Liverpool FC Forum

by **Toffeehater** » Mon Apr 28, 2008 6:58 pm

Crouch hails 'fantastic' Pennant
Liverpool's Peter Crouch has paid tribute to team-mate Jermaine Pennant after his weekend display.

The former Birmingham City winger played a crucial role for Liverpool in Saturday's match against his old club.

The 25-year-old created both goals as the Reds came back from 2-0 down to draw 2-2 at St Andrews.

And Crouch, who netted his 11th goal of the season after a great run from Pennant, revealed he loves playing alongside the former Arsenal player when he is in such devastating form.
Crouch told the club's website: "Jermaine Pennant was excellent, absolutely fantastic. Every time he got the ball he created something.

"It makes a centre forward's job much easier when the likes of Jermaine is playing so well because you know he his going to get at the full back and invariably get his cross in.

"That's what I love. It's great when wingers do that."

by **ivor_the_injun** » Mon Apr 28, 2008 7:04 pm

It's certainly made Wednesday's selection interesting. Kuyt can't be dropped on current form, but it would be good to see Pennant on the right up against Cole.

Maybe there's something to be said for them alternating between wings. Cole and Ferreira look there for the taking, and if nothing else a 30 minute cameo from Pennant up against Cashley could really bear fruit for us.

by **LFC2007** » Mon Apr 28, 2008 11:25 pm

Bad Bob wrote:
stmichael wrote:
Redman in wales wrote:I wouldn't replace kuyt at the moment. One of the stand-out players from last Tuesday, who's tackling and harrying initially set up the goal that he scored.

I would however like to see kuyt on the left, pennant on the right, which chelsea would not expect and it would give them something else to think about. Pennants got the better of cole a few times, and would relish the chance to do it again. - If he's not up to it, then bring on babel.

Also I feel that the start of the game might not be suited for babel anyway. They are gonna play very tight at the back, not much space for him to use his pace, and he loses posession a lot more. I think babel is much better as a 60minutes sub, so I'd like to see pennant on the right for the chelsea game, with kuyt moving over to the left.

It has to be said that Pennant has run rings round Ashley Cole twice in the last year or so. He always gives him problems, even more so than Ronaldo when he plays against him. The problem is though, as you have said, Dirk is playing so well in that role I'd be reluctant to change it.

As for the option of playing either Dirk or Pennant on the left, I'd be tempted to do as I'd like Babel on the bench in case we need him as an impact player like he was against Arsenal at home.

At the end of the day, it comes down to the question of who is more likely to go missing at the Bridge--Pennant or Babel? IMO, it's Babel and that's why I'd have him start on the bench. As you say, we can bring him on late to give Chelsea something new to think about but I worry that, if he starts, he'll be marked out of the match pretty quickly and his head will drop. Pennant, for all of his faults, has had big games against Chelsea (and Cole in particular). The big question he raises is his defending. He tends to give away free kicks very cheaply in dangerous areas and that's not something we need with the quality Chelsea has on set pieces.

Excusez-moi

, Je ne comprends pas.

Cole plays on the left, as does Babel, they wouldn't be facing each other, and nor would Pennant if he took Babel's position.

Also, left wing isn't Pennant's natural position - which I thought you advocated as a reason to play him on the right against Chelsea, with Kuyt possibly on the left?

FWIW, I don't know who I'd go with on the wings this time, I can't make my mind up, and that's why I'm not a manager

by **Bad Bob** » Tue Apr 29, 2008 2:36 am

LFC2007 wrote:
Bad Bob wrote:At the end of the day, it comes down to the question of who is more likely to go missing at the Bridge--Pennant or Babel? IMO, it's Babel and that's why I'd have him start on the bench. As you say, we can bring him on late to give Chelsea something new to think about but I worry that, if he starts, he'll be marked out of the match pretty quickly and his head will drop. Pennant, for all of his faults, has had big games against Chelsea (and Cole in particular). The big question he raises is his defending. He tends to give away free kicks very cheaply in dangerous areas and that's not something we need with the quality Chelsea has on set pieces.

Excusez-moi , Je ne comprends pas.

Cole plays on the left, as does Babel, they wouldn't be facing each other, and nor would Pennant if he took Babel's position.

Also, left wing isn't Pennant's natural position - which I thought you advocated as a reason to play him on the right against Chelsea, with Kuyt possibly on the left?

FWIW, I don't know who I'd go with on the wings this time, I can't make my mind up, and that's why I'm not a manager

Yeah, mate, I left the highlighted part of the discussion out of this post to avoid repetition but I guess I've made things more confusing. What I'm saying is that Kuyt must play against Chelsea. That leaves the debate over whether to play Pennant or Babel (arguably you could throw Crouch into the mix, too, but let's leave him aside for this discussion). If Babel plays, our front four should line up like usual:
Torres

Babel Gerrard Kuyt

If, however, we were to play Pennant rather than Babel, I think we should line up like this:
Torres

Kuyt Gerrard Pennant

Whether we'd gain that much from playing Pennant instead of Babel, I'm not sure. Pennant has played well against Cole and Chelsea in the past, which--when added to his recent form--is a mark in his favour. But, playing him would mean switching Dirk over to the other side and potentially unsettling him. Given that we're currently getting optimal use out of the Dutchman, that might not be the wisest course. So, having put all this out there I'll happily leave the Pennant vs. Babel decision to Rafa and just enjoy the match, whoever he selects.

by **LFC2007** » Tue Apr 29, 2008 3:14 am

I assumed (I shouldn't have, but I'm unsecure you see

) you meant Babel and Pennant competing with each other for the same position.

Merci pour la clarification. :pirate

by **SundanceKid** » Tue Apr 29, 2008 3:32 am

Pennant needs to play RW so that he can both tire the side of the defense who should be containing Torres [That is if we play with 2 strikers] and make wonderful long passes to Torres who can just about control whatever is given to him.

Edit: It doesn't seem too unfamiliar, as I think every club might have the same percentage, but I just spent the last 2 hours checking the ratio of goals that were developed by being played in the air some way or another. I kind of slacked off every once in a while so this is just a very close estimate. But out of the total 37 goals Chelsea have conceded in all competitions, a little over 23 of them were scored with a ball that was at one point airborne prior to the finishing. And all I can remember is Couch's easy header in the charity shield last year. I watched some videos and a lot of them were on John Terry. Could this be the easiest way to beat the Chelsea defense?

by **ruskiy playmaker** » Tue Apr 29, 2008 4:07 am

If Pennant can put in the same amount of effort into every game as he did against Birmingham, then we don't need to get a wide player in the summer.

by **Toffeehater** » Tue Apr 29, 2008 4:49 am

I think pennant will be picked in place of babel

by **SundanceKid** » Tue Apr 29, 2008 4:59 am

Toffeehater wrote:I think pennant will be picked in place of babel

I really don't know who's the better choice. Pennant definitely plays wing way better than Babel. But when there's an open path into the 18 yard box, Babel is much better at taking it. The best thing to do is to see all the goals scored on Chelsea at Stamford, and see how they were developed. If most were by air, start Pennant. If more came from the far left side of the penalty area, start Babel.

by **RedBlood** » Tue Apr 29, 2008 8:10 am

personally i rate pennant always have and if he can add 10goals a season to his game then he would do for me, but at worst hes a very good squad player as are benyoun and crouch

i would start him on wed along with babel, let alonso mascherano and gerrard win the midfield battle and let babel n pennant run at their defence and if we still need a goal with 30mins to go id throw crouchie on

by **Owzat** » Tue Apr 29, 2008 9:34 am

RedBlood wrote:personally i rate pennant always have and if he can add 10goals a season to his game then he would do for me, but at best worst hes a [/s]very[/s] good squad player as are benyoun and crouch

i would start him on wed along with babel, let alonso mascherano and gerrard win the midfield battle and let babel n pennant run at their defence and if we still need a goal with 30mins to go id throw crouchie on

Why do so many people have to go OTT with their bias? You rate him, we get it, but then show your bias by suggesting at WORST he is a 'very good squad player'. At worst he is an inconsistent player who can't hack it, in your dreams/at best he is a 'very good squad player'.

I'll repeat for the zillionth time in not many weeks, why do people keep wanting to disrupt a winning formula? Especially based on performances against FULHAM and BRUM.

EDIT : by the way, he doesn't even need to be scoring 10 a season, 5 or 6 would be a start and show he is a goal threat. Having little or no goal threat from the wingers isn't good enough, yet you want to include him when we need to score goals?!?!?

Potential wide players

Benayoun - 11 goals in 44 appearances
Kuyt - 11 goals in 45 appearances
Babel - 9 goals in 46 appearances
Pennant - 2 goals in 24 appearances
Kewell - 0 goals in 15 appearances

To put Gerrard wide would be a waste, he's at least twice the goalscoring threat that Crouch is

by **Bad Bob** » Tue Apr 29, 2008 12:22 pm

Owzat wrote:I'll repeat for the zillionth time in not many weeks, why do people keep wanting to disrupt a winning formula? Especially based on performances against FULHAM and BRUM.

Could ask you the same question, really. Carragher and Skrtel handled Drogba nicely and Arberloa was decent at RB last week yet you want Carragher at RB and Arbeloa at LB tomorrow. Why are you so hell-bent on disrupting a winning formula?

by **JC_81** » Tue Apr 29, 2008 12:30 pm

Can't believe some people want Pennant picked ahead of Babel or Kuyt for this game, it's crazy. Kuyt has performed really well in the CL, whatever else you may think about him. And we will be put under serious pressure against Chelsea away at times, and for that Babel is one of our best out-balls.

by **god_bless_john_houlding** » Tue Apr 29, 2008 1:22 pm

Owzat wrote:To put Gerrard wide would be a waste, he's at least twice the goalscoring threat that Crouch is

we get it you don't rate Crouch. Why go OTT on your bias?

lets play you at your game shall we? lets used stats based on starts...Gerrard 44 starts, 21 goals works out at a goal every 2.09 game. Crouch 21 starts 11 goals works out a goal every 1.90 game. So obviously if Crouch starts he offers more of a goal threat.

by **Number 9** » Tue Apr 29, 2008 1:36 pm

god_bless_john_houlding wrote:
Owzat wrote:To put Gerrard wide would be a waste, he's at least twice the goalscoring threat that Crouch is

we get it you don't rate Crouch. Why go OTT on your bias?

lets play you at your game shall we? lets used stats based on starts...Gerrard 44 starts, 21 goals works out at a goal every 2.09 game. Crouch 21 starts 11 goals works out a goal every 1.90 game. So obviously if Crouch starts he offers more of a goal threat.

If you think Crouch should start,who would you sacrifice out of the 5 midfielders Rafa usually starts?ie Babel on the left,Alonso and Mascherano in the middle,Kuyt on the right and Gerrard in his advanced role in the centre?

I pressume you are not so daft that you want Torres on the bench so id say you are talking of playing a 4-4-2 with Cruch alongside Torres.

And another thing how can you not see that since we have adopted the 4-2-3-1 it is the most balanced our team has been since Rafa took control.You may of course argue that but the results are power enough to counter any such debate.

So tell me where,when and how should Crouch play?
Or should be revert back to the 4-4-2 out of sentiment and pity or just for the reason you like Crouch?
For the record i rate Crouch quite highly,but Rafa has found a system that works and unfortunately for the big lad he is a casualty of its success.

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