Newkit, new season, new rules? - Is it time for a change?

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Postby dawson99 » Mon Jul 06, 2009 12:23 pm

bigmick wrote:
dawson99 wrote:what old faces? some of them are gone for a good reason.
and the anti's are really annoying, but so are so many things lately
As for Landos post hitting nail on the head.. it did, but he left out the fact that he calls everyone a cnut when he doesnt get his own fat way :p

The "anti's" are really annoying  :laugh:

The whole point of discussion forums is surely that people with sometimes contrasting views can discuss a given subject. If we were all died in the wool pro-Rafa Benitez devotees, then the place would become pretty boring pretty quickly. Similarly, if everyone hated the manager with a passion (I'm not sure anybody actually does but that seems to be the buzz phrase these days) it would be equally tedious.

As it is, if you start a thread asking the question "Have we missed a trick not signing Owen on a free" you get accused of all sorts. Not sure why really, as the sensible answer if you don't think we have is simply to say "No, and the reason we haven't is this". Unfortunately however, any football discussion on the forum has to meander through a minefield of people desperately trying to derail the conversation onto their favoured agenda, i.e. "you just hate the manager and this is an excuse to get at him".

It makes the World go round. It doesn't annoy me particularly, it makes me laugh sometimes more than anything.

As for "old faces" I've gone through that earlier.

there is a difference between constructive criticism and antis mate, as u know!
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Postby bigmick » Mon Jul 06, 2009 12:26 pm

supersub wrote:I merely posted a comment in referrence to a post by Lando so how did any moderating come into it...?

sadly it's the continued berating of the mods that has stained this forum of late...

As for the members who are banned; they will not be returning.

Well, entertaining though Lando's post obviously is, it is a fairly one sided view of the way the forum works. I think it was always going to be a fairly short price that although they may find it funny, there are a number of posters who wouldn't agree with his distillation of the way things work.

Like in most things, the truth in that particular argument is most likely in the middle (remember, this is not a pro and anti thread in any way whatsoever), but as a major contributor to it Lando naturally sees things exclusively from his own perspective.

That in itself is absolutely fine, but to see the chief mod saying he has "hit the nail on the head" was what promted the comment on the impartial moderating. If as it appears to be the case, the chief mod sees things exactly the same way as Lando does in his excellent post, it probably explains why some people get involved in "berating" the mods in general. Perhaps I'm wrong but it's just a theory so no bother.

Anyway to return the thread to it's initial thrust, as it isn't and wasn't a pro and anti thread, nor is it a "mod berater", it is a feeling I've had for some time that the card system as is doesn't really work. I certainly thought that when I was a mod myself, and I also think it now.
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Postby Igor Zidane » Mon Jul 06, 2009 12:48 pm

bigmick wrote:
supersub wrote:I merely posted a comment in referrence to a post by Lando so how did any moderating come into it...?

sadly it's the continued berating of the mods that has stained this forum of late...

As for the members who are banned; they will not be returning.

Well, entertaining though Lando's post obviously is, it is a fairly one sided view of the way the forum works. I think it was always going to be a fairly short price that although they may find it funny, there are a number of posters who wouldn't agree with his distillation of the way things work.

Like in most things, the truth in that particular argument is most likely in the middle (remember, this is not a pro and anti thread in any way whatsoever), but as a major contributor to it Lando naturally sees things exclusively from his own perspective.

That in itself is absolutely fine, but to see the chief mod saying he has "hit the nail on the head" was what promted the comment on the impartial moderating. If as it appears to be the case, the chief mod sees things exactly the same way as Lando does in his excellent post, it probably explains why some people get involved in "berating" the mods in general. Perhaps I'm wrong but it's just a theory so no bother.

Anyway to return the thread to it's initial thrust, as it isn't and wasn't a pro and anti thread, nor is it a "mod berater", it is a feeling I've had for some time that the card system as is doesn't really work. I certainly thought that when I was a mod myself, and I also think it now.

Mick you were a mod aswell , did you not have opinions then . Being a mod doesn't stop you from having opinions ,be they pro or anti . Supersub agreed with Lando's post ,nowt wrong in that.
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Postby bigmick » Mon Jul 06, 2009 12:56 pm

No Igor there's nothing wrong in having an opinion. When though someone labels a whole segment of the forum usership effectively a bunch a c...s and the chief mod says he's "hit the nail on the head" it perhaps explains why one or two people don't think impartiality figures too highly on the agenda. Sub is entitled to his opinion of course he is, but the fact that that is his opinion goes a long way IMHo towards explaining why there is a perception for some of unfairness.
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Postby dawson99 » Mon Jul 06, 2009 1:02 pm

bigmick wrote:No Igor there's nothing wrong in having an opinion. When though someone labels a whole segment of the forum usership effectively a bunch a c...s and the chief mod says he's "hit the nail on the head" it perhaps explains why one or two people don't think impartiality figures too highly on the agenda. Sub is entitled to his opinion of course he is, but the fact that that is his opinion goes a long way IMHo towards explaining why there is a perception for some of unfairness.

its on both sides. lando hit the nail on the head, but there are two nails.
we don't nned someone just saying 'kuyt's a cnut' non stop, and on the other hand Lando don't help himself...

It's either that as Liverpool fans we are all ultra passionate or we have a fair few aholes on this site... either way it's poor

and some of the ones who have been banned are massive bullies and good riddance
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Postby bigmick » Mon Jul 06, 2009 1:13 pm

Anyways, fair play to Sub for laying his cards so openly on the table. No point in pretending you're impartial if in fact you aren't.

Onto the point of the thread though, this is precisely my point. It shouldn't really matter how impartial mods are, the rules and the card system should be totally transparent.
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Postby aCe' » Mon Jul 06, 2009 2:06 pm

Lando_Griffin wrote:
bigmick wrote:I disagree with you usually Lando on the odd occasion you talk about football

And on that note, it's become quite clear that it is impossible to talk football with the anti's, as all they are interested in is shooting the gaffer at every God-given opportunity.

I'll level with you - you lot bore me to tears. The same sh*t over and over every single day, interspersed with the odd "where did it all go wrong" thread.

Well I'll tell you where it all went wrong - you lot found common ground in your communal hatred of all things Rafa, now when anyone says anything positive about the boss, you hunt them down like a pack of ill-informed hyenas.
You've got Saint, who insists he is an "on-the-fence" chap who explores all angles of debate, yet never (and I mean NEVER) posts anything positive about the boss.

You had peewee, who for some unknown reason was lauded as a valued poster, even though every word he ever typed was a scathing attack on Rafa, Kuyt or Sabre.

You have TheRock and Ace, who are so utterly clueless that I often mistake them for one another. They have a "Rafa is Satan's bedfellow and Kuyt is his maid" attitude. They hate him, but I bet you any money that neither one of them can tell you why.

You had Bam, who, with all the will in the World, would still lose a battle of wits with a jam sandwich. A horrible little squirt who hates Rafa for hundreds of reasons he would struggle to explain, and who wasted no time in attacking anyone who praised the boss. Bam was basically peewee's right-arm man, until they both went the way of Old Yellow.

Then there's you, Mick. Eloquent at times, but incessantly boring, you wear people down with your enormous appetite for drivel. You obviously spend the vast majority of your time all alone at work and wile away the hours by dreaming up more and more incredulous and outlandish ways to hate Rafa. I've no doubt you would deny it, but I bet you've thought about the size of Rafa's wedding tackle and, following the mental image that burdened you with, you hated him a little bit more.
For a long time you covered your own back with the pretense that you would "give him a fair crack", but this was blown out of the water recently with your resounding and somewhat overplayed revelation that you had firmly set up your 2-man in Camp Anti.

For longer than is humanly bearable the forum worked in the following way; you would thump out posts which dwarfed the entire unabridged large-print works of Shakespeare, closely followed by Saint saying something like "Oh yes, old bean - absolutely spiffing post". Then peewee would strike up with something resembling "yes mate and that is why rafa is a buffoon and kuyt sucks his c*ck".

Ren and Stimpy, AKA The Rock and Ace would then beat their literary meat over the anti's achievements in ridiculing the boss, and then sink back into obscurity.

One of the pro-Rafa posters would refute your claims with facts and mention in passing that peewee, TheRock and Acehole are a set of c*nts.
Cue the entrance, stage right, or Bam. Peewee's knight in stinking armour. He would wade in like the knuckle-headed oaf he truly is and start shooting his ill-educated mouth off in a desperate attempt to hang onto peewee's coattails.

Saint would post some spurious set of figures he had gone to extraordinary lengths to find in an attempt to belittle the pro-Rafa men, (well - Rafa - we all know that...).

Someone would post up the accurate figures, and Saint would withdraw.

TheRock would present to the watching World a masterclass in the art of the put down by quoting his favourite w*nking idol and saying "Know your role."

Ace would join the fray with a stunning rendition of startling similarity to TheRock, but add something like "you apple-swallower" or "your mum is a whore."

Both would hit the "Report to Moderator" button several times over.

At this stage, Heimdall would post something completely ludicrous, and then congratulate whichever poster he agreed with.

GBYS would pipe up with something that upsets the forum's self-appointed oracle, prompting the release of the 70 volume Encyclopedia BigMickittica, and the whole cycle would begin again.

----------------------------------------------------------

Now forgive me, Mick, if I don't have the time or inclination to become embroiled in this pointless cycle any more. You lot have managed to make yourselves harder to debate football with than Everton fans.

That is, of course, unless you are an Anti, in which case the World is full of fluffy animals and the sky is always blue...


I'm not suggesting that the pro's are innocent, of course. But I honestly feel that it is a very sorry state of affairs indeed when it is frowned upon to support the gaffer.

Oh how the wise have spoken...
Its a shame you dont seem to use that big mouth of yours to discuss footie... but understandable i have to say...
What i dont get though is why you come on a Liverpool forum to call others kunts and simply argue about posters rather than talk some footie every once in a while...
Hell, ive seen you in the tennis thread more than i have in any other footie section on this forum and that says something !
Your footie "knowledge" ,and i use the term loosely, seems to be limited to "Rafa knows best" and "we're going to win the league... fck yea!" ... no wonder not many tend to discuss jack sht with you ... its because you know fck all pumpkins and it would be easier teaching a chimp how to integrate than it would be trying to discuss footie with you 'and your likes'...
Surely theres a suicide prevention forum somewhere you could join that would make you feel a whole lot better about yourself big guy, just dont come here complaining about others trying to keep a football discussion going...
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Postby Bammo » Mon Jul 06, 2009 3:28 pm

Out of interest Mick, how many people on here would have earned cards just in this thread alone? :laugh:

no naming names or it'll kick off in here  :;):

There needs to be some sort of reform to the card system as sometimes it isn't a deterrent. A few people have got 3 or 4 cards in under 100 posts so it's obvious they're here to start arguments. The whole point of discussion forums is to discuss and that should be done in a mature way.

There will always be disagreements of people but a threads get ruined by petty name calling. If I go into the Alonso thread it's because I want to find out some inside knowledge not so I can read through 3 pages of personal insults.

One thing I would say seems to be slipping under the mods' radar is homophobic language. It's not a good image for the board if people visiting the site think it's full of neanderthals. Racism wouldn't be tolerated so why is this allowed?
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Postby Toffeehater » Mon Jul 06, 2009 3:48 pm

Lando_Griffin wrote:
bigmick wrote:I disagree with you usually Lando on the odd occasion you talk about football

And on that note, it's become quite clear that it is impossible to talk football with the anti's, as all they are interested in is shooting the gaffer at every God-given opportunity.

I'll level with you - you lot bore me to tears. The same sh*t over and over every single day, interspersed with the odd "where did it all go wrong" thread.

Well I'll tell you where it all went wrong - you lot found common ground in your communal hatred of all things Rafa, now when anyone says anything positive about the boss, you hunt them down like a pack of ill-informed hyenas.
You've got Saint, who insists he is an "on-the-fence" chap who explores all angles of debate, yet never (and I mean NEVER) posts anything positive about the boss.

You had peewee, who for some unknown reason was lauded as a valued poster, even though every word he ever typed was a scathing attack on Rafa, Kuyt or Sabre.

You have TheRock and Ace, who are so utterly clueless that I often mistake them for one another. They have a "Rafa is Satan's bedfellow and Kuyt is his maid" attitude. They hate him, but I bet you any money that neither one of them can tell you why.

You had Bam, who, with all the will in the World, would still lose a battle of wits with a jam sandwich. A horrible little squirt who hates Rafa for hundreds of reasons he would struggle to explain, and who wasted no time in attacking anyone who praised the boss. Bam was basically peewee's right-arm man, until they both went the way of Old Yellow.

Then there's you, Mick. Eloquent at times, but incessantly boring, you wear people down with your enormous appetite for drivel. You obviously spend the vast majority of your time all alone at work and wile away the hours by dreaming up more and more incredulous and outlandish ways to hate Rafa. I've no doubt you would deny it, but I bet you've thought about the size of Rafa's wedding tackle and, following the mental image that burdened you with, you hated him a little bit more.
For a long time you covered your own back with the pretense that you would "give him a fair crack", but this was blown out of the water recently with your resounding and somewhat overplayed revelation that you had firmly set up your 2-man in Camp Anti.

For longer than is humanly bearable the forum worked in the following way; you would thump out posts which dwarfed the entire unabridged large-print works of Shakespeare, closely followed by Saint saying something like "Oh yes, old bean - absolutely spiffing post". Then peewee would strike up with something resembling "yes mate and that is why rafa is a buffoon and kuyt sucks his c*ck".

Ren and Stimpy, AKA The Rock and Ace would then beat their literary meat over the anti's achievements in ridiculing the boss, and then sink back into obscurity.

One of the pro-Rafa posters would refute your claims with facts and mention in passing that peewee, TheRock and Acehole are a set of c*nts.
Cue the entrance, stage right, or Bam. Peewee's knight in stinking armour. He would wade in like the knuckle-headed oaf he truly is and start shooting his ill-educated mouth off in a desperate attempt to hang onto peewee's coattails.

Saint would post some spurious set of figures he had gone to extraordinary lengths to find in an attempt to belittle the pro-Rafa men, (well - Rafa - we all know that...).

Someone would post up the accurate figures, and Saint would withdraw.

TheRock would present to the watching World a masterclass in the art of the put down by quoting his favourite w*nking idol and saying "Know your role."

Ace would join the fray with a stunning rendition of startling similarity to TheRock, but add something like "you apple-swallower" or "your mum is a whore."

Both would hit the "Report to Moderator" button several times over.

At this stage, Heimdall would post something completely ludicrous, and then congratulate whichever poster he agreed with.

GBYS would pipe up with something that upsets the forum's self-appointed oracle, prompting the release of the 70 volume Encyclopedia BigMickittica, and the whole cycle would begin again.

----------------------------------------------------------

Now forgive me, Mick, if I don't have the time or inclination to become embroiled in this pointless cycle any more. You lot have managed to make yourselves harder to debate football with than Everton fans.

That is, of course, unless you are an Anti, in which case the World is full of fluffy animals and the sky is always blue...


I'm not suggesting that the pro's are innocent, of course. But I honestly feel that it is a very sorry state of affairs indeed when it is frowned upon to support the gaffer.

:buttrock  :laugh:  :laugh: , what a fecking post
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Postby Bad Bob » Mon Jul 06, 2009 4:25 pm

Well, personally, I don't think Lando's hit the nail on the head.  I'm fairly 'happy clappy' myself as it goes but, when it comes to the 'doom and gloomers', I support the old adage 'I may not agree with what you say but I'll defend your right to say it.'  This forum would be a p!ss poor place without the likes of Mick taking a critical look at things now and again.  For that reason, I don't like to see criticism shouted down with abuse or buried beneath a barrage of niggling questions (of the 'so what do you do for a living?' or 'do you go the game?' type).  I understand the cathartic pleasure that comes with calling someone you utterly disagree with a c.unt sometimes but that kind of thing is used too early and often around here, IMO.  I'm also not one of those that finds the constant lobbing of abuse especially funny nor especially acceptable because it was done in the past.  I also agree with Bammo, Mick and (earlier) Andy G about the need to stamp out the incessant homophobia around here.  It's neither big nor clever and is a far greater stain on this place than any plagiarism ever could be.

That's my perspective anyway but, as a few people like to remind me, I can come across as a bit patronizing.  And, as others occasionally like to point out, I'm neither Scouse nor British and so don't quite understand all the nuances of British humour.  I guess this means that I run the danger of being too heavy-handed in cracking down on things that others don't see as that big a deal.  It was getting that way a bit during the middle of the season so I took the decision to back off a bit and let people get on with things.  That seemed to work out alright but I sense that the pendulum is now swinging back in the direction of more Mod intervention.  As I said earlier, though, I'd like to see a pretty clear consensus established before we re-jig the Newkit code of conduct--that way it won't be misinterpreted as one Mod's agenda.  Lando's obviously a dissenting voice but it remains to be seen whether he's in the minority or not.
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Postby account deleted by request » Mon Jul 06, 2009 5:24 pm

Bad Bob wrote:Well, personally, I don't think Lando's hit the nail on the head.  I'm fairly 'happy clappy' myself as it goes but, when it comes to the 'doom and gloomers', I support the old adage 'I may not agree with what you say but I'll defend your right to say it.'  This forum would be a p!ss poor place without the likes of Mick taking a critical look at things now and again.  For that reason, I don't like to see criticism shouted down with abuse or buried beneath a barrage of niggling questions (of the 'so what do you do for a living?' or 'do you go the game?' type).  I understand the cathartic pleasure that comes with calling someone you utterly disagree with a c.unt sometimes but that kind of thing is used too early and often around here, IMO.  I'm also not one of those that finds the constant lobbing of abuse especially funny nor especially acceptable because it was done in the past.  I also agree with Bammo, Mick and (earlier) Andy G about the need to stamp out the incessant homophobia around here.  It's neither big nor clever and is a far greater stain on this place than any plagiarism ever could be.

That's my perspective anyway but, as a few people like to remind me, I can come across as a bit patronizing.  And, as others occasionally like to point out, I'm neither Scouse nor British and so don't quite understand all the nuances of British humour.  I guess this means that I run the danger of being too heavy-handed in cracking down on things that others don't see as that big a deal.  It was getting that way a bit during the middle of the season so I took the decision to back off a bit and let people get on with things.  That seemed to work out alright but I sense that the pendulum is now swinging back in the direction of more Mod intervention.  As I said earlier, though, I'd like to see a pretty clear consensus established before we re-jig the Newkit code of conduct--that way it won't be misinterpreted as one Mod's agenda.  Lando's obviously a dissenting voice but it remains to be seen whether he's in the minority or not.

Spot on Bob.

As seems popular at the moment I will quote the rules of the site on this particular issue :-

Threads which degenerate into long drawn out abusive slanging matches between members will ultimately be closed.  Members have the right to express their opinions without fear of being bashed or flamed.  They also have the right to offer good firm opinions and to debate strongly.  If you do feel the need to spoil discussions with insults and personal arguments, do it by PM or whichever way you wish to settle it, but KEEP IT OFF THE FORUM. Consistent and frequent abusive conduct towards other members is not allowed and members guilty of continuous abusive conduct will be warned by the moderators.  Baiting other members to start arguments with you will not be tolerated and persistence with this will result in a posting suspension or a total ban.  Please don't waste your time writing obscene or abusive posts as the forum is moderated and such posts will be deleted or at best edited to ensure the universal appeal of the forums content.
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Postby Lando_Griffin » Mon Jul 06, 2009 5:32 pm

aCe' wrote:
Lando_Griffin wrote:
bigmick wrote:I disagree with you usually Lando on the odd occasion you talk about football

And on that note, it's become quite clear that it is impossible to talk football with the anti's, as all they are interested in is shooting the gaffer at every God-given opportunity.

I'll level with you - you lot bore me to tears. The same sh*t over and over every single day, interspersed with the odd "where did it all go wrong" thread.

Well I'll tell you where it all went wrong - you lot found common ground in your communal hatred of all things Rafa, now when anyone says anything positive about the boss, you hunt them down like a pack of ill-informed hyenas.
You've got Saint, who insists he is an "on-the-fence" chap who explores all angles of debate, yet never (and I mean NEVER) posts anything positive about the boss.

You had peewee, who for some unknown reason was lauded as a valued poster, even though every word he ever typed was a scathing attack on Rafa, Kuyt or Sabre.

You have TheRock and Ace, who are so utterly clueless that I often mistake them for one another. They have a "Rafa is Satan's bedfellow and Kuyt is his maid" attitude. They hate him, but I bet you any money that neither one of them can tell you why.

You had Bam, who, with all the will in the World, would still lose a battle of wits with a jam sandwich. A horrible little squirt who hates Rafa for hundreds of reasons he would struggle to explain, and who wasted no time in attacking anyone who praised the boss. Bam was basically peewee's right-arm man, until they both went the way of Old Yellow.

Then there's you, Mick. Eloquent at times, but incessantly boring, you wear people down with your enormous appetite for drivel. You obviously spend the vast majority of your time all alone at work and wile away the hours by dreaming up more and more incredulous and outlandish ways to hate Rafa. I've no doubt you would deny it, but I bet you've thought about the size of Rafa's wedding tackle and, following the mental image that burdened you with, you hated him a little bit more.
For a long time you covered your own back with the pretense that you would "give him a fair crack", but this was blown out of the water recently with your resounding and somewhat overplayed revelation that you had firmly set up your 2-man in Camp Anti.

For longer than is humanly bearable the forum worked in the following way; you would thump out posts which dwarfed the entire unabridged large-print works of Shakespeare, closely followed by Saint saying something like "Oh yes, old bean - absolutely spiffing post". Then peewee would strike up with something resembling "yes mate and that is why rafa is a buffoon and kuyt sucks his c*ck".

Ren and Stimpy, AKA The Rock and Ace would then beat their literary meat over the anti's achievements in ridiculing the boss, and then sink back into obscurity.

One of the pro-Rafa posters would refute your claims with facts and mention in passing that peewee, TheRock and Acehole are a set of c*nts.
Cue the entrance, stage right, or Bam. Peewee's knight in stinking armour. He would wade in like the knuckle-headed oaf he truly is and start shooting his ill-educated mouth off in a desperate attempt to hang onto peewee's coattails.

Saint would post some spurious set of figures he had gone to extraordinary lengths to find in an attempt to belittle the pro-Rafa men, (well - Rafa - we all know that...).

Someone would post up the accurate figures, and Saint would withdraw.

TheRock would present to the watching World a masterclass in the art of the put down by quoting his favourite w*nking idol and saying "Know your role."

Ace would join the fray with a stunning rendition of startling similarity to TheRock, but add something like "you apple-swallower" or "your mum is a whore."

Both would hit the "Report to Moderator" button several times over.

At this stage, Heimdall would post something completely ludicrous, and then congratulate whichever poster he agreed with.

GBYS would pipe up with something that upsets the forum's self-appointed oracle, prompting the release of the 70 volume Encyclopedia BigMickittica, and the whole cycle would begin again.

----------------------------------------------------------

Now forgive me, Mick, if I don't have the time or inclination to become embroiled in this pointless cycle any more. You lot have managed to make yourselves harder to debate football with than Everton fans.

That is, of course, unless you are an Anti, in which case the World is full of fluffy animals and the sky is always blue...


I'm not suggesting that the pro's are innocent, of course. But I honestly feel that it is a very sorry state of affairs indeed when it is frowned upon to support the gaffer.

Oh how the wise have spoken...
Its a shame you dont seem to use that big mouth of yours to discuss footie... but understandable i have to say...
What i dont get though is why you come on a Liverpool forum to call others kunts and simply argue about posters rather than talk some footie every once in a while...
Hell, ive seen you in the tennis thread more than i have in any other footie section on this forum and that says something !
Your footie "knowledge" ,and i use the term loosely, seems to be limited to "Rafa knows best" and "we're going to win the league... fck yea!" ... no wonder not many tend to discuss jack sht with you ... its because you know fck all pumpkins and it would be easier teaching a chimp how to integrate than it would be trying to discuss footie with you 'and your likes'...
Surely theres a suicide prevention forum somewhere you could join that would make you feel a whole lot better about yourself big guy, just dont come here complaining about others trying to keep a football discussion going...

There is no "debate" with you, darling.You are like a woman on the rag - all reason is out of the window.

From what I can see, your "football knowledge" is essentially "Essien is the best in the World. Iniesta is better than Alonso. Ferguson is better than Benitez. We should sign some Brazilian who nobody has heard of, but whom has scored 30 goals for me on Fifa '09..."

You are a simpleton who could not win a debate with a bucket. If you had any footballing nous you would see that Kuyt, far from a donkey, is a Dutch International who has scored some very important goals for this club. His value is easily more than the £10m we paid for him, and he runs through walls for the club.

You would see that some things are more important than mere ability. (You seem to have a ridiculous idea of who should or shouldn't be playing for Liverpool - Essien, Ronaldo, Tevez.

You would see the traditions of this club are to support the players out on the field and the boss, and NEVER say the things you do about them.

You would see that a former Kop idol should NEVER sign for Man Utd no matter what the reasons, let alone be wished luck for such a treacherous transfer.

You would see that the majority of the players you recommend would fall on their faces in England against the likes of Stoke, Hull and Bristol as they lack the determination required.

You would see that some players, no matter what their ability, are not characters Liverpool should tolerate.

You would see that Babel, whilst not short of talent, requires a deep-sea diving team to locate his intelligence, desire and heart, and THAT is why he has limited playing time.

You would see that Rafa is one of the most decorated managers in the World, that we were in a right state when he joined us, and that he has turned us into a force to be reckoned with.

You WOULD see all that, if you had the knowledge. You would also see that my repeated attempts to discuss football were lost in a sea of anti propaganda long ago, so I just stopped bothering, and reverted to debating with people able to do this...
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Postby maypaxvobiscum » Mon Jul 06, 2009 5:35 pm

Hi Saint :)

well, in an ideal world, the rules which you have quoted would have been followed. however as we all know, it doesn't and it won't.
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Postby Lando_Griffin » Mon Jul 06, 2009 5:35 pm

s@int wrote:
Bad Bob wrote:Well, personally, I don't think Lando's hit the nail on the head.  I'm fairly 'happy clappy' myself as it goes but, when it comes to the 'doom and gloomers', I support the old adage 'I may not agree with what you say but I'll defend your right to say it.'  This forum would be a p!ss poor place without the likes of Mick taking a critical look at things now and again.  For that reason, I don't like to see criticism shouted down with abuse or buried beneath a barrage of niggling questions (of the 'so what do you do for a living?' or 'do you go the game?' type).  I understand the cathartic pleasure that comes with calling someone you utterly disagree with a c.unt sometimes but that kind of thing is used too early and often around here, IMO.  I'm also not one of those that finds the constant lobbing of abuse especially funny nor especially acceptable because it was done in the past.  I also agree with Bammo, Mick and (earlier) Andy G about the need to stamp out the incessant homophobia around here.  It's neither big nor clever and is a far greater stain on this place than any plagiarism ever could be.

That's my perspective anyway but, as a few people like to remind me, I can come across as a bit patronizing.  And, as others occasionally like to point out, I'm neither Scouse nor British and so don't quite understand all the nuances of British humour.  I guess this means that I run the danger of being too heavy-handed in cracking down on things that others don't see as that big a deal.  It was getting that way a bit during the middle of the season so I took the decision to back off a bit and let people get on with things.  That seemed to work out alright but I sense that the pendulum is now swinging back in the direction of more Mod intervention.  As I said earlier, though, I'd like to see a pretty clear consensus established before we re-jig the Newkit code of conduct--that way it won't be misinterpreted as one Mod's agenda.  Lando's obviously a dissenting voice but it remains to be seen whether he's in the minority or not.

Spot on Bob.

As seems popular at the moment I will quote the rules of the site on this particular issue :-

Threads which degenerate into long drawn out abusive slanging matches between members will ultimately be closed.  Members have the right to express their opinions without fear of being bashed or flamed.  They also have the right to offer good firm opinions and to debate strongly.  If you do feel the need to spoil discussions with insults and personal arguments, do it by PM or whichever way you wish to settle it, but KEEP IT OFF THE FORUM. Consistent and frequent abusive conduct towards other members is not allowed and members guilty of continuous abusive conduct will be warned by the moderators.  Baiting other members to start arguments with you will not be tolerated and persistence with this will result in a posting suspension or a total ban.  Please don't waste your time writing obscene or abusive posts as the forum is moderated and such posts will be deleted or at best edited to ensure the universal appeal of the forums content.

Well it's a pity the anti's feel that they should be exempt from these rules.

The amount of insults thrown at Rafa and Kuyt is shameful, and whilst it continues I shall do the same in return.
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Postby account deleted by request » Mon Jul 06, 2009 5:45 pm

Lando_Griffin wrote:
s@int wrote:
Bad Bob wrote:Well, personally, I don't think Lando's hit the nail on the head.  I'm fairly 'happy clappy' myself as it goes but, when it comes to the 'doom and gloomers', I support the old adage 'I may not agree with what you say but I'll defend your right to say it.'  This forum would be a p!ss poor place without the likes of Mick taking a critical look at things now and again.  For that reason, I don't like to see criticism shouted down with abuse or buried beneath a barrage of niggling questions (of the 'so what do you do for a living?' or 'do you go the game?' type).  I understand the cathartic pleasure that comes with calling someone you utterly disagree with a c.unt sometimes but that kind of thing is used too early and often around here, IMO.  I'm also not one of those that finds the constant lobbing of abuse especially funny nor especially acceptable because it was done in the past.  I also agree with Bammo, Mick and (earlier) Andy G about the need to stamp out the incessant homophobia around here.  It's neither big nor clever and is a far greater stain on this place than any plagiarism ever could be.

That's my perspective anyway but, as a few people like to remind me, I can come across as a bit patronizing.  And, as others occasionally like to point out, I'm neither Scouse nor British and so don't quite understand all the nuances of British humour.  I guess this means that I run the danger of being too heavy-handed in cracking down on things that others don't see as that big a deal.  It was getting that way a bit during the middle of the season so I took the decision to back off a bit and let people get on with things.  That seemed to work out alright but I sense that the pendulum is now swinging back in the direction of more Mod intervention.  As I said earlier, though, I'd like to see a pretty clear consensus established before we re-jig the Newkit code of conduct--that way it won't be misinterpreted as one Mod's agenda.  Lando's obviously a dissenting voice but it remains to be seen whether he's in the minority or not.

Spot on Bob.

As seems popular at the moment I will quote the rules of the site on this particular issue :-

Threads which degenerate into long drawn out abusive slanging matches between members will ultimately be closed.  Members have the right to express their opinions without fear of being bashed or flamed.  They also have the right to offer good firm opinions and to debate strongly.  If you do feel the need to spoil discussions with insults and personal arguments, do it by PM or whichever way you wish to settle it, but KEEP IT OFF THE FORUM. Consistent and frequent abusive conduct towards other members is not allowed and members guilty of continuous abusive conduct will be warned by the moderators.  Baiting other members to start arguments with you will not be tolerated and persistence with this will result in a posting suspension or a total ban.  Please don't waste your time writing obscene or abusive posts as the forum is moderated and such posts will be deleted or at best edited to ensure the universal appeal of the forums content.

Well it's a pity the anti's feel that they should be exempt from these rules.

The amount of insults thrown at Rafa and Kuyt is shameful, and whilst it continues I shall do the same in return.

I can't possibly comment on what the Anti's feel because I am a middle of the road well balanced poster :D  I do think however that giving an opinion that we could get better than Kuyt or even Rafa is not insulting them. 

It seems more like some people prefer to throw their toys out of the pram at the first opportunity rather than engage in meaningful debate.

This is a forum, not all views will be the same, the only thing that we all hopefully can agree on is we want a successful club. We will all have differing views on how that can best be achieved.
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