My question is, does this scattergun approach increase our chances of finding new talent?
Bamaga - decent points, but one I can't agree with unfortunately, is that it shouldn't matter moving country when you're 16-18. I remember what I was like at that age and not having family around you at that stage can have a huge bearing on what you turn out like. If you read Gerrard and Fowlers' books they can't emphasise enough how the support of their family and friends helped focus them on developing their talents at an age where you can be distracted by so many things. Only a couple of years ago a young scandinavian lad in United's youth team went off the rails and got done for drunk driving. Obviously that's the extreme of it, and I don't suspect any of our youngsters are up to that sort of stuff, but I do think it must be far harder to concentrate on your football, when you're having to grow up so quickly in so many other aspects of your life.
I think there's something to be said for letting these lads come of age in natural surroundings and if they're still good enough when they're 20 then take them over. Obviously the problem arises in that other clubs don't adopt that approach and will come in and snap the player up before you. Therefore I think there should be a ruling about kids moving country to play football before the age of 18/19 and I won't be surprised if someone like Platini suggests it in the next few years. I know Brazilian players weren't allowed to leave Brazil before the age of 18 in the past, but not sure if that still applies.
DAV wrote:Best post I have read in weeks
john craig wrote:When you think of the cost of running the academy, the salaries of all the coaching staff, all the scouts and all the young players we are acquiring, is it worth it? God knows what the annual running costs must be - I'd like to see the figures. It's not far off 10 years since the club last produced a talent that came up through the ranks and cemented a place in the first team - Steven Gerrard. On top of that we've made about 5-6 million in total from the sales of Warnock and Stephen Wright. You could argue that Owen, Carra, Mcmanaman and Fowler came through prior to that in more of a purple patch for the youth set up, but it's an understatement to say we've not found and/or developed the players in recent years, and dare I say it since we've had foreign managers. It was reported that that is one of the reasons Heighway left the club - he felt players like Spearing could easily do a job in the first team but would never be given the chance. I suppose Heighway felt 'what's the point', and left.
Someone mentioned that the idea of the academy was so we could bring in global talent at a younger age to avoid the kind of outlay Chelsea and United make on players. But now we're doing that too - 26 million on Torres? And he won't be the last. So why do we have the academy?
stmichael wrote:john craig wrote:When you think of the cost of running the academy, the salaries of all the coaching staff, all the scouts and all the young players we are acquiring, is it worth it? God knows what the annual running costs must be - I'd like to see the figures. It's not far off 10 years since the club last produced a talent that came up through the ranks and cemented a place in the first team - Steven Gerrard. On top of that we've made about 5-6 million in total from the sales of Warnock and Stephen Wright. You could argue that Owen, Carra, Mcmanaman and Fowler came through prior to that in more of a purple patch for the youth set up, but it's an understatement to say we've not found and/or developed the players in recent years, and dare I say it since we've had foreign managers. It was reported that that is one of the reasons Heighway left the club - he felt players like Spearing could easily do a job in the first team but would never be given the chance. I suppose Heighway felt 'what's the point', and left.
Someone mentioned that the idea of the academy was so we could bring in global talent at a younger age to avoid the kind of outlay Chelsea and United make on players. But now we're doing that too - 26 million on Torres? And he won't be the last. So why do we have the academy?
It's a fair point that you make John.
Our academy has been going for around 10 years, and takes 1 million a year to run. Add up the transfer fees made for the following players...Thompson, Wright, Matteo, Warnock, Ostemobor, Welsh, Raven, Potter, Whitbread, Mellor, Guthrie, Hamill and a few more besides.
Have we received more than 10 million?
If so, then the academy, while not producing superstars, is making profit for the club to sign better players, and is giving young local kids a break into the professional game.
Something Heighway said in some interview he gave astounded me. 9 of the 11 lads in the current U-18 side, many of whom helped win the Youth cup last season, have been together since they were signed at 9. NINE. That is bloody impressive, seeing the potential in a group of 9 year olds and then seeing them progress to a very good standard at u-18. Whether any of them goes on to make the first team isn't really the point. We've done the best that we could with what was available : won the FA Youth Cup. If the best available from the catchment area doesn't have the speed, stamina, control, intelligence, desire etc, to compete with seasoned internationals from all over the World, then it's hardly the academies' fault.
If anyone thinks THEY can spot 9 year old kids from within an hour or so of Liverpool and turn them into Worldbeaters at 18, then instead of coming on here criticising the academy system they should put their money where their mouth is and apply for Heighway's job. Good luck.
john craig wrote:I agree St Mike, it was a great achievement to win the youth cup with a set of lads who'd been together since they were 9, but unfortunately that'll be as far as some of them go in the game - the pinnacle of their careers at just 17/18. It's fair to say sometimes you have to hold your hands up and say that's fair enough, there isn't the talent in the local area. I do agree with keeping the youth team going, as I've said before I think it's the duty of the club to put something back into the community and provide kids a chance to make a career for themselves, if not for us then at a smaller professional club.
That said, let's not kid ourselves that the academy is helping LFC to produce first team players and improve our sporting chances at the top end. It's not. Harsh reality.
I'd also challenge that the academy costs only 1 million a year to run. That may include physical costs of running the facilities (upkeep, electricity, maintenance), along with coaching staff and YTS wages. But what about the costs of covering recruitment and the worldwide scouting for teenage prospects? That has to cost us far more on top. This Dutch guy we've brought in to oversee coaching at the academy has to be on a few hundred grand a year, as does Elias, the guy we brought from Southampton to oversee recruitment. 1 million quid a year?? No chance. It's got to be losing money big time and the whole set up has to be looked at if we still aren't producing players a couple of years down the line. I'm willing to give the academy a couple of years to see what happens after the recent re-structure, but I'm not overly optimistic.
Let's not forget the academy was set up post-Steven Gerrard. It hasn't produced one single player for the first team yet.
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