Liverpool FC Forum

by **Alex G.** » Sat Mar 07, 2009 12:31 am

The only thing I can blame to Rafa is the singings he has done (with Parry the clown) because with this squad is impossible to win the league.

EVEN YOUR BELOVED FERGUSON NEVER WOULD HAVE WON 11 CONSECUTIVES GAMES (AS HE HAS DONE AT UNITED this season) WITH THE PLAYERS THAT LIVERPOOL HAVE.

it´s a fact :;):

Just to set the record straight I voted for Rafa must go at the end of the season.

by **bigmick** » Sat Mar 07, 2009 12:37 am

Alex G. wrote:The only thing I can blame to Rafa is the singings he has done (with Parry the clown) because with this squad is impossible to win the league.

EVEN YOUR BELOVED FERGUSON NEVER WOULD HAVE WON 11 CONSECUTIVES GAMES (AS HE HAS DONE AT UNITED this season) WITH THE PLAYERS THAT LIVERPOOL HAVE.

it´s a fact

Even who's beloved ferguson? Catch a grip of yourself fella, you're on the wrong forum.

Maybe he would have won 11 on the bounce with this team, maybe he wouldn't. What's your point though? Rafa's had five years to build the team, if it isn't good enough who's fault is it? Mine?

by **Alex G.** » Sat Mar 07, 2009 12:43 am

bigmick wrote:
Alex G. wrote:The only thing I can blame to Rafa is the singings he has done (with Parry the clown) because with this squad is impossible to win the league.

EVEN YOUR BELOVED FERGUSON NEVER WOULD HAVE WON 11 CONSECUTIVES GAMES (AS HE HAS DONE AT UNITED this season) WITH THE PLAYERS THAT LIVERPOOL HAVE.

it´s a fact

Even who's beloved ferguson? Catch a grip of yourself fella, you're on the wrong forum.

Maybe he would have won 11 on the bounce with this team, maybe he wouldn't. What's your point though? Rafa's had five years to build the team, if it isn't good enough who's fault is it? Mine?

Ok Mick

I Know here many people overrate Ferguson. They say things like:

"With Ferguson we would have won this game", "he Knows how to treat the players", "he Knows how to motivate the young players" ect...

Of course is the Rafa´s fault, as I said in the singings matters, but not in the tactics, rotations and other questions, because with this players is impossible to win the league.

This squad is not good enough to assault the title. Nobody would do it, not Ferguson, not Mourinho, not O´Neill, nobody. Just my opinion.

by **Sabre** » Sat Mar 07, 2009 1:17 am

Bigmick wrote:
As far as the current manager is concerned, in my eyes he's blown it. He's just had the best chance any Liverpool manager in years has had to win the title, mostly through a situation which was niothing to do with him. Even in those circumstances, he made a complete nonsense of it so I have zero faith he'll do it off a level playing field.

We agree to disagree and that's fair enough. I also understand the "I've read enough" bit, because I feel a bit the same way after so much Rafa discussion. It's tiring, I have to admit. :laugh:

I could even agree Mick that he has made this season more mistakes than ever (Keane, for instance), and that perhaps he has failed to take advantage of the best chance any Liverpool manager had to win the league.

The core of our disagreement is that I don't think Rafa having the best chance to win the league is merely casual or luck, but the consequence of a progress. 2 years more, and without Parry in the equation will show whether having this chance was a matter of luck, or a matter of progress. Because I think we'll be close to win it if we're not winners in the following two years, if Rafa stays.

by **Reg** » Sat Mar 07, 2009 1:24 am

devaney wrote:
Effes wrote:I for one don't just blame Parry for that outlandish fkn debacle!

Personally I have had enough and if he fkcued off to Madrid tomorrow i wouldn't be that bothered!

Per se, Rafa walking out of the door wouldnt be a big issue but the time and other issues associated with the disruption caused and the cost of bringing in a new manager, backroom and prefered players runs like ice through my veins.

by **Effes** » Sat Mar 07, 2009 10:34 am

devaney wrote:
Effes wrote:My opinion is that Rafa will never win the Prem with us.

Let's forget about the owners for the sake of this debate. Rafa has spent as much as anybody except Chelsea over the last four to five years. £200m over ffs !!!!!!!! Ok he has recouped about £100m from selling players including some of the pityful shi..te that he has bought. Rafa is paid a small fortune to field the flack and he has failed miserably. Never has Liverpool's dirty washing been publicised so much. Look at the mess he got in with Gerrard's contract after we won the CL. I for one don't just blame Parry for that outlandish fkn debacle!

Personally I have had enough and if he fecked off to Madrid tomorrow i wouldn't be that bothered!

A better representation Reg.

by **GYBS** » Sat Mar 07, 2009 10:54 am

The thing i find quite strange is that at the moment people seemed to have more respect and praise for another teams manager as opposed to our own - what will people do next season when we still have rafa ? will they spend the season critizing him and praising others or will they support him and give him their backing ?

by **bigmick** » Sat Mar 07, 2009 11:32 am

GYBS wrote:The thing i find quite strange is that at the moment people seemed to have more respect and praise for another teams manager as opposed to our own - what will people do next season when we still have rafa ? will they spend the season critizing him and praising others or will they support him and give him their backing ?

What are you on about now mate. If you're referring to the discussion on Jose Mourinho, in the Jose Mourinho thread, in Premiership General discussion, what is the problem with that? If people keep starting threads asking "who would you want to replace Rafa" what do you expect posters to do? Do you expect them to say 'well I've got someone in mind but i'm not going to talk about him"?

As for how much "respect and praise" people have for any manager, surely that's a matter for them. Equally, if Rafa is going to conduct himself in the frankly ridiculous way he has this season, then he won't be getting my "support and backing" next season either no. When a manager chooses to sell your striker back up in December and not bring in a replacement, in so doing finally killing once and for all your best chance of winning the title in years, you don't back him.

Remember, some of us said it was absolutely fecking ridiculous long before he did it. Yes we got shouted down on occasions, but we knew it then and now everyone knows it. I don't support and back stupid, mind numbingly fecking daft actions by the manager. I support Liverpool Football Club not Rafa Benitez FC, and if he behaves like a chump he and you can hardly expect people like me to agree with him.

by **GYBS** » Sat Mar 07, 2009 11:38 am

Where did i say that everything Rafa does should be agreed with ? no manager does everything one hundred per cent correct - Im tlking about supporting our own manager not some bloody other manager who has feck all to do with the club - the praise coming out for the guy is unreal and in polar opposite to the sh it that rafa gets . I remembered for years no matter what our manager was doing he was supported by people but i guess that is the age of the internet forum where it because nice and easy to see the other side and think the grass will always be greener .

by **loopyliverpool** » Sat Mar 07, 2009 11:40 am

Progress might have come if the squad contained genuine right and left backs of decent quality, a genuine right sided mid fielder and cover for Torres. The facts are he has gotten rid of Finnan, Riise, and previously Warnock who have either not been replaced or those that have come in are sub standard. He has flogged Pennant when we have no cover in that position at all, Keane went back to Spurs etc.. For me progress can only be attained if you have a squad of players that at least contain a starting eleven that can play in all the respective positions... and a certain amount of cover... we can't. Rafa asked for five years and has had them and our team is essentially deficient in some fundemantal ways. Even those who see the world through Rafa tinted glasses have to question his philosophy on how success is to arrive!

by **bigmick** » Sat Mar 07, 2009 11:54 am

GYBS wrote:Where did i say that everything Rafa does should be agreed with ? no manager does everything one hundred per cent correct - Im tlking about supporting our own manager not some bloody other manager who has feck all to do with the club - the praise coming out for the guy is unreal and in polar opposite to the sh it that rafa gets . I remembered for years no matter what our manager was doing he was supported by people but i guess that is the age of the internet forum where it because nice and easy to see the other side and think the grass will always be greener .

Why are you getting so worked up about it? The manager you are talking about, the one about whom you were the prime instigator of the discussion about, manages a team in Italy so why are you getting all insecure about him? He has absolutely nothing to do with our club, and he's very likely never going to manage us so why are you so bothered?

I would have thought all Liverpool fans would be hoping Mourinho can put one over on the Mancs this week GYBS, hence the discussion about him had picked up pace. Most fans of ours I would have thought will be hoping Mourinho can maintain his fantastic record against man Utd. He's only ever lost once in 13 matches against them, for 3 different clubs. Most Liverpool fans will be cheering on the black and blues.

My suspicion is though mate that you'll be a Man Utd fan for the night :no

Such is your insecurity about anybody daring to praise up Mourinho, that my suspicion most definately is that you'd rather he lose against them than win. I also think that explains your obsessional dislike of the man. It's quite simply borne out of fear that his record overshadows Rafa's.

It's a very strange attitude to have over a manager who doesn't even run a team in the Premiership.

Anyway, I hope Inter beat Man Utd. I know which side of the bread my Lurpacks on, even if you don't.

by **kazza** » Sat Mar 07, 2009 12:10 pm

bigmick wrote:Remember, some of us said it was absolutely fecking ridiculous long before he did it. Yes we got shouted down on occasions, but we knew it then and now everyone knows it. I don't support and back stupid, mind numbingly fecking daft actions by the manager. I support Liverpool Football Club not Rafa Benitez FC, and if he behaves like a chump he and you can hardly expect people like me to agree with him.

When you have a negative outlook about a certain subject surely you will be right about half of the time (law of averages and all). Do you keep reminding us of when you were wrong with the same vigor? If I want to read the "negative" side of the argument, your posts are the ones to read. Trouble is I know what your outlook is before I even read the post which is making you pridictable, something a clever fellow such as yourself should never be. Don't lose the balance Mick.

by **bigmick** » Sat Mar 07, 2009 8:12 pm

Ah Kazza, the balance :laugh:

We mustn't be predictable you're quite right fella.

by **Effes** » Sat Mar 07, 2009 8:36 pm

Effes wrote:So here is our league history:

Season Posn. Pts Pts behind winners/leaders
2008/9 2nd -- 7
2007/8 4th 76 11
2006/7 3rd 68 21
2005/6 3rd 82 9
2004/5 5th 58 37
Houllier -
2003/4 4th 60 30
2002/3 5th 64 19
2001/2 2nd 80 7
2000/1 3rd 60 11

Just a question to throw in the ring:

Anyone got any views about where an "imaginery line" is that would say we have/have not progressed as far as the
League position and points behind the winners goes?

For me - any worse than 3rd and 11 points could be seen as halting any such "progression".

by **bigmick** » Sat Mar 07, 2009 9:08 pm

Effes wrote:
Effes wrote:So here is our league history:

Season Posn. Pts Pts behind winners/leaders
2008/9 2nd -- 7
2007/8 4th 76 11
2006/7 3rd 68 21
2005/6 3rd 82 9
2004/5 5th 58 37
Houllier -
2003/4 4th 60 30
2002/3 5th 64 19
2001/2 2nd 80 7
2000/1 3rd 60 11

Just a question to throw in the ring:

Anyone got any views about where an "imaginery line" is that would say we have/have not progressed as far as the
League position and points behind the winners goes?

For me - any worse than 3rd and 11 points could be seen as halting any such "progression".

I know you've asked this one beofre Eff but i actually don't think it's fair to judge that way (as i've said before as well

). We could be eight points behind with one game to play and win our last game, while Mancs play the Youth team and lose. Suddenly, we're five back and it's a good season.

Equally, we could play our Youth team as we've got a Champions League final to worry about, and suddenly we're 11 back and there's been no progression.

We have "progressed" in the league this season, I don't personally think there's any doubt about that. We gave non- rotation a try for a start, and hopefully we might revisit that idea at some point. We gave buying a left midfielder to play left midfield a bash, and even that seemed to come off. Bloke with left foot, plays in midfield, lets play him left midfield :idea

. So we are learning I think.

Five years on though, and for me it isn't enough. Each person though will no doubt have an idea of their own line in the sand, if they haven't already made their minds up about the manager one way or another. My line has already been washed away by the tide of silliness I'm afraid.

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