Liverpool FC Forum

Espionage wrote:Successful clubs stick with one manager in England.  I really see no reason to swap and change, Rafa is obviously a classy guy and would be snapped up by any other club. 

Its much easier to have a manager that makes the same sorts of decisions that you think you would make.  Then when things go pear-shaped it must be the fault of the players, not the managers.  But if you dont understand his decisions it must be his fault

IMO managers are there for 2 things:

(1)building a team
Rafa has been A (maybe not A+) in the transfer market, bringing in some real quality (Torres, Masch, Agger, Reina, Alonso, Crouch) with most of them young and buying heaps of players for our long term future in the reserves.

(2) employing good tactics and improving players
Tactically he is reveared as a genius by the football world (his record speaks for it self) and likewise by his players and people around the club.  Torres time and time again gives credit to Rafa for improving him as a player, and preparing him with technical info on each team's defense.  And he is not the only player to credit Rafa with helping him improve in leaps and bounds.

These are the things that Rafa CAN change, and what he should be judged on.  IMO he has done more then good enough in my eyes for him to warrant long term confidence.  I believe that poor performance by the team is not just the manager's fault.  The weakest area of our team is some of the players we have wouldnt make it into the starting 11 at Chelsea or Man U and not our manager.  As far as I am concerned that is our problem.


*I am not going to get dragged into a rotation arguement as its been done to death.  But yeah, I am fine with Rafa's rotation policy.  IMO he rotates when its broken, and he generally doesnt try to fix it when its not.

Espionage wrote:Successful clubs stick with one manager in England.  I really see no reason to swap and change, Rafa is obviously a classy guy and would be snapped up by any other club. 

Its much easier to have a manager that makes the same sorts of decisions that you think you would make.  Then when things go pear-shaped it must be the fault of the players, not the managers.  But if you dont understand his decisions it must be his fault

IMO managers are there for 2 things:

(1)building a team
Rafa has been A (maybe not A+) in the transfer market, bringing in some real quality (Torres, Masch, Agger, Reina, Alonso, Crouch) with most of them young and buying heaps of players for our long term future in the reserves.

(2) employing good tactics and improving players
Tactically he is reveared as a genius by the football world (his record speaks for it self) and likewise by his players and people around the club.  Torres time and time again gives credit to Rafa for improving him as a player, and preparing him with technical info on each team's defense.  And he is not the only player to credit Rafa with helping him improve in leaps and bounds.

These are the things that Rafa CAN change, and what he should be judged on.  IMO he has done more then good enough in my eyes for him to warrant long term confidence.  I believe that poor performance by the team is not just the manager's fault.  The weakest area of our team is some of the players we have wouldnt make it into the starting 11 at Chelsea or Man U and not our manager.  As far as I am concerned that is our problem.


*I am not going to get dragged into a rotation arguement as its been done to death.  But yeah, I am fine with Rafa's rotation policy.  IMO he rotates when its broken, and he generally doesnt try to fix it when its not.

Espionage wrote:Successful clubs stick with one manager in England.  I really see no reason to swap and change, Rafa is obviously a classy guy and would be snapped up by any other club. 

Its much easier to have a manager that makes the same sorts of decisions that you think you would make.  Then when things go pear-shaped it must be the fault of the players, not the managers.  But if you dont understand his decisions it must be his fault

IMO managers are there for 2 things:

(1)building a team
Rafa has been A (maybe not A+) in the transfer market, bringing in some real quality (Torres, Masch, Agger, Reina, Alonso, Crouch) with most of them young and buying heaps of players for our long term future in the reserves.

(2) employing good tactics and improving players
Tactically he is reveared as a genius by the football world (his record speaks for it self) and likewise by his players and people around the club.  Torres time and time again gives credit to Rafa for improving him as a player, and preparing him with technical info on each team's defense.  And he is not the only player to credit Rafa with helping him improve in leaps and bounds.

These are the things that Rafa CAN change, and what he should be judged on.  IMO he has done more then good enough in my eyes for him to warrant long term confidence.  I believe that poor performance by the team is not just the manager's fault.  The weakest area of our team is some of the players we have wouldnt make it into the starting 11 at Chelsea or Man U and not our manager.  As far as I am concerned that is our problem.


*I am not going to get dragged into a rotation arguement as its been done to death.  But yeah, I am fine with Rafa's rotation policy.  IMO he rotates when its broken, and he generally doesnt try to fix it when its not.

faldo wrote:can somebody tell me what identifies a rafa team.every manager has signature to each team they create.

we have seen what wengers signature is after he has rebuilt arsenal teams ,the same for fergie.

s@int wrote:Far too many comings and goings which not only unsettles the team, but must make it much more difficult to bond them together and get a good fighting teamspirit going.

s@int wrote:

faldo wrote:can somebody tell me what identifies a rafa team.every manager has signature to each team they create.

we have seen what wengers signature is after he has rebuilt arsenal teams ,the same for fergie.

Very strong defensive unit, very athletic hardworking team with great strength through the spine.

faldo wrote:

s@int wrote:Far too many comings and goings which not only unsettles the team, but must make it much more difficult to bond them together and get a good fighting teamspirit going.

i get the impression rafa dare not bring in top top quality players,because if it goes wrong then everybody is in no doubt who is to blame.but if you bring in a lower class players, the fans will want them gone rather than the manager.....houliers trick.

i also don't like the goalkeeper shuffle every season.each season a new one comes to liverpool,chuck one in and cost us an important match and then leaves or never play again....very curious.

I just think he has been trying to do too many things at once, maybe due to the pressure of knowing he can't afford to have a really bad season as without the CL MONEY we are fk'd. Spread the money just a little too thinly through trying to strengthen 3 or 4 positions at once, and then unfortunately the next season you need to strengthen the same positions again.

I think maybe now that he has seen how big a difference top quality players like Masch and Torres can make we may see a few more quality players brought in and a few less average squad players. At least I hope so. 

He does seem to have a bit of a fetish for goalkeepers and midfielders 

faldo wrote:

s@int wrote:

faldo wrote:can somebody tell me what identifies a rafa team.every manager has signature to each team they create.

we have seen what wengers signature is after he has rebuilt arsenal teams ,the same for fergie.

Very strong defensive unit, very athletic hardworking team with great strength through the spine.

ok so thats rafa's signature.

the next question on my mind is if he is the very best at building a defensive team . to win the league with all the above against teams with super flair like manu and arsenal is hard.is rafa's strong athletic teams superior to wenger and fergies flair....have we even come close to being superior to them with rafa's signature......winning the league is all about superiority.

I think we just need a creative second striker and maybe a top quality winger and we will blow Arsenal and Chelsea away, the mancs may take a little more huffing and puffing first.

They are like the 3 little pigs. Arsenal live in a house made of straw, Chelsea in a house made of wood (polished oak though)and the mancs in a house made of bricks.

Penguins wrote:

bigmick wrote:I got as far as the bit where you said you can't just concentrate on the first team and have rubbish as back up 'not if you want to challenge'. Well we haven't challenged. Ever. Even a little bit. So it is therefore reasonable to assume that if our goal was all along to at some point to mount a challenge, that we have failed so to do. If on the other hand our transfer and team selection policy was set out without the ultimate objective that at some point we would try and win the league, then it has broadly done what it says on the tin.

For my part, call me a wild optimist/a bullsh!tter/a cocktail barman/a wool or whatever else, I'd quite like to see us have a go sometime. Soon would be good.

I am concerned mostly about both the prestent and the long term future of the club. Unless you and me go to the states and force the yanks to actually spend money of their own on 3-4 15 million players, so we can get to where our rivals are, the quick fix just is not going to work.
And playing 11 players 10 months in 60+ games, no injuries touch wood, will just kill the team in February.
And no, skipping all other competitions is not an option since we need them at least financially and winning the CL improves our rep in europe.
I don't want to stand there in February with a league lead and then have 3-4 players injured and the rest fatigued and see our season fall to pieces when the reserve team players try to do the business.