and united signed him.
i actually think he cant stand us so much because he had his heart set on managing us.
ferguson is like suarez mate, when he`s on your side you love him but when he`s against you cant stand him.
and united will deffo struggle to replace him, ferguson is like paisley, phenominal managers like that dont grow on tree`s

[redno7]

they have had fantastic teams and fantastic players like cantona, keane, scholes, giggs, schmeichel, stam, ronaldo, rooney, pallister, van nistelrooy, ferdinand, solskjaer etc etc

I'm shocked you reeled off a load of great man utd players that Fergie has managed and Beckham never made it onto the list? puzzling 

[ycsatbjywtbiastkamb]

they have had fantastic teams and fantastic players like cantona, keane, scholes, giggs, schmeichel, stam, ronaldo, rooney, pallister, van nistelrooy, ferdinand, solskjaer etc etc

I'm shocked you reeled off a load of great man utd players that Fergie has managed and Beckham never made it onto the list? puzzling 

why is it puzzling? it wasnt meant to be a comprehensive list of any kind, if i had to name all the top players united have had over the past 20 years i`d be there forever. beckham was a good player but i`ve seen united with more effective wide players, the team they had with giggs and kanchelskis on either flank was unbelievable, when they broke with pace they`d rip teams to shreds.
infact united had a starting XI (i think it was schmeichel, parker, bruce, pallister, irwin, ince, keane, giggs, kanchelskis, hughes and cantona) that never lost a game, that side played near 200 games and never ever lost.
when ever they lost a game in that era one or two of them were out of the team and replaced by mcclair, may or sharpe or someone.
i think they would have won a couple more european cups if they could have fielded that side in the CL but thankfully that 3 foreigners rule was in place back then and not only that uefa said that welsh, scots and irish players (yeah i know irish are `foreign` but there have been irish players in english teams since the year dot so they arent really considered foreign) were counted as foreigners too.
so technically giggs, hughes, keane and irwin were foreigners along with schmeichel, cantona and kanchelskis.
that rule threw a right spanner in their works in europe 

[Thommo's perm]

Youre missing the point, which is what the atricle says you will do. "The odd decision"? Of course, its all a big coincidence and we should laugh it off. My ar'se!
If purple nose can gain 6 points at least a season (usually more) by his behaviour then its enough to win trophies and to me is cheating.
I have said they have had some good and great players, but it is crystal clear to me that they probably wouldnt have won half of what they have without assistance, whether deliberate or not. He has a "win at all costs" mentality which means he has no time for honesty or integrity. He has a history of disgraceful, spiteful and mean actions, the preston case being typical of the cu'nt. You can wax lyrical all you want but they will always be inferior to us in my eyes and this article proves what I have thought all along: he is a despicable tw@t and they will fall to bits without him

i`m not denying the man is a **** but he is a tremendous football manager.
look what he did up in scotland, how many managers could take a club like aberdeen and not only overtake celtic and rangers to be the dominant force in scotland but win a european trophy too.
they won the cup winners cup back in the day when only 1 team qualified for the european cup so some top teams were in that tournament the year they won it.
real madrid, barcelona, bayern munich, inter milan, red star belgrade, PSG, galatasary, john toshacks swansea side and spurs were just some of the teams in the tournament and aberdeen had a tough run, they knocked bayern munich out in the quarters and beat real madrid in the final. remember we are talking about frigging aberdeen here! and they werent spending big money, all their players were scottish.
we know only too well ourselves how hard it is to turn around giant club who have spent 2 decades in the wilderness so the job he has done at united has been phenominal as well.
he hasnt been that successfull over his entire career because of conspiracy theories, the **** knows how to manage football teams.
i remember he was actually heavily linked with us when fagan retired after heysel, after what he did in scotland loads of clubs down here were trying to get him (arsenal, spurs etc) and the word in the press was that he only wanted to manage liverpool or united but we went for kenny instead. a year later atkinson went and united signed him.
i actually think he cant stand us so much because he had his heart set on managing us.
ferguson is like suarez mate, when he`s on your side you love him but when he`s against you cant stand him.
and united will deffo struggle to replace him, ferguson is like paisley, phenominal managers like that dont grow on tree`s

Youre doing it again!!!
I dont give a fu'ck about aberdeen because they dont play in our league and have got f*ck all to do with the point.
He is a successful manager and has proven he is more than capable of putting teams together to win trophies. However, this is not one of those "conspiracy theories" as you put it because he has the power to influence games by selecting "friendly" referees, which is tantamount to cheating. Rafa tried to highlight what the cu'nt gets up to in his ill advised and ill timed "rant" and was mocked and ridiculed by the media and the rest of football for having the gall to tell the truth.
For you to dismiss this evidence is disturbing to say the least

[ycsatbjywtbiastkamb]

what evidence though mate?
have united got any more favourable decisions going their way that what we did between 1965 and 1990?
big successfull clubs get big decisions going their way, chelsea moaned like f**k about the united game but they beat reading a few weeks ago with a goal that was about 3 yards offside and john terry missed half the amount of games luis suarez did.
the ones i feel sorry for are the wigans and readings, they always get Sh*t on and no one gives a f**k

[redtrader74]

I'm with you there Thommosperm, but Rafas rant/ fact/truth, was only ill advised or poorly timed in respect that another one of Fergies methods of subterfuge, the media, ridiculed him. I'm convinced that he has journalists Sh*t scared on the payroll or both, we are constantly told how fantastic mediocre players are, Cleverly, Jones Etc, until everyone starts repeating the myth. Sure he's had some top players, but his greatest ally, IMHO, has been his ability to manipulate the referees and media, to the point where other mangers kiss his *****, think of Pardew, Gollum, Redknapp, Fat Sam......I'm not sure whether I'm impressed with the ***** or think he's a cheat.

[redtrader74]

what evidence though mate?
have united got any more favourable decisions going their way that what we did between 1965 and 1990?
big successfull clubs get big decisions going their way, chelsea moaned like f**k about the united game but they beat reading a few weeks ago with a goal that was about 3 yards offside and john terry missed half the amount of games luis suarez did.
the ones i feel sorry for are the wigans and readings, they always get Sh*t on and no one gives a f**k

Evra admitted to swearing at Suarez in regard to his sister and parentage during the 'race' row hearing, foul and abusive language, was he punished? Was he f*ck. Referees that he criticises don't ref a manu game for a very long time. Prior to all big games he will tell the referee how he needs to manage it, and who and what he needs to look out for, have the FA ever censored him, as it is a clear attempt to influence, no, manipulate the referee, never. A manager is obliged to speak to the main media, yet he never spoke to the BBC for years. No course fergie doesn't get his way, or influence the authorities.

[Thommo's perm]

what evidence though mate?
have united got any more favourable decisions going their way that what we did between 1965 and 1990?
big successfull clubs get big decisions going their way, chelsea moaned like f**k about the united game but they beat reading a few weeks ago with a goal that was about 3 yards offside and john terry missed half the amount of games luis suarez did.
the ones i feel sorry for are the wigans and readings, they always get Sh*t on and no one gives a f**k

I will ask you once again:
"Read the piece properly and tell me who else holds such sway over the people who make decisions in matches? Who else chooses which referees are allowed to officiate their teams games because I'm fu'cked if I know anyone else who can dictate like that purple nosed tw@t"
I eagerly await your speedy response...

[ycsatbjywtbiastkamb]

what evidence though mate?
have united got any more favourable decisions going their way that what we did between 1965 and 1990?
big successfull clubs get big decisions going their way, chelsea moaned like f**k about the united game but they beat reading a few weeks ago with a goal that was about 3 yards offside and john terry missed half the amount of games luis suarez did.
the ones i feel sorry for are the wigans and readings, they always get Sh*t on and no one gives a f**k

Evra admitted to swearing at Suarez in regard to his sister and parentage during the 'race' row hearing, foul and abusive language, was he punished? Was he f*ck. Referees that he criticises don't ref a manu game for a very long time. Prior to all big games he will tell the referee how he needs to manage it, and who and what he needs to look out for, have the FA ever censored him, as it is a clear attempt to influence, no, manipulate the referee, never. A manager is obliged to speak to the main media, yet he never spoke to the BBC for years. No course fergie doesn't get his way, or influence the authorities.

but there`s no evidence to suggest that united get ref`s decisions because of it.
look at the 41 games liverpool and united have played against each other in the premier league era, united players have had more yellow cards and red cards awarded against them and although united have been awarded more pens it`s only 2 more, and whats more liverpool have been awarded more pens at old trafford than united have got at anfield.
if there was some sort of organised conspiracy you`d think united would want the refs to fix games against their arch rivals more than anyone.

[Thommo's perm]

The man who wrote the article said "I dont blame the referees". Meaning he thought they were being duped and manipulated
ycsatbjywtbiastkamb, there is no suggestion of "conspiracy" on behalf of serving referees. You are deliberately muddying the waters and Im wondering why?
Could you answer my question please?

[ycsatbjywtbiastkamb]

The man who wrote the article said "I dont blame the referees". Meaning he thought they were being duped and manipulated
ycsatbjywtbiastkamb, there is no suggestion of "conspiracy" on behalf of serving referees. You are deliberately muddying the waters and Im wondering why?
Could you answer my question please?

what question? that ferguson picks and chooses refs? if he`s picked the ref`s for liverpool v united games over the last 20 years his picks havent been much good.
does moyes pick the refs too? after that derby game when clattenburg sent hibbert off moyes went bezerk in the press, moyes said he didnt want him reffing everton games and he didnt ref another everton game for 5 years.
imagine that was ferguson?

[Thommo's perm]

The man who wrote the article said "I dont blame the referees". Meaning he thought they were being duped and manipulated
ycsatbjywtbiastkamb, there is no suggestion of "conspiracy" on behalf of serving referees. You are deliberately muddying the waters and Im wondering why?
Could you answer my question please?

what question? that ferguson picks and chooses refs? if he`s picked the ref`s for liverpool v united games over the last 20 years his picks havent been much good.
does moyes pick the refs too? after that derby game when clattenburg sent hibbert off moyes went bezerk in the press, moyes said he didnt want him reffing everton games and he didnt ref another everton game for 5 years.
imagine that was ferguson?

Thanks, thats one incident. And let me just remind you that uniteds games havent just been against Liverpool for the last 20 years
Youve absolutely convinced me that its all just a great big fluffy coincidence and Im stupid and paranoid

What- Fu*king -ever!

[redtrader74]

what evidence though mate?
have united got any more favourable decisions going their way that what we did between 1965 and 1990?
big successfull clubs get big decisions going their way, chelsea moaned like f**k about the united game but they beat reading a few weeks ago with a goal that was about 3 yards offside and john terry missed half the amount of games luis suarez did.
the ones i feel sorry for are the wigans and readings, they always get Sh*t on and no one gives a f**k

Evra admitted to swearing at Suarez in regard to his sister and parentage during the 'race' row hearing, foul and abusive language, was he punished? Was he f*ck. Referees that he criticises don't ref a manu game for a very long time. Prior to all big games he will tell the referee how he needs to manage it, and who and what he needs to look out for, have the FA ever censored him, as it is a clear attempt to influence, no, manipulate the referee, never. A manager is obliged to speak to the main media, yet he never spoke to the BBC for years. No course fergie doesn't get his way, or influence the authorities.

but there`s no evidence to suggest that united get ref`s decisions because of it.
look at the 41 games liverpool and united have played against each other in the premier league era, united players have had more yellow cards and red cards awarded against them and although united have been awarded more pens it`s only 2 more, and whats more liverpool have been awarded more pens at old trafford than united have got at anfield.
if there was some sort of organised conspiracy you`d think united would want the refs to fix games against their arch rivals more than anyone.

The numbers you qoute are irrelevant, since its not about whats given, but when, say manu are winning 2-0 and you give a dubious penalty against them, they still win 2-1, and it all looks fair. Additionally not all the referees are neccesarily complicit, hence they stop overseeing further manu games. You assume there's an organised conspiracy, my assertion is that FEgie has assumed a huge amount of power, for a variety of reasons, the club he is at, the success, being a 'home' grown manager, time served and the fact that almost to a man all the home nations managers can't wait to open a bottle of wine with him and fawn all over him, I'm sure you'll remember how his dogs of war rallied round after Rafas fact speech. This power lends itself to allow him to influence, intimidate and manipulate referees, it happens before, during and after games. Just imagine you are a referee with Fergie on one side, and Martinez, Woy or even Rodgers on the other side, who would you be worried about ***** off? Which one could ruin your career and make you a figure of fun? Sound far fetched, remember Wiley, being called fat and unfit.

Funnily enough, I'd do the same if I were a manager, I'd try and get every advantage and certainly have half a dozen journalists on a £50k a year retainer to write articles that favour me, and leak misinformation about my rivals. I can't understand why you think it's so absurd.