Liverpool FC Forum

by **lakes10** » Sun Dec 06, 2009 1:32 am

at the end of the day we must beat Arsenal at all costs, big gap going into the xmas games is not what we are looking for.

by **maguskwt** » Sun Dec 06, 2009 3:45 am

What is worrying to me is that there are currently 3 teams above us who has played one less game. This is the negative side.

But then again if you look at the positive side, who would have thought that we are only 12 points behind the leaders after one of our worst start to the season in decades. There must be some hope in there. Both Chelsea and the Mancs have lost 3 times this season despite their league leading forms. But the hope depends on the team turning around the fortunes very very quickly and pick up form very very soon. And hopefully this will happen once we get most of our players fit: Torres and Gerrard back to their destructive best, Riera and Benayoun rediscover their last season's forms, and Aquilani cementing his place in the team at last and playing a blinder the rest of the season. If that happens 12 points is not impossible to overcome. The Mancs have proved this against Newcastle. If it doesn't then we really have to scrape for 4th place.

Another positive is that our defense seem to be picking up. Agger has reclaimed his starting position which is deserved IMO as I feel he is a much better player than Skrtl. Skrtl is a good defender but once his confidence is shattered he has been very very shaky. Agger on the hand seem to have alot more confidence than Skrtl. I am abit worried about his condition though, I don't know what kind of ailment or injury he has but he seems very very skinny nowadays.

I believe this is critical point in Rafa's Liverpool career. If we survive this horrid season with a decent success such as a top four finish plus the FA cup I believe we will not be very far from glory days under Benitez. If we finish mid table and not win anything, Rafa will be gone soon. After all this is exactly what Sir Alex went through.

by **maguskwt** » Sun Dec 06, 2009 3:59 am

And I now agree with bigmick that that Ngog is not good enough. He is unbelieveably slow! Crouch was way way better than him despite being slow...

by **bigmick** » Sun Dec 06, 2009 4:30 am

maguskwt wrote:But then again if you look at the positive side, who would have thought that we are only 12 points behind the leaders after one of our worst start to the season in decades. There must be some hope in there. Both Chelsea and the Mancs have lost 3 times this season despite their league leading forms. But the hope depends on the team turning around the fortunes very very quickly and pick up form very very soon. And hopefully this will happen once we get most of our players fit: Torres and Gerrard back to their destructive best, Riera and Benayoun rediscover their last season's forms, and Aquilani cementing his place in the team at last and playing a blinder the rest of the season. If that happens 12 points is not impossible to overcome. The Mancs have proved this against Newcastle. If it doesn't then we really have to scrape for 4th place.

Does this paragraph mean that you still think we have a chance of winning the Premiership mate

.

Fair play if you do, that's what I call believing to the bitter end.

by **red_guy** » Sun Dec 06, 2009 5:18 am

maguskwt wrote:But then again if you look at the positive side, who would have thought that we are only 12 points behind the leaders after one of our worst start to the season in decades. There must be some hope in there. Both Chelsea and the Mancs have lost 3 times this season despite their league leading forms. But the hope depends on the team turning around the fortunes very very quickly and pick up form very very soon. And hopefully this will happen once we get most of our players fit: Torres and Gerrard back to their destructive best, Riera and Benayoun rediscover their last season's forms, and Aquilani cementing his place in the team at last and playing a blinder the rest of the season. If that happens 12 points is not impossible to overcome. The Mancs have proved this against Newcastle. If it doesn't then we really have to scrape for 4th place.

That's what we all hope for but comparing us (our current team and form) to the manure....well,to be honest, we were never as consistent as them and the chances of us replicating that? Highly unlikely or in other words, unrealistic.

by **Penguins** » Sun Dec 06, 2009 6:56 am

maguskwt wrote:And I now agree with bigmick that that Ngog is not good enough. He is unbelieveably slow! Crouch was way way better than him despite being slow...

Duh, Ngog cost 1.5 million, Crouch 7 million.
Not rocket science is it?

Not good enough but the 2nd best striker we have I'm afraid.

by **shanklygates** » Sun Dec 06, 2009 7:23 am

liverpool wont make the top 4 this season.

by **Owzat** » Sun Dec 06, 2009 8:09 am

Penguins wrote:
maguskwt wrote:And I now agree with bigmick that that Ngog is not good enough. He is unbelieveably slow! Crouch was way way better than him despite being slow...

Duh, Ngog cost 1.5 million, Crouch 7 million.
Not rocket science is it?

Not good enough but the 2nd best striker we have I'm afraid.

Crouch : 42 goals in 134 apps (0.313 goals/app)
N'Gog : 8 goals in 32 apps (0.250 goals/app)

Not nearly as clear cut as some might think, in N'Gog's favour if you account for mins/goal : Crouch 189, N'Gog 159

Even I'd probably prefer Crouch in the side to N'Gog, but wouldn't be that much more sure of him scoring

by **Owzat** » Sun Dec 06, 2009 8:21 am

bigmick wrote:
metalhead wrote:It doesn't look good, it really doesn't, but stats prove we do so much better at the second half of the season.

Bit of an urban myth unfortunately mate. The stats actually prove (or at least they have in the past as I recall) that there is little difference between our second half of the season and our first normally.

Obviously it would be nice if this season was the exception to the rule.

92/93 : 29-30 (+1)
93/94 : 32-28 (-4)
94/95 : 39-35 (-4)
95/96 : 34-37 (+3)
96/97 : 38-30 (-8)
97/98 : 34-31 (-3)
98/99 : 28-26 (-2)
99/00 : 33-36 (+3)
00/01 : 34-33 (-1)
01/02 : 37-43 (+6)
02/03 : 32-32 (even)
03/04 : 29-31 (+2)
04/05 : 31-27 (-4)
05/06 : 41-41 (even)
06/07 : 34-34 (even)
07/08 : 37-39 (+2)
08/09 : 42-44 (+2)

So under Rafa it is 2-1 in favour of seasons with slightly more points in the second half of the season, although it is dead even 185-185 in terms of points overall

Overall in the Premiership it is even at 7-7 with three seasons split right down the middle. It was always likely to be an urban legend, those kind of claims are as common as the mancs won something with kids, big four sides get the decisions in their favour etc etc.

by **Owzat** » Sun Dec 06, 2009 9:08 am

After 15 games

08/09 P15 W10 D4 L1 F21 A8 PTS 34 (GD +13, CS 10)
09/10 P15 W7 D3 L5 F31 A20 PTS 20 (GD +11, CS 5)

Corresponding fixtures

08/09 P13 W9 D3 L1 F25 A7 PTS 30 (GD +18, CS 8)
09/10 P13 W6 D2 L5 F25 A18 PTS 20 (GD +7, CS 4)

We've got better results against Stoke and Hull at home, but four games we won last season we've lost this season - Chelsea, Sunderland and Fulham away, villa at home - and drew at Ewood Park where we won last season. While we talk of improving, having a better second half etc, we're not even beating the ordinary sides this season. Write off the Chelsea defeat as acceptable, but the results against Sunderland, Fulham, Blackburn and villa aren't acceptable as a combination even if you might accept one or two of them as standalone bad results ie if we'd lost to Fulham and Sunderland then maybe you call it a bad day at the office, lose all of them and it's more like hoping to cling onto your job

by **Ciggy** » Sun Dec 06, 2009 9:44 am

Whats worrying for me is we have feck all to play for in the league and the players are showing it, I dont think Rafa will be our manager next season and the players look as if they dont give a sh!t if we are in the top 4 or not.

by **JohnBull** » Sun Dec 06, 2009 10:32 am

I was watching Richie Partridge and Jack Hobbs on the telly this week. Alright - it wasn't the Prem League but the effort these two put in would have put most of our first team to shame.
You cannot help but think that we've lost the plot when we sell our up and comers and buy second raters to do their jobs.

by **maypaxvobiscum** » Sun Dec 06, 2009 2:01 pm

JohnBull wrote:I was watching Richie Partridge and Jack Hobbs on the telly this week. Alright - it wasn't the Prem League but the effort these two put in would have put most of our first team to shame.
You cannot help but think that we've lost the plot when we sell our up and comers and buy second raters to do their jobs.

Partridge, he had the potential, along the likes of Lee Jones and Phil Charnock etc. wonder what happened to them.

by **stmichael** » Mon Dec 07, 2009 12:03 pm

well the next 4 games are arsenal, wigan, pompey and wolves. should be 10 points minimum but hopefully 12 as arsenal have some key injuries at the moment.

by **Owzat** » Mon Dec 07, 2009 2:04 pm

stmichael wrote:well the next 4 games are arsenal, wigan, pompey and wolves. should be 10 points minimum but hopefully 12 as arsenal have some key injuries at the moment.

"should be" based on what? Recent form? Past form? We only have one 100% record in the Premiership, that is over WBA. That is because even sides like Wolves, Reading, Barnsley and Swindon who've spent few seasons in the top flight in that time have taken a point or more off us.

We've dropped 15 of our last 24 points, take nothing for granted

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