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Unholy row over New Zealand Mary and Joseph billboard 



The billboard is intended to challenge the stereotypes of the Christmas conception story, but it has been described as offensive to Christians


An unholy row has broken out in New Zealand over a church billboard aimed at "challenging stereotypes" about the birth of Jesus Christ.

A dejected-looking Joseph lies in bed next to Mary under the caption, "Poor Joseph. God was a hard act to follow".

St Matthew-in-the-City Church in Auckland, which erected the billboard, said it had intended to provoke debate.

But the Catholic Church, among others, has condemned it as "inappropriate" and "disrespectful".

Within hours of its unveiling, the billboard had been defaced with brown paint.

The church's vicar, Archdeacon Glynn Cardy, said the aim of the billboard had been to lampoon the literal interpretation of the Christmas conception story.


The billboard was defaced within hours of its unveiling
"What we're trying to do is to get people to think more about what Christmas is all about," he told the New Zealand Press Association (NZPA).

"Is it about a spiritual male God sending down sperm so a child would be born, or is it about the power of love in our midst as seen in Jesus?"

He told NZPA that the church had received e-mails and phone calls about the controversial image.

"About 50% said they loved it, and about 50% said it was terribly offensive," he said. "But that's out of about 20 responses - this is New Zealand."

But Lyndsay Freer, spokeswoman for the Catholic Diocese of Auckland, said the poster was offensive to Christians.

"Our Christian tradition of 2,000 years is that Mary remains a virgin and that Jesus is the son of God, not Joseph," she told the New Zealand Herald. "Such a poster is inappropriate and disrespectful."

The family values group Family First said any debate about the Virgin birth should be held inside the church.

"To confront children and families with the concept as a street billboard is completely irresponsible and unnecessary," Family First director Bob McCroskrie told the news website stuff.co.nz.

[JoeTerp]

where do they get off thinking that their religious views need to be 'respected.'   If someone had an anti-George Bush bilboard up, could republicans legitimately say that they feel the poster is disrespectful to their conservative views?   Are natural history musesums with fossils, disrespectful of creationists views?

[Big Niall]

where do they get off thinking that their religious views need to be 'respected.'   If someone had an anti-George Bush bilboard up, could republicans legitimately say that they feel the poster is disrespectful to their conservative views?   Are natural history musesums with fossils, disrespectful of creationists views?

Bang on Joe! Tell it as it is.

I hate that krap when you can't say you think god is a load of rubbish. I've no problem with somebody saying Atheism is a load of rubbish.

The final taboo?

[Emerald Red]

where do they get off thinking that their religious views need to be 'respected.'   If someone had an anti-George Bush bilboard up, could republicans legitimately say that they feel the poster is disrespectful to their conservative views?   Are natural history musesums with fossils, disrespectful of creationists views?

Of course they have to be respected. That's a very fascist view there, Joe. Something a Nazi would come out with. Your country is supposed to be all for freedom and all that shyte, yet you come out with something like that? People should have the freedom to live whatever lives they wish to live without being insulted. Like it or not, for some people, their religion is their way of life. It defines who they are as people. I personally don't take offense to the image above posted by S@int, but I could see how some people who are deeply religious might do. Sometimes a sense of humour goes missing with the religious.

[JoeTerp]

should anti-rafa people not post their views so as to not upset the pro-rafa crowd?

[JoeTerp]

where do they get off thinking that their religious views need to be 'respected.'   If someone had an anti-George Bush bilboard up, could republicans legitimately say that they feel the poster is disrespectful to their conservative views?   Are natural history musesums with fossils, disrespectful of creationists views?

Of course they have to be respected. That's a very fascist view there, Joe. Something a Nazi would come out with. Your country is supposed to be all for freedom and all that shyte, yet you come out with something like that? People should have the freedom to live whatever lives they wish to live without being insulted. Like it or not, for some people, their religion is their way of life. It defines who they are as people. I personally don't take offense to the image above posted by S@int, but I could see how some people who are deeply religious might do. Sometimes a sense of humour goes missing with the religious.

you are 100% wrong. The person denying someone the right to make a statement would be the fascist.  I am for freedom of speech.

[Emerald Red]

where do they get off thinking that their religious views need to be 'respected.'   If someone had an anti-George Bush bilboard up, could republicans legitimately say that they feel the poster is disrespectful to their conservative views?   Are natural history musesums with fossils, disrespectful of creationists views?

Of course they have to be respected. That's a very fascist view there, Joe. Something a Nazi would come out with. Your country is supposed to be all for freedom and all that shyte, yet you come out with something like that? People should have the freedom to live whatever lives they wish to live without being insulted. Like it or not, for some people, their religion is their way of life. It defines who they are as people. I personally don't take offense to the image above posted by S@int, but I could see how some people who are deeply religious might do. Sometimes a sense of humour goes missing with the religious.

you are 100% wrong. The person denying someone the right to make a statement would be the fascist.  I am for freedom of speech.

Right, so freedom of speech and the right to insult people about their beliefs are one and the same thing? Sort of a pardoxical view that, isn't it? It's not 100% wrong. It's right.

[SouthCoastShankly]

where do they get off thinking that their religious views need to be 'respected.'   If someone had an anti-George Bush bilboard up, could republicans legitimately say that they feel the poster is disrespectful to their conservative views?   Are natural history musesums with fossils, disrespectful of creationists views?

The difference is political sway, etc are viewpoints.

For most, religion is an all encompassing way of life. A life course.

With this said though, I think too many people who hold religious beliefs are easily offended. I have religious views but very few things offend me.

[Big Niall]

where do they get off thinking that their religious views need to be 'respected.'   If someone had an anti-George Bush bilboard up, could republicans legitimately say that they feel the poster is disrespectful to their conservative views?   Are natural history musesums with fossils, disrespectful of creationists views?

Of course they have to be respected. That's a very fascist view there, Joe. Something a Nazi would come out with. Your country is supposed to be all for freedom and all that shyte, yet you come out with something like that? People should have the freedom to live whatever lives they wish to live without being insulted. Like it or not, for some people, their religion is their way of life. It defines who they are as people. I personally don't take offense to the image above posted by S@int, but I could see how some people who are deeply religious might do. Sometimes a sense of humour goes missing with the religious.

you are 100% wrong. The person denying someone the right to make a statement would be the fascist.  I am for freedom of speech.

Right, so freedom of speech and the right to insult people about their beliefs are one and the same thing? Sort of a pardoxical view that, isn't it? It's not 100% wrong. It's right.

I don't have the right to say to you that Religion is B.S?

Of course I do.

Likewise you can say atheism is B.S.

What's the problem?


Nothing should be above criticism.

[dawson99]

So whats the diffrence between saying all of a religion are idiots and saying all of a certani colour are all idiots?

[account deleted by request]

So whats the diffrence between saying all of a religion are idiots and saying all of a certani colour are all idiots?

You have got a choice what you believe in, you have no choice what colour you are unless you're Michael Jackson.

[dawson99]

So whats the diffrence between saying all of a religion are idiots and saying all of a certani colour are all idiots?

You have got a choice what you believe in, you have no choice what colour you are unless you're Michael Jackson.

3/4s of the world have religion brought into there lives since birth...

one form of critisism is the same as another. if you say something as broad and general as race/religion etc then you're just a bit naieve

[account deleted by request]

So whats the diffrence between saying all of a religion are idiots and saying all of a certani colour are all idiots?

You have got a choice what you believe in, you have no choice what colour you are unless you're Michael Jackson.

3/4s of the world have religion brought into there lives since birth...

one form of critisism is the same as another. if you say something as broad and general as race/religion etc then you're just a bit naieve

I had religion force fed to me since birth. I went to  religious school, went to church every week, was christened and confirmed , married in a church. I DON'T BELIEVE IN GOD. You do have a choice. 

Apart from Stevie Wonder how many black people don't believe they are black?

[dawson99]

tomato tomato (that would make more sense if I said it)

you can't critisize one group and then say you shouldn't say the same about another. Not all muslems are terrorists, not all priests are peodos and not all religious people are nutjobs...