Liverpool FC Forum

by **NANNY RED** » Wed Nov 21, 2007 11:56 pm

Kharhaz wrote:We may well see the best of Gerrard up until the end of the season knowing that there are no future england matches of importance so his focus can solely be on Liverpool.

You just watch now how many pathetic friendlies were gonna play.

On an other note your going to have every Tom Dick and Harry now calling for a minimum foreign player rule in the league . There going to be blaming this defeat on two many foreign players in one team and not enough English talent playing together week in week out,

The grassroots debate is gonna be strong for a while

by **Kharhaz** » Thu Nov 22, 2007 12:08 am

NANNY RED wrote:
Kharhaz wrote:We may well see the best of Gerrard up until the end of the season knowing that there are no future england matches of importance so his focus can solely be on Liverpool.

You just watch now how many pathetic friendlies were gonna play.

On an other note your going to have every Tom Dick and Harry now calling for a minimum foreign player rule in the league . There going to be blaming this defeat on two many foreign players in one team and not enough English talent playing together week in week out,

The grassroots debate is gonna be strong for a while

Perhaps, if Mclaren stays, but im guessing that Mclarens out of there because there is not one person in britain who rates him as a coach. And should there be pointless friendlies in the future during the season then that will cause uproar amongst the managers in the premiership so I doubt that would happen.

by **puroresu** » Thu Nov 22, 2007 12:09 am

NANNY RED wrote:
Kharhaz wrote:We may well see the best of Gerrard up until the end of the season knowing that there are no future england matches of importance so his focus can solely be on Liverpool.

You just watch now how many pathetic friendlies were gonna play.

On an other note your going to have every Tom Dick and Harry now calling for a minimum foreign player rule in the league . There going to be blaming this defeat on two many foreign players in one team and not enough English talent playing together week in week out,

The grassroots debate is gonna be strong for a while

Couple of good articles about foriegners and youth football.

http://news.independent.co.uk/business/comment/article3174456.ece

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol....642.ece

Youth football is the problem. Lack of coaching!! By the time they hit 15 & 16 its too late.

by **The Manhattan Project** » Thu Nov 22, 2007 12:12 am

English players seem to lack ideas.

Floating balls into the box. That's all.

Foreign players tend to be resourceful.

Always a constant threat.

by **NANNY RED** » Thu Nov 22, 2007 12:26 am

I think this lads spot on with some of his comments

I think the England hierachy have got a lot to answer to aswell they are the ones who shut the national academys down. Greed to fill there fat pockets

A few good points by this lad i have copied and put here

The first is simply a question of ability. Despite all the hype, English players just aren't good enough.

The second is a question of money. English players won't go abroad because they're paid way too much money at home. As money has poured into the Premier League, so the top clubs have become monopsonies, with monopolistic player-buying power (which raises a whole bunch of other questions about the distorting effects on competition of the influx of super-rich owners).

The monetary incentive for English players to move abroad is reduced and, as a result, their development into world class international players is possibly stifled. Playing in only the one league may make a player very rich, but there's no guarantee that he'll end up with the flexibility and creativity that may be required for success at international level. The demand for quotas to limit the number of foreign players in the Premier League is nonsense. It's really no more than an infant industry argument – protecting your domestic business in the light of tough foreign competition – in an industry which can hardly be described as being in its infancy.

The Premier League may currently be one of the better leagues in the world, but that's only because foreign players have been allowed in. As with any quota system, reducing their presence might provide more opportunities for English players, but only at the expense of a lower quality of football. It's difficult to see how that, alone, would lead to any improvement in the national team's footballing fortunes.

by **Alonso14** » Thu Nov 22, 2007 12:34 am

Its time to clear the team of all the old dogs who won't be there for the next world cup. I don't care if someones on 99 caps or whatever. As many young players as possible, get them all playing together, build an understanding. Its about time Gerrard calls it a day on the international front.

by **Dalglish** » Thu Nov 22, 2007 12:37 am

I thought Croatia were by far the best team tonight and some of their interplay was great to watch.

At international level there is a world of difference between the individual abilities of players aka Lampard, Gerrard, Cole etc and the ability to perform as a team and tonight it was 11 individuals against 1 team.

Do I care ? Well not as much as I used to. I was born in 1966, the last time England won anything of note and have grown up with expectation that we could do well at international level. 1990 was possibly our last realistic chance of winning a major competition and some would argue we should have won the WC in 1990 but since then it's been huff and puff and a plethora of missed penalties.

Carragher had the right idea when totally disillusioned by being overlooked by players like Wes Brown FFS he decided to concentrate on club affairs and in the process possibly extend his club career by 2 or 3 years. Like Carragher, my loyalties as a football fan will always lie with my club and not some over egged and overrated International team managed by the FA's puppet !

Q - Whats the difference between Lewis Hamilton and the FA ?

A - Lewis will still have a McClaren in the morning !

by **puroresu** » Thu Nov 22, 2007 12:38 am

England do suffer with the lack of players playing in different leagues.

by **account deleted by request** » Thu Nov 22, 2007 12:47 am

Dalglish wrote:Q - Whats the difference between Lewis Hamilton and the FA ?

A - Lewis will still have a McClaren in the morning !

by **Kharhaz** » Thu Nov 22, 2007 1:08 am

The first is simply a question of ability. Despite all the hype, English players just aren't good enough.

I disagree. The problem us english have is that when we find someone english with talent the price quadruples to players of the same ability around the world. Take Rio Ferdinand, Man Utd paid £30 million or something? Over the top ? definately, think of the world class defenders you could have got for less. Thats the problem, the talent is there, but it usually costs the buying club a fortune to buy him, especially from a lower league club and the premiership clubs will wait until his contract is ending before making another offer, thrust into the reserves and long forgotten.
Like I said, the talent is there when we stop overpricing the talent that is there everyone will be better off.

by **Dalglish** » Thu Nov 22, 2007 1:11 am

Kharhaz wrote:The problem us english have is that when we find someone english with talent the price quadruples to players of the same ability around the world.

Not for Scott Carson it won't after THAT performance .....His value has fallen quicker than Northern Rock shares after tonights shocker ! :oops:

by **account deleted by request** » Thu Nov 22, 2007 1:14 am

England Home Shirt 2007/09 with England v Croatia 21.11.07 Commemorative printing
Price: £25.52 (Ex VAT)
Was: £39.99 (Ex VAT) You Save: 25%

Anyone interested in a new dish cloth?

by **ivor_the_injun** » Thu Nov 22, 2007 1:18 am

Well McLaren brought it upon himself. How many times did he have a look at Gerrard and Lampard together and see that they just cannot function in the same side? He had a good structure to the side with Gerrard and Barry in the middle of a 4, and no matter how many injuries he's had to contend with, there was absolutely no excuse p*ssing away a successful formula.

Hats off to Crouch tonight. England's MOM by a country mile, and I really hoped his goal would get him the headlines. We were an absolute shambles throughout though, and a draw would have been complete and utter robbery - I can't believe how terrible Croatia made us look.

I'm gutted, but not surprised. We've been limited for so long at international level, and seeing Bent come on for Cole just summed the team up for me. Hit and hope, constantly. Quite why we can't muster up a side in this country that get it down on the floor and pass it around to feet I simply do not understand. Towards the end we just didn't get the ball, and on the few occasions we did, it was hopelessly lobbed forward down the middle. That seems to be our default setting when we need a goal, and it's just embarrassing to watch. Croatia played a simple, structured passing game, and it just took us apart. All credit to them. There were two minutes in the second half when they kept the ball so simply by passing and moving, and we just didn't get a foot on the ball.

Not to mention the fact that their fans made the business class jolly-getters that constitute England's support look and sound like a few kids reciting nursery rhymes.

I'll happily keep an eye on Croatia next summer - that kind of football is exactly what the European Championships should consist of, and we're kidding ourselves if we think our rudimentary, Wimbledon-esque brand of football can compete with it.

by **ivor_the_injun** » Thu Nov 22, 2007 1:21 am

Oh, and Carson's howler shouldn't be used as a mask to our failings. It was far from the difference between the two sides. They could've had 5 or 6.

by **LFC2007** » Thu Nov 22, 2007 1:32 am

Kharhaz wrote:
The first is simply a question of ability. Despite all the hype, English players just aren't good enough.

I disagree. The problem us english have is that when we find someone english with talent the price quadruples to players of the same ability around the world. Take Rio Ferdinand, Man Utd paid £30 million or something? Over the top ? definately, think of the world class defenders you could have got for less. Thats the problem, the talent is there, but it usually costs the buying club a fortune to buy him, especially from a lower league club and the premiership clubs will wait until his contract is ending before making another offer, thrust into the reserves and long forgotten.
Like I said, the talent is there when we stop overpricing the talent that is there everyone will be better off.

I think we possess enough quality individuals with which to form a successful team, certainly one that exceeds our current standing by a country mile. However, on a wider scale, I don't see a wealth of talent.

I think technical ability comes into it to a certain degree with our national team, although you could point to the Spanish national team, who for all their technical ability have won sweet fa in recent times.

I think at national team level, the issues are more to do with the balance of the side, and the management above all else.

In terms of English talent on a wider scale, I think we do lack technically sound players, and this is in my view largely down to coaching methods from an early age.

I'd contend that the reason quality English players who are technically adept are so expensive, is because they are simply in short supply. It's partly, although not entirely, a case of supply and demand.

The game is increasingly fast, and consequently increasingly technical, especially at the highest level i.e. in the EPL.

Teams will look wherever they can find these abilities, and they tend to be abroad.

Liverpool FC Forum

Euro qualifiers - england post mortem here

Who is online