Liverpool FC Forum

[SundanceKid]

Babel is a good ‘out’ – but I thick pennant can also provide that outlet – okay he is not as fast, but he does keep possession a lot better than babel.

In these types of games though (Inter Milan both legs, Arsenal away, Chelsea home, Man U away, Blackburn first half) he hasn't proved to be a good 'out'. He's struggled in tight spaces, and can be pressured out of possession too easily. He's proven to be effective ad a good 'out' when he has space to run into - and against tired legs/minds/defenders who don't mark tight enough e.g. Arsenal home late on, Bolton away, Newcastle away.

This is my concern, but do we upset the 'cohesion' and 'fluency' this formation, and the personnel within this formation has (apparently) brought us?

I agree that Babel struggles under pressure more than pennant... only when there's space does babel become dangerous.


another thing to note 6 out babels 9 goals have come from him coming on as a sub, his only goals from starts were against Bolton, Luton and Derby. - I think Babel is much more effective as a sub. - and personally I would be willing to risk the cohesion, as I believe it would be for the good of the team.

Babel struggles under pressure? I understand he might've crumbled once or twice. But don't you remember that final goal on Arsenal? I didn't even expect the ball to shoot out until a few steps after.

Did you also forget the way he sifted through Inter?

[Boocity]

Watching the match last night and seeing Messi that guy is just pure class, I would love to see him playing on the right for us, best player in the world.

Maybe barca would take Pennant in straight swap deal   :

[Redman in wales]

Babel is a good ‘out’ – but I thick pennant can also provide that outlet – okay he is not as fast, but he does keep possession a lot better than babel.

In these types of games though (Inter Milan both legs, Arsenal away, Chelsea home, Man U away, Blackburn first half) he hasn't proved to be a good 'out'. He's struggled in tight spaces, and can be pressured out of possession too easily. He's proven to be effective ad a good 'out' when he has space to run into - and against tired legs/minds/defenders who don't mark tight enough e.g. Arsenal home late on, Bolton away, Newcastle away.

This is my concern, but do we upset the 'cohesion' and 'fluency' this formation, and the personnel within this formation has (apparently) brought us?

I agree that Babel struggles under pressure more than pennant... only when there's space does babel become dangerous.


another thing to note 6 out babels 9 goals have come from him coming on as a sub, his only goals from starts were against Bolton, Luton and Derby. - I think Babel is much more effective as a sub. - and personally I would be willing to risk the cohesion, as I believe it would be for the good of the team.

Babel struggles under pressure? I understand he might've crumbled once or twice. But don't you remember that final goal on Arsenal? I didn't even expect the ball to shoot out until a few steps after.

Did you also forget the way he sifted through Inter?

not that kind of pressure mate. I meant being presureised. when there's no space to run, he stuggles when he is being put under presure by defenders and midfielders - not all the time, but more often then not.  - his goal against arsenal came about because of all the space he had to run into. - not that i want to take anything away from him, he showed great strength, awareness and calmness to score what was a great goal... but I fear against the chelsea defence, he won't be afforded that kind of space.

[RedBlood]

i watched the first leg again last might from start to finnish and there was a spell when babel ran chelsea ragged in the second half, when he has space and time to go at defenders hes very dangerous BUT he does go missing when the game is tight BUT hopefully with experience (the lad is only 21 and in his debut season) he will develope his game

[Owzat]

Maybe that's what Rafa's gone for Yossi tonight, he is more senior than Pennant and Babel. Average age is 26 by my reckoning, but according to that bolton muppet that means we're fielding kids again!

[Owzat]

This will cheer stu up!

Stoke are lining up a £3m bid for Liverpool's 25-year-old winger Jermaine Pennant. (Various)

What did they offer last time? I can only assume this is less money so they can increase the wage offer. Says it all if Stoke are the only side coming in for him, I thought their tactic was long throws not crosses. Pennant is the complete package, can't cross, can't shoot, can't dribble............................ (jk for anyone stupid enough not to get it)

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1....883.stm

[Number 9]

This will cheer stu up!

Stoke are lining up a £3m bid for Liverpool's 25-year-old winger Jermaine Pennant. (Various)

What did they offer last time? I can only assume this is less money so they can increase the wage offer. Says it all if Stoke are the only side coming in for him, I thought their tactic was long throws not crosses. Pennant is the complete package, can't cross, can't shoot, can't dribble............................ (jk for anyone stupid enough not to get it)

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1....883.stm

 

[GYBS]

does say it all about pennant

[Ben1988]

I think someone should start a hate campaign on here against pennat... he is pants after all.

My only reason to do this is to see thye reaction of Fo Dne who seems to rate him much higher than kuyt and wont listen to anyones opnions without throwing his toys out of the pram.

[Ben1988]

That was a joke by the way Fo Dne, or Stu is it?

im only pulling your leg. We all have strong opinions bcos we are all passionate and all care, which in the long run is brilliant for the club.

[Owzat]

I think someone should start a hate campaign on here against pennat... he is pants after all.

Rafa already has! 

Signed in July 2006, he has made 79 appearances out of a possible 128

Jermaine Pennant (Liverpool, All Competitions)

2006/7 : 52 apps, 1 goal (6 yellow cards, 0 red cards)
2007/8 : 25 apps, 2 goals (3 yellow cards, 1 red card)
2008/9 : 2 apps, 0 goals (no cards yet)

Three goals in two seasons, perhaps whoever said Kuyt scores 1 in 15 was confusing Pennant with Kuyt - and being generous at that! I wish I had a ready source for assists, not that I suspect Pennant would fare much better on that score either - he certainly didn't when I checked it out on FPL for 2007/8

Anyway, the primary role of those stats is to show his fall from favour. He appeared in 89.66% of games in 2006/7, 42.37% in 2007/8 and only 18.18% so far in 2008/9.


This could work, just found the archive on FPL for assists etc (not that I'd really looked previously)

Premiership Assists (source : FPL)

Jermaine Pennant

2008/9 : 0 assists, 1 appearance
2007/8 : 3 assists, 18 appearances
2006/7 : 6 assists, 34 appearances

Dirk Kuyt

2008/9 : 1 assist, 6 appearances
2007/8 : 6* assists, 32 appearances
2006/7 : 4 assists, 34 appearances

* according to the FPL Actim stats archive, Kuyt had six Premiership assists, but according to their stats within FPL itself he had eight.

More goals and assists combined from Kuyt, Pennant isn't much of a goalscorer and his assists rate is poor for someone who doesn't do much else for the team. According to FPL, Kuyt is now considered a midfielder!! It's a no brainer on current options, I'll throw in Babel and Benayoun as well since some feel they'll fare better than Kuyt (well Babel anyway)

Ryan Babel

2008/9 : 0 assists, 3 appearances
2007/8 : 3 assists, 30 appearances

Yossi Benayoun

2008/9 :  0 assists,  5 appearances
2007/8 : 1 assist, 30 appearances

In fairness they are quite often subs appearances, but not great taking that into account either. Four assists in 68 appearances between them, 1 in 17. I think it is unfortunate for Benayoun, his best role (for me) is behind the strikers or playing as a second striker and he's getting used as a fill-in-where-needed player. Can't be too many Liverpool players in the current squad with TWO hat-tricks overall let alone in one season who can't secure a regular starting place

Liverpool Current Squad Hat-Tricks

23/02/08 Torres vs West Ham
05/03/08 Torres vs Middlesboro
26/01/08 Benayoun vs Havant & W
15/01/08 Gerrard vs Luton Town
06/11/08 Benayoun vs Besiktas
25/09/07 Torres vs Reading
13/07/05 Gerrard vs TNS

Only two others have scored a hat-trick under Rafa

31/03/07 Crouch vs Arsenal
13/11/04 Baros vs C Palace

And before that is was the Fowler and Owen show, bar one from Heskey vs Derby County, since Patrik Berger scored one in October 97

http://www.lfchistory.net/stats_hattricks.asp

[Feeney]

This cu'nt simply has to go.




£50k a week on this gobsh!te

I'd sack the w@nker - we surely have grounds to do so, I don't care if we lose half a mil or whatever, bury the cu'nts career. I know more that he has done but can't say as could get mates in the sh!t but, put it this way, he doesn't give a flying fu€k about our club and might as well spit in the eye of those that give him a chance.

And people moan about Babel, all that guy has done has said he wants to play football and he's geting creamed by some on here!!

[Owzat]

I'm sure the club could find enough dirt to have grounds for dismissal. Breaching club policies on drinking, curfews etc must be a good area of hope.

But that would simply do us out of a transfer fee, our best hope of cutting losses. Unless we can Mutu him and claim he cost us money. Quick, someone get him hooked on drugs................. (if he isn't already)

[Number 9]

I'm sure the club could find enough dirt to have grounds for dismissal. Breaching club policies on drinking, curfews etc must be a good area of hope.

But that would simply do us out of a transfer fee, our best hope of cutting losses. Unless we can Mutu him and claim he cost us money. Quick, someone get him hooked on drugs................. (if he isn't already)

Owzat is pennant your knew crouch??

[Owzat]

I'm sure the club could find enough dirt to have grounds for dismissal. Breaching club policies on drinking, curfews etc must be a good area of hope.

But that would simply do us out of a transfer fee, our best hope of cutting losses. Unless we can Mutu him and claim he cost us money. Quick, someone get him hooked on drugs................. (if he isn't already)

Owzat is pennant your knew crouch??

So I'm not allowed to think players are substandard. You're not as sharp witted as you'd like to think you are, the obvious "knew crouch" would be misses Keane 

I am a Liverpool fan first and foremost, you might be happy with some of the dross Rafa signs, but I can't believe anyone would think Pennant is Liverpool standard - except maybe GBJH who I don't recall seeing around much, unless he changed his name through shame at this thread. But if you need to make your stupid remarks to amuse yourself when plenty on here are talking of selling not only Pennant, but up to seven or ten players in January, then knock yourself out. Maybe you are just stupid enough to think you are clever, how would you know otherwise? Just when I was thinking you'd left your stupid days behind you and were settling down