Liverpool FC Forum

I wonder who Roy will drop for the next game now that Shrek is back. Got a feeling it will be Carroll.

Hold on a min... He scored one goal and spend the rest of the time walking around...

tubby » Sat Jun 16, 2012 4:08 pm wrote:I wonder who Roy will drop for the next game now that Shrek is back. Got a feeling it will be Carroll.

Theres not a doubt Wellbeck will play, and he should. Its night and day between him and Andy on the floor. He runs the channels, links up with play, gets involved in the build up.

Brilliant header from Andy, one of the best headed goals you will see, but that game again showed why i cant see him having a future with us unless he develops massively on the floor. His involvement when the ball was on the ground was zero. You only ever saw him when it was launched up in the air. England were ultra basic against Sweden as every pundit/media have stated. Rodgers does not play this way.

Its not just his lack of contribution on the floor, his immobility and lack of movement is a massive negative. Its almost slow motion when he "runs". Wellbeck broke clear in the first half and Carroll was 30 yards behind. Walcott was skimming past defenders when he came on.. Carroll was left way behind play. The chance at the end of the game when England broke away, it was Gerrard and Arsenal fella who were in the box up with play... again, Carroll a good 25/30 yards behind play. When you focus on this closely its alarming. The same happens with us.. Luis Suarez spins a defender and runs clear... Andy left behind play.

He neither has the mobility nor the technique on the floor to play a pass and move game. The direct stuff is his game, and that is not Rodgers.

Should also add.. the goal was excellent not just for Andy but in terms of his value... so.. IF we do sell (whenever) then his stock is higher.

If we could afford to keep him as an aerial option from the bench then that would obviously be fantastic. I just dont see us letting a guy we spent 35million warm the bench and watch an asset depreciate further.

I think it's fair to say both of you are clueless if you think he added nothing on the floor yesterday and just walked around. That is just plain blindness and daft. The guy was a menace both in the air and on the ground.

It's time to bury the prejudice against him and the preconceived ideas about him and actually watch the f*cking game. Carroll was one of the best players on the pitch.

Benny The Noon » Sat Jun 16, 2012 5:13 pm wrote:I think it's fair to say both of you are clueless if you think he added nothing on the floor yesterday and just walked around. That is just plain blindness and daft. The guy was a menace both in the air and on the ground.

It's time to bury the prejudice against him and the preconceived ideas about him and actually watch the f*cking game. Carroll was one of the best players on the pitch.

Clowns like to ride together. 

Kenny Kan » Sat Jun 16, 2012 3:04 pm wrote:

RED BEERGOGGLES » Sat Jun 16, 2012 1:53 pm wrote:I will reiterate what I said earlier in this thread ,"The tale of the Big Man is just beginning "

Andy's header couldn't  have been any sweeter if the ball had been dipped in the snatch of Kelly brook .

Kelly Brook's snatch, sorry mate, we'll have to agree to disagree on that one.

OK name your desired snatch.

He had a good first half against Sweden I thought. It wasn't just the goal (which was absolutely top drawer) but also his hold up play that made an impression. I distinctly remember him coming deep on several occasions and controlling it adeptly, spinning and either winning a free-kick, or passing a good ball out wide. That's exactly what you need from him and it signals his continuing improvement. In the second half, the England team as a whole were a lot deeper and had much less possession, starving him of any real supply. Nevertheless, the improvements in his hold up play were and are blindinglingy obvious and if he can maintain it we should have a real player on our hands.

However, if we don't see him taking on players and doing 35 stepovers in every game for the next 6 months, sell him.

LFC2007 » Sat Jun 16, 2012 8:49 pm wrote:He had a good first half against Sweden I thought. It wasn't just the goal (which was absolutely top drawer) but also his hold up play that made an impression. I distinctly remember him coming deep on several occasions and controlling it adeptly, spinning and either winning a free-kick, or passing a good ball out wide. That's exactly what you need from him and it signals his continuing improvement. In the second half, the England team as a whole were a lot deeper and had much less possession, starving him of any real supply. Nevertheless, the improvements in his hold up play were and are blindinglingy obvious and if he can maintain it we should have a real player on our hands.

However, if we don't see him taking on players and doing 35 stepovers in every game for the next 6 months, sell him.

That's exactly how i saw it as well.

[quote="[url=http://www.liverpoolfc-newkit.co.uk/viewtopic.php?p=1176207#p1176207]D___C » Sat Jun 16, 2012 11:51 am[/url
Its not just his lack of contribution on the floor, his immobility and lack of movement is a massive negative. Its almost slow motion when he "runs". Wellbeck broke clear in the first half and Carroll was 30 yards behind. Walcott was skimming past defenders when he came on.. Carroll was left way behind play. The chance at the end of the game when England broke away, it was Gerrard and Arsenal fella who were in the box up with play... again, Carroll a good 25/30 yards behind play. When you focus on this closely its alarming. The same happens with us.. Luis Suarez spins a defender and runs clear... Andy left behind play.

He neither has the mobility nor the technique on the floor to play a pass and move game. The direct stuff is his game, and that is not Rodgers.[/quote]
I love how you've noted a play in which Carroll happened to be the player who was inside the box who made the headed clearance, to spring the break in the first place.  You have just proven that you know absolutely F.uck all about football. 

Carroll was awesome yesterday.  Some of his hold up play was incredible.  The balls he hit down the channels were obviously something you missed while you were tweeting with your Bittershite mates about how Carroll hadn't scored three, or that Carroll didn't do Terry and Lescott's job.

Benny The Noon » Sat Jun 16, 2012 11:53 am wrote:

LFC2007 » Sat Jun 16, 2012 8:49 pm wrote:He had a good first half against Sweden I thought. It wasn't just the goal (which was absolutely top drawer) but also his hold up play that made an impression. I distinctly remember him coming deep on several occasions and controlling it adeptly, spinning and either winning a free-kick, or passing a good ball out wide. That's exactly what you need from him and it signals his continuing improvement. In the second half, the England team as a whole were a lot deeper and had much less possession, starving him of any real supply. Nevertheless, the improvements in his hold up play were and are blindinglingy obvious and if he can maintain it we should have a real player on our hands.

However, if we don't see him taking on players and doing 35 stepovers in every game for the next 6 months, sell him.

That's exactly how i saw it as well.

Agreed.  People need to step off a bit and realize the kid puts in a shift.  Easily the hardest worker from either team on the pitch... He was everywhere, and his defensive ability does help as he clears a lot of set pieces.

The Good Yank » Sat Jun 16, 2012 7:59 pm wrote:I love how you've noted a play in which Carroll happened to be the player who was inside the box who made the headed clearance, to spring the break in the first place.  You have just proven that you know absolutely F.uck all about football. 

Carroll was awesome yesterday.  Some of his hold up play was incredible.  The balls he hit down the channels were obviously something you missed while you were tweeting with your Bittershite mates about how Carroll hadn't scored three, or that Carroll didn't do Terry and Lescott's job.

If it's the Gerrard left-foot volley he's on about, then he's talking out his a'rse because Carroll wasn''t even 20-30 behind play. He was miles further back, helping out with the defence after Sweden had pushed men forward knowing that they needed to score to avoid elimination. I don't see any probem with that given how effective Carroll is in the air, and how Sweden were resorting to lumping it up there. That left the likes of Gerrard, Walcott and Chamberlain to break and create the chance that he's complaining about. It was a 3v2 pacey counter-attack so there was no real need for Andy to be up there. If England needed a goal more than they needed to avoid conceding, fair enough, but that wasn't the case.

nice to see some good posts in defence of carroll pointing out that he was near enough playing centre half in the end and it was a good job he was back there because he made at least 2 great clearances, one header in particular was brilliant, the ball was whipped in with real pace and there was a pack of swedish players who all looked favourite to get on the end of it then out of nowhere carroll managed to outjump them all and clear the ball.
the commentator didnt even mention it either.

Brilliant performance from Carroll in an England shirt. To be perfectly honest, I think he's more suited to the England style and personnel than he is to that at Liverpool. Regardless, his touch was impressive and he seemed to link up play well when needed. Based on that performance I think Hodgson will rightly have a selection headache with Rooney back. On the one hand, Wellbeck has excellent movement upfront and his linkup play with Rooney and Ashley Young (the 2 main attacking threats for England with Gerrard playing deeper) is an important factor to consider. In that respect, if Hodgson decides that his players do indeed have what it takes to play it on the ground and attempt to run behind teams then Wellbeck will always have the nod ahead of Carroll for that spearheading role. On the other hand, from what I've seen of the England side since the World Cup, it seems to be a generally accepted notion (by managers, players and fans alike) that the best chance this side has of getting results in the latter stages is by defending deep and relying on set pieces/long balls/ frustrating opposition. Carroll on that front gets the nod. His all round game needs a bit of improvement but as long as he does what he did against Sweden, thats all England need from him for now. He held the ball up well, brought runners into play well, and generally got into decent positions inside the box to cause opposition defenders problems and open up space for other attacking players.

For me, Carroll should start against the stronger sides with Wellbeck getting his chance against the realtively smaller sides.

Either way, this tournament imo will give Carroll some much needed experience and confidence that will hopefully reflect in his performances for us next season.

RED BEERGOGGLES » Sat Jun 16, 2012 7:09 pm wrote:

Kenny Kan » Sat Jun 16, 2012 3:04 pm wrote:

RED BEERGOGGLES » Sat Jun 16, 2012 1:53 pm wrote:I will reiterate what I said earlier in this thread ,"The tale of the Big Man is just beginning "

Andy's header couldn't  have been any sweeter if the ball had been dipped in the snatch of Kelly brook .

Kelly Brook's snatch, sorry mate, we'll have to agree to disagree on that one.

OK name your desired snatch.

Kelly Brook's   

in other words her snatch was/is/would be sweeter than Carroll's goal.........just,,,,yummy