Liverpool FC Forum

[aCe']

You say we're some way off being as good as ARSENAL??

thats a good point.. I'd say Gerrard and Torres balance off the equation somehow and the fact that they went out and sold every holding midfielder they ever had and we seem to have 5 of them in our books... besides that i think they have better defenders, better wide players and better options upfront...

They have some very good players... just look at the players in their side who would get in our side... Sagna, Clichy, Gallas, Fabregas, any of their wide players, RVP or Adebayor or even Eduardo, Arshavin.... I'd give their side a season or 2 more and they WILL become a force to be reckoned with.. they deffo have the quality within their squad to become one of the best sides in world football yet again...

Back to Liverpool though... think despite all the fuss that the couple of good back to back results have caused we're still the same team with the same set of players who have obvious limitations that dont allow for such results to come on a consistent basis... its the same reason we missed out on the league this season (are going to, sorry for getting it wrong).. same reason we can go out and beat Madrid away and then lose 2-0 to Boro in a few days... have good days and bad days....

Until we add to the Torres-Gerrard, to a lesser extent Alonso spine we'll always struggle with the other players not performing when they should/ are expected to...

[LegBarnes]

You say we're some way off being as good as ARSENAL??

thats a good point.. I'd say Gerrard and Torres balance off the equation somehow and the fact that they went out and sold every holding midfielder they ever had and we seem to have 5 of them in our books... besides that i think they have better defenders, better wide players and better options upfront...

They have some very good players... just look at the players in their side who would get in our side... Sagna, Clichy, Gallas, Fabregas, any of their wide players, RVP or Adebayor or even Eduardo, Arshavin.... I'd give their side a season or 2 more and they WILL become a force to be reckoned with.. they deffo have the quality within their squad to become one of the best sides in world football yet again...

Back to Liverpool though... think despite all the fuss that the couple of good back to back results have caused we're still the same team with the same set of players who have obvious limitations that dont allow for such results to come on a consistent basis... its the same reason we missed out on the league this season (are going to, sorry for getting it wrong).. same reason we can go out and beat Madrid away and then lose 2-0 to Boro in a few days... have good days and bad days....

Until we add to the Torres-Gerrard, to a lesser extent Alonso spine we'll always struggle with the other players not performing when they should/ are expected to...

aye ace just point I am trying to make we have the spine but we need top players around that to complement it.

Atm we have stop gaps imo nothing bad but on same note nothing awesome.

When you look at teams like dare I say chelsea , barca , man u , arsenal we really are lacking in areas that win you match's week in week out.

[tubby]

Unless we bring in more quality around that spine players like Torres and Gerrard are just wasted which is a shame as they would walk into any top side. We are lucky Stevie came up through the academy. We could not afford a player of his calibre now if we had to go out and look for one to buy. Torres seems a bargain at 20Mil too considering how good he is.

[JC_81]

Sorry lads but I think this is a bit of a knee jerk reaction.  The Chelsea game was a bad day at the office, nothing more.  At this stage of the season the league table doesn't lie and we have been better than Chelsea and Arsenal this season, to suggest we're some way off being as good as them is frankly ridiculous.

We do have weaknesses (mainly in wide positions) but so do the other teams.

Arsenal - poor goalkeeper, inconsistent centre backs, lack of a central midfielder with any 'dig' and rely heavily on Adebayor and Fabregas (perhaps even more than we do on Torres/Gerrard.

Chelsea - poor wide players - Malouda and Kalou played well against us the other night, but they're usually pretty rubbish imo.  Also they don't have enough attacking flair.  I see them as very very similar to Liverpool in terms of strengths and weaknesses, which is why the games are usually tight.  Solid spine like us, but can struggle to break teams down, especially when Drogba's out.  They're also an ageing side and badly need to start reinvesting in some younger players imo.

United - Best attacking team in the league, and perhaps on paper the best defence.  Their weakest area is central midfield, but even that is pretty strong.  Carrick, Hargreaves, Anderson, Fletcher, Giggs, Scholes are all good players.  Giggs and Scholes used to be great players.  But none of them are in the same bracket as Alonso, Gerrard, Lampard, Fabregas, Essien, Ballack in terms of really top central midfielders.  Some will argue Carrick is up there but not for me.  United's main weakness is tactical.  They can only play one way - attack.  It's great when your players are on form, but when they're not, like now, things fall apart spectacularly.  Ferguson is the best manager at building a team.  He has an eye for players that fits how he wants his team to play.  What you never get with Ferguson is a team that is greater than the sum of its parts.  With the players he has he should have wrapped the league up already.

[Sir Roger]

Sorry lads but I think this is a bit of a knee jerk reaction.  The Chelsea game was a bad day at the office, nothing more.  At this stage of the season the league table doesn't lie and we have been better than Chelsea and Arsenal this season, to suggest we're some way off being as good as them is frankly ridiculous.

We do have weaknesses (mainly in wide positions) but so do the other teams.

Arsenal - poor goalkeeper, inconsistent centre backs, lack of a central midfielder with any 'dig' and rely heavily on Adebayor and Fabregas (perhaps even more than we do on Torres/Gerrard.

Chelsea - poor wide players - Malouda and Kalou played well against us the other night, but they're usually pretty rubbish imo.  Also they don't have enough attacking flair.  I see them as very very similar to Liverpool in terms of strengths and weaknesses, which is why the games are usually tight.  Solid spine like us, but can struggle to break teams down, especially when Drogba's out.  They're also an ageing side and badly need to start reinvesting in some younger players imo.

United - Best attacking team in the league, and perhaps on paper the best defence.  Their weakest area is central midfield, but even that is pretty strong.  Carrick, Hargreaves, Anderson, Fletcher, Giggs, Scholes are all good players.  Giggs and Scholes used to be great players.  But none of them are in the same bracket as Alonso, Gerrard, Lampard, Fabregas, Essien, Ballack in terms of really top central midfielders.  Some will argue Carrick is up there but not for me.  United's main weakness is tactical.  They can only play one way - attack.  It's great when your players are on form, but when they're not, like now, things fall apart spectacularly.  Ferguson is the best manager at building a team.  He has an eye for players that fits how he wants his team to play.  What you never get with Ferguson is a team that is greater than the sum of its parts.  With the players he has he should have wrapped the league up already.

Good post

If the mancs are so far ahead of us in terms of strength and depth then why are we just two points behind?

I brought this up in the thread "man for man" where I asked was man united best team and our best team were so far apart, as fergie and the media would have us all believe?
I think the answer is clear

[JC_81]

If the mancs are so far ahead of us in terms of strength and depth then why are we just two points behind?

Man for man, United are far better than us... on paper.  As a team though there's not much in it.

Why?  In my opinion we have a manager who's tactically better and gets more out of his squad than Ferguson does.  He has perhaps the best two central defenders in the league, the best left back, the best winger and three of the best strikers, along with more strength in depth than perhaps any team around.  Yet how did we manage to beat them twice and be on their coat-tails in the league?  Our manager has to take some credit.

I must stress that Ferguson is a fantastic manager and the best at building a team in the business, but perhaps tactically not the best around.  United should be further ahead of us than they are if you go on the man-for-man analysis of the squads.

[we all dream...]

I was talking about this with my mate in the pub last night... Are we a very good side or are we a good side who had, untill Wednesday, been playing very well? Of course we are a good side, but how good?

So, we need to find out what our base level is, we could say our average performance level. To do this we could do with using more than a couple of matches as a guide and we should defintely ensure these matches are against the best teams in the country. I don't know where we could find one of these lists but I'd say we would come about second, probably just in front of Chelsea and just behind Man United. 

Seriously though we are clearly a very good side. Recently, i.e. before Wednesday, we had been playing , IMO, above our base level. We have been performing close to our full potential if not to it recently, playing some cracking football. We all know that for every game you play above average you have to play a game below average and this is what happened againt Chelsea. Nobody can play better than their average every game. If somebody knows how I'd ike to see them explain it lol

I am looking forwards to the rest of the season, we have a good shot at catching United and I am hoping we make a good go of it next week at The Bridge. It'll be a shame to end the season without a trophy but unfortunatley the odds are stcked against us.. but then again we are often better when we are the underdogs.

I am looking forwards to the summer. It will be intriguing to see what Rafa has up his sleave. I can't even work out where we need strengthening. I would like a new CB, right winger and a striker maybe some cover in midfield and at full backs.  Maybe we dont have that good a side afer all  We cant go chopping and changing we need a couple of quality players and maybe swap a couple of squad players. Other than that lol  we will be bang up their again next season because we are a very good side, almost the best in the, we could even be the best by the end of the season. Fingers crossed.

[aCe']

I was talking about this with my mate in the pub last night... Are we a very good side or are we a good side who had, untill Wednesday, been playing very well? Of course we are a good side, but how good?

So, we need to find out what our base level is, we could say our average performance level. To do this we could do with using more than a couple of matches as a guide and we should defintely ensure these matches are against the best teams in the country. I don't know where we could find one of these lists but I'd say we would come about second, probably just in front of Chelsea and just behind Man United. 

Seriously though we are clearly a very good side. Recently, i.e. before Wednesday, we had been playing , IMO, above our base level. We have been performing close to our full potential if not to it recently, playing some cracking football. We all know that for every game you play above average you have to play a game below average and this is what happened againt Chelsea. Nobody can play better than their average every game. If somebody knows how I'd ike to see them explain it lol

I am looking forwards to the rest of the season, we have a good shot at catching United and I am hoping we make a good go of it next week at The Bridge. It'll be a shame to end the season without a trophy but unfortunatley the odds are stcked against us.. but then again we are often better when we are the underdogs.

I am looking forwards to the summer. It will be intriguing to see what Rafa has up his sleave. I can't even work out where we need strengthening. I would like a new CB, right winger and a striker maybe some cover in midfield and at full backs.  Maybe we dont have that good a side afer all  We cant go chopping and changing we need a couple of quality players and maybe swap a couple of squad players. Other than that lol  we will be bang up their again next season because we are a very good side, almost the best in the, we could even be the best by the end of the season. Fingers crossed.

mmm... all the 'lol's ruin your post but i think i sort of agree with what you're saying there...

unless ur a 17 year old girl then i think its kinda cute and maybe you should gimme a call in a year or so... "lol"

[LegBarnes]

Unless we bring in more quality around that spine players like Torres and Gerrard are just wasted which is a shame as they would walk into any top side. We are lucky Stevie came up through the academy. We could not afford a player of his calibre now if we had to go out and look for one to buy. Torres seems a bargain at 20Mil too considering how good he is.

Just back from the pub little tipsie so I have ot leave it till tomorrow to try to quote this. !!! 

[we all dream...]

I was talking about this with my mate in the pub last night... Are we a very good side or are we a good side who had, untill Wednesday, been playing very well? Of course we are a good side, but how good?

So, we need to find out what our base level is, we could say our average performance level. To do this we could do with using more than a couple of matches as a guide and we should defintely ensure these matches are against the best teams in the country. I don't know where we could find one of these lists but I'd say we would come about second, probably just in front of Chelsea and just behind Man United. 

Seriously though we are clearly a very good side. Recently, i.e. before Wednesday, we had been playing , IMO, above our base level. We have been performing close to our full potential if not to it recently, playing some cracking football. We all know that for every game you play above average you have to play a game below average and this is what happened againt Chelsea. Nobody can play better than their average every game. If somebody knows how I'd ike to see them explain it lol

I am looking forwards to the rest of the season, we have a good shot at catching United and I am hoping we make a good go of it next week at The Bridge. It'll be a shame to end the season without a trophy but unfortunatley the odds are stcked against us.. but then again we are often better when we are the underdogs.

I am looking forwards to the summer. It will be intriguing to see what Rafa has up his sleave. I can't even work out where we need strengthening. I would like a new CB, right winger and a striker maybe some cover in midfield and at full backs.  Maybe we dont have that good a side afer all  We cant go chopping and changing we need a couple of quality players and maybe swap a couple of squad players. Other than that lol  we will be bang up their again next season because we are a very good side, almost the best in the, we could even be the best by the end of the season. Fingers crossed.

mmm... all the 'lol's ruin your post but i think i sort of agree with what you're saying there...

unless ur a 17 year old girl then i think its kinda cute and maybe you should gimme a call in a year or so... "lol"

No, not a 17 year old girl a 21 year old male.. Anyway I only did 2. Sorry Granddad....

It's just a ridiculous habit I've had drummed into me, everything was lol or lmao or even lmfao from when I was 14 upwards, the mobile phone craze you see!

Anyway I think it's a way for me to show I'm trying to be funny when I'm not witty enough to actually make it funny.... lol

 

[Ciggy]

The Chelsea result was down to the fact that we're concentrating on the league, and Chelsea played above themselves.

Let's not forget that we've beaten them twice this season. And Man Utd.

Do you think that latter fact perhaps made the players a bit complacent?

No I think like Lando said we are concentrating on the league, its not in our hands we need favours from others and hope them b@stards down the M 62 feck it up.

[Sir Roger]

If the mancs are so far ahead of us in terms of strength and depth then why are we just two points behind?

Man for man, United are far better than us... on paper.  As a team though there's not much in it.

Why?  In my opinion we have a manager who's tactically better and gets more out of his squad than Ferguson does.  He has perhaps the best two central defenders in the league, the best left back, the best winger and three of the best strikers, along with more strength in depth than perhaps any team around.  Yet how did we manage to beat them twice and be on their coat-tails in the league?  Our manager has to take some credit.

I must stress that Ferguson is a fantastic manager and the best at building a team in the business, but perhaps tactically not the best around.  United should be further ahead of us than they are if you go on the man-for-man analysis of the squads.

As someone said:
"we dont play on paper we play on grass"
A great team with great spirit will always beat a team of great individuals. We have shown this over the last five or so (forget the last one) games.
Rafa should take credit for this and still being in with a chance of the prem and the CL
However, he must also take the criticism for some of the decisions hes made through the season which might cost us winning both or either of the trophies.

Anyway.
Im off to watch us give big sam a thrashing...

[LegBarnes]

If the mancs are so far ahead of us in terms of strength and depth then why are we just two points behind?

Man for man, United are far better than us... on paper.  As a team though there's not much in it.

Why?  In my opinion we have a manager who's tactically better and gets more out of his squad than Ferguson does.  He has perhaps the best two central defenders in the league, the best left back, the best winger and three of the best strikers, along with more strength in depth than perhaps any team around.  Yet how did we manage to beat them twice and be on their coat-tails in the league?  Our manager has to take some credit.

I must stress that Ferguson is a fantastic manager and the best at building a team in the business, but perhaps tactically not the best around.  United should be further ahead of us than they are if you go on the man-for-man analysis of the squads.

As someone said:
"we dont play on paper we play on grass"
A great team with great spirit will always beat a team of great individuals. We have shown this over the last five or so (forget the last one) games.
Rafa should take credit for this and still being in with a chance of the prem and the CL
However, he must also take the criticism for some of the decisions hes made through the season which might cost us winning both or either of the trophies.

Anyway.
Im off to watch us give big sam a thrashing...

Did you just quote Andy Grey people have been killed for less.

[RedBlood]

i think our first eleven is easily as good as any of the other top 4 but our next eleven isnt and thats down to money imo

[Lando_Griffin]

The Chelsea result was down to the fact that we're concentrating on the league, and Chelsea played above themselves.

Let's not forget that we've beaten them twice this season. And Man Utd.

Do you think that latter fact perhaps made the players a bit complacent?

No.

The fact that we scored so early probably did, though.