Liverpool FC Forum

[Scottbot]

Either way, they'll still be thinking about the Spaniel...

Cocker? 

[bigmick]

Well whether or not you choose to believe me Lando, I do quite like Rafa I think he's broadly done a decent job, I've said so many times. Had we not fecked around with mass rotation for four seasons this wouldn't be our first title challenge underhis tenure, he has made some fine signings and some excellent decisions. He's probably the best defensive coach around I reckon, and I think he acts in the main in a dignified manner which is becoming of a Liverpool manager.

I do though ask the question about certain decisions which I think are wrong. Not bringing Keane on as sub was nothing to do with tactics, it was about making a point. I say that to be kind to the manager, because if he's just spent 20 million quid on a striker who was incapable of being an improvement on what Dirk Kuyt was offering on Saturday, then his judgement is terrible and he is an idiot. We know though that his judgement isn't terrible (Dossena aside) and that Keane is a better striker than Kuyt. That he didn't bring him on is a metter of fact, and I guess till the books come out we'll never know why. My contention is though that whatever point he was making, wasn't important enough to put the team getting three points at more risk than was necessary, which it did.

I retain the perogative to make such points on here, despite "quite" liking the manager.

[Lando_Griffin]

Benetez is our biggest liability this season, it looks very much like hes holding a personel grudge against Keane, just like he did with Alonso

Prove it, or shut it, you tit.

Well done Lando for proving Big Mick so wrong about the pro-rafalites being rude and aggressive to the anti's. 

I'm very disappointed with the result especially since Rafa still continues to play Dossena whilst everybody knows he is terrible. Also not bringing on Keane for Kuyt when Kuyt was clearly having a bad game is terrible management, oh dear, there I said it, I'm no longer a fan now am I

Tell you what, if you think Rafa was right to play Dossena and not bring on Keane why don't you please let us know what his thinking was.

Heimdall - at times, it is possible to have a reasoned conversation with someone. You are able to put your point across, they theirs, and then you come to some kind of understanding.

Then you have conversations with people so blinded by hate and a desperate desire to be proved right that they wish for the team to lose. In these circumstances, the only way to get through to them is to say; "Sh*t up, you c*nt."

Can you guess which approach I favour with you?

You have a pop at Ferguson, you'd expect a Manc to have a go at you in defense of their manager.
You have a pop at Moyes, and you'd expect Everton's fans to stick up for his manager.
You have a pop at Rafa, and you'd expect Liverpool fans to...

Be the first to rip him apart, even contradicting their own points of view just to stick the boot in one more time.

You're not fans. You're greedy, grasping little turds, not worthy of watching Liverpool win anything.

Real Liverpool fans have a proud history of being supportive right till the end. This is then hopefully replicated on the playing field, as it was in the past. As it was in Istanbul. As it has been in Cardiff plenty of times.

Fat chance of it continuing if you lot are ever let in the ground.

[bigmick]

Heimdall - at times, it is possible to have a reasoned conversation with someone. You are able to put your point across, they theirs, and then you come to some kind of understanding.

Then you have conversations with people so blinded by hate and a desperate desire to be proved right that they wish for the team to lose. In these circumstances, the only way to get through to them is to say; "Sh*t up, you c*nt."

Can you guess which approach I favour with you?

      Sorry Heimdall for laughing because it encourages him, but I spat me coffee all over the kyboard at that one, even you must admit that was a classic   

Out of order of course but funny as feck 

[Lando_Griffin]

Well whether or not you choose to believe me Lando, I do quite like Rafa I think he's broadly done a decent job, I've said so many times. Had we not fecked around with mass rotation for four seasons this wouldn't be our first title challenge underhis tenure, he has made some fine signings and some excellent decisions. He's probably the best defensive coach around I reckon, and I think he acts in the main in a dignified manner which is becoming of a Liverpool manager.

I do though ask the question about certain decisions which I think are wrong. Not bringing Keane on as sub was nothing to do with tactics, it was about making a point. I say that to be kind to the manager, because if he's just spent 20 million quid on a striker who was incapable of being an improvement on what Dirk Kuyt was offering on Saturday, then his judgement is terrible and he is an idiot. We know though that his judgement isn't terrible (Dossena aside) and that Keane is a better striker than Kuyt. That he didn't bring him on is a metter of fact, and I guess till the books come out we'll never know why. My contention is though that whatever point he was making, wasn't important enough to put the team getting three points at more risk than was necessary, which it did.

I retain the perogative to make such points on here, despite "quite" liking the manager.

Do you think you would agree with any other manager's decisions 100% of the time?

Whilst any other team's fans would be basking in our obvious progress, some seem more interested in saving face.

Why?

[bigmick]

Well whether or not you choose to believe me Lando, I do quite like Rafa I think he's broadly done a decent job, I've said so many times. Had we not fecked around with mass rotation for four seasons this wouldn't be our first title challenge underhis tenure, he has made some fine signings and some excellent decisions. He's probably the best defensive coach around I reckon, and I think he acts in the main in a dignified manner which is becoming of a Liverpool manager.

I do though ask the question about certain decisions which I think are wrong. Not bringing Keane on as sub was nothing to do with tactics, it was about making a point. I say that to be kind to the manager, because if he's just spent 20 million quid on a striker who was incapable of being an improvement on what Dirk Kuyt was offering on Saturday, then his judgement is terrible and he is an idiot. We know though that his judgement isn't terrible (Dossena aside) and that Keane is a better striker than Kuyt. That he didn't bring him on is a metter of fact, and I guess till the books come out we'll never know why. My contention is though that whatever point he was making, wasn't important enough to put the team getting three points at more risk than was necessary, which it did.

I retain the perogative to make such points on here, despite "quite" liking the manager.

Do you think you would agree with any other manager's decisions 100% of the time?

Whilst any other team's fans would be basking in our obvious progress, some seem more interested in saving face.

Why?

100% of the time? Not a chance. Ask any two people who have an interest about football a number of questions and they'll NEVER agree 100%. That's one of the reasons I find it so odd when people get so fired up if you dare to say you disagree with the manager on any issue.


As for the "basking in our obvious progress" bit, I am just about the only poster on here who thinks we were goiod enough to launch a title challenge in each of the last three seasons, not just this one. In many ways, I've been Rafa's biggest advocate strange as it may seem.

And as for saving face, it's never really been important to me but since you bring it up, it would be difficult for anyone to say I was 100% wrong about mass rotation surely? I said if we cut back we'd challenge, we've cut back and we're challenging.

I love us being top as much as the next man, except I want us to actually win it and when something happens which I think is detrimental to our chances I'll say so. If we win it, people can argue till the cows come home about who's saved face, who was right all along, who called it totally wrong and all that old sh!t. I personally couldn't give a feck, just so long as we win it. Step one is giving ourselves the very best opportunity.

[maguskwt]

absolutely spot on Lando...

there's just too much negativity on this forum. Listen, none of us like LFC to drop points. All of us want us to win all 38 games. But when the going gets tough, the tough gets going. This is our best chance in many years to clinch the league, and it is in our best interest as fans to get behind the team and the manager. Like it or not, in terms of squad quality, we are not head and shoulders above our rivals. In fact the best we can say is we are equal. So we can't be expecting other teams to roll over for us just like that. We will be dropping points no doubt about it. But so too will our rivals. So now as fans, we can be critical about our manager, what the manager does or does not. But we should express this in a reasonable manner. Now we have people saying he's a clown or an idiot, we have people saying that our title challenge is gone just because we drew 3 teams at home, and we're still top of the table! The team and the manager deserve better support than this. And if there are so many negative and mentally weak posters on here, we need posters like Lando to kick some sense into them. Lando, I support you, you're like the masked vigilante to keep these forums at least a bit balanced...

[Lando_Griffin]

Well whether or not you choose to believe me Lando, I do quite like Rafa I think he's broadly done a decent job, I've said so many times. Had we not fecked around with mass rotation for four seasons this wouldn't be our first title challenge underhis tenure, he has made some fine signings and some excellent decisions. He's probably the best defensive coach around I reckon, and I think he acts in the main in a dignified manner which is becoming of a Liverpool manager.

I do though ask the question about certain decisions which I think are wrong. Not bringing Keane on as sub was nothing to do with tactics, it was about making a point. I say that to be kind to the manager, because if he's just spent 20 million quid on a striker who was incapable of being an improvement on what Dirk Kuyt was offering on Saturday, then his judgement is terrible and he is an idiot. We know though that his judgement isn't terrible (Dossena aside) and that Keane is a better striker than Kuyt. That he didn't bring him on is a metter of fact, and I guess till the books come out we'll never know why. My contention is though that whatever point he was making, wasn't important enough to put the team getting three points at more risk than was necessary, which it did.

I retain the perogative to make such points on here, despite "quite" liking the manager.

Do you think you would agree with any other manager's decisions 100% of the time?

Whilst any other team's fans would be basking in our obvious progress, some seem more interested in saving face.

Why?

100% of the time? Not a chance. Ask any two people who have an interest about football a number of questions and they'll NEVER agree 100%. That's one of the reasons I find it so odd when people get so fired up if you dare to say you disagree with the manager on any issue.


As for the "basking in our obvious progress" bit, I am just about the only poster on here who thinks we were goiod enough to launch a title challenge in each of the last three seasons, not just this one. In many ways, I've been Rafa's biggest advocate strange as it may seem.

And as for saving face, it's never really been important to me but since you bring it up, it would be difficult for anyone to say I was 100% wrong about mass rotation surely? I said if we cut back we'd challenge, we've cut back and we're challenging.

I love us being top as much as the next man, except I want us to actually win it and when something happens which I think is detrimental to our chances I'll say so. If we win it, people can argue till the cows come home about who's saved face, who was right all along, who called it totally wrong and all that old sh!t. I personally couldn't give a feck, just so long as we win it. Step one is giving ourselves the very best opportunity.

But does it matter HOW, as long as we actually win it?

[bigmick]

No, I couldn't give two fecks how we win it. I'm not bothered that we're playing sh!t, I AM bothered that we can't win at home. If we were playing at home but still winning, I wouldn't give a feck. The reason I am bothered despite the other teams also dropping points, is that we are ticking off very winnable games here and only getting one point a time. There WILL come a point where we have tougher fixtures, and lose a couple of matches. We may well pay for the fact that we failed to win our most winnable fixtures. 

I don't give a sh!t about Robbie Keane the person, I'm sure he's a nice bloke and all that but I've never met him. The reason I think he should have played/come on as sub on saturday is because I think if he had, we'd have had more chance of winning the match.

[account deleted by request]

Well whether or not you choose to believe me Lando, I do quite like Rafa I think he's broadly done a decent job, I've said so many times. Had we not fecked around with mass rotation for four seasons this wouldn't be our first title challenge underhis tenure, he has made some fine signings and some excellent decisions. He's probably the best defensive coach around I reckon, and I think he acts in the main in a dignified manner which is becoming of a Liverpool manager.

I do though ask the question about certain decisions which I think are wrong. Not bringing Keane on as sub was nothing to do with tactics, it was about making a point. I say that to be kind to the manager, because if he's just spent 20 million quid on a striker who was incapable of being an improvement on what Dirk Kuyt was offering on Saturday, then his judgement is terrible and he is an idiot. We know though that his judgement isn't terrible (Dossena aside) and that Keane is a better striker than Kuyt. That he didn't bring him on is a metter of fact, and I guess till the books come out we'll never know why. My contention is though that whatever point he was making, wasn't important enough to put the team getting three points at more risk than was necessary, which it did.

I retain the perogative to make such points on here, despite "quite" liking the manager.

Do you think you would agree with any other manager's decisions 100% of the time?

Whilst any other team's fans would be basking in our obvious progress, some seem more interested in saving face.

Why?

100% of the time? Not a chance. Ask any two people who have an interest about football a number of questions and they'll NEVER agree 100%. That's one of the reasons I find it so odd when people get so fired up if you dare to say you disagree with the manager on any issue.


As for the "basking in our obvious progress" bit, I am just about the only poster on here who thinks we were goiod enough to launch a title challenge in each of the last three seasons, not just this one. In many ways, I've been Rafa's biggest advocate strange as it may seem.

And as for saving face, it's never really been important to me but since you bring it up, it would be difficult for anyone to say I was 100% wrong about mass rotation surely? I said if we cut back we'd challenge, we've cut back and we're challenging.

I love us being top as much as the next man, except I want us to actually win it and when something happens which I think is detrimental to our chances I'll say so. If we win it, people can argue till the cows come home about who's saved face, who was right all along, who called it totally wrong and all that old sh!t. I personally couldn't give a feck, just so long as we win it. Step one is giving ourselves the very best opportunity.

Spot on Mick. Did everyone always agree with Shanks , Paisley, Dalglish ......... no. They got things wrong, they made mistakes just as Rafa does.

It makes me laugh when I read some of the rubbish spouted on here at times. If we were at the game, you back the team 100%, once the game is over you go to the pub and discuss the game. You discuss the ref, the players AND the managers decisions.

That's not being disloyal thats being a normal football fan. Same on here, I am sure if Rafa came onto the site people would be a little more circumspect in their posts, as he doesn't we are more open about our views. I thought that was the idea of a football forum, that people could express their views?

Or maybe we should all be sat writing how happy we were to draw another home match. How we think that every decision Rafa makes is sheer genius and every player we have is the best in the world.

Sadly not every player we have is the best in the world and Rafa makes mistakes just like any other human being.

To say that people are "picking on Rafa because of where he comes from" is idiotic. How come Torres seems to have universal approval across the site if thats the case? I think its more due to the fact that he knocks goals in for fun rather than where he comes from which matters.   

We are writing posts on a football forum, they have no impact whatsoever on Rafa. If our posts mattered in the slightest outside this forum I am sure Hicks and Gillett would be out on their ear already and DIC busy building our new stadium.

Some people need to take a chill pill relax and enjoy the football debate rather than worrying if someone doesn't like Rafa. We are not kids, "if you don't like my friend I am not playing with you"   

BTW TOP OF THE LEAGUE IS NOT GOOD ENOUGH! League champions IS good enough. If and when we achieve that .... then its a job well done. You get nothing for being top in December, but a nice shiny cup for winning the League.

[Lando_Griffin]

No, I couldn't give two fecks how we win it. I'm not bothered that we're playing sh!t, I AM bothered that we can't win at home. If we were playing at home but still winning, I wouldn't give a feck. The reason I am bothered despite the other teams also dropping points, is that we are ticking off very winnable games here and only getting one point a time. There WILL come a point where we have tougher fixtures, and lose a couple of matches. We may well pay for the fact that we failed to win our most winnable fixtures. 

I don't give a sh!t about Robbie Keane the person, I'm sure he's a nice bloke and all that but I've never met him. The reason I think he should have played/come on as sub on saturday is because I think if he had, we'd have had more chance of winning the match.

And there it is - a sensible, balanced post, without the "Rafa did this wrong, etc" as the underlying structure to it.

"I didn't agree with Rafa's substitutions. I would have put X on for X, etc. Dossena is, in my opinion, a poor player, and I would very much like to see X in his place.
That said, we are top, and we did still dominate the game without getting the third goal, and were it not for a couple of errors, we'd have won comfortably."

This would have been a better option for some of the boo-boys, rather than the "Rafa's a clown" they opted for.

Even the biggest Rafa critic cannot deny that he has taken this club more than a few steps forward since the days of Houllier and Evans. People should just try and remember that, I feel.

[Lando_Griffin]

Well whether or not you choose to believe me Lando, I do quite like Rafa I think he's broadly done a decent job, I've said so many times. Had we not fecked around with mass rotation for four seasons this wouldn't be our first title challenge underhis tenure, he has made some fine signings and some excellent decisions. He's probably the best defensive coach around I reckon, and I think he acts in the main in a dignified manner which is becoming of a Liverpool manager.

I do though ask the question about certain decisions which I think are wrong. Not bringing Keane on as sub was nothing to do with tactics, it was about making a point. I say that to be kind to the manager, because if he's just spent 20 million quid on a striker who was incapable of being an improvement on what Dirk Kuyt was offering on Saturday, then his judgement is terrible and he is an idiot. We know though that his judgement isn't terrible (Dossena aside) and that Keane is a better striker than Kuyt. That he didn't bring him on is a metter of fact, and I guess till the books come out we'll never know why. My contention is though that whatever point he was making, wasn't important enough to put the team getting three points at more risk than was necessary, which it did.

I retain the perogative to make such points on here, despite "quite" liking the manager.

Do you think you would agree with any other manager's decisions 100% of the time?

Whilst any other team's fans would be basking in our obvious progress, some seem more interested in saving face.

Why?

100% of the time? Not a chance. Ask any two people who have an interest about football a number of questions and they'll NEVER agree 100%. That's one of the reasons I find it so odd when people get so fired up if you dare to say you disagree with the manager on any issue.


As for the "basking in our obvious progress" bit, I am just about the only poster on here who thinks we were goiod enough to launch a title challenge in each of the last three seasons, not just this one. In many ways, I've been Rafa's biggest advocate strange as it may seem.

And as for saving face, it's never really been important to me but since you bring it up, it would be difficult for anyone to say I was 100% wrong about mass rotation surely? I said if we cut back we'd challenge, we've cut back and we're challenging.

I love us being top as much as the next man, except I want us to actually win it and when something happens which I think is detrimental to our chances I'll say so. If we win it, people can argue till the cows come home about who's saved face, who was right all along, who called it totally wrong and all that old sh!t. I personally couldn't give a feck, just so long as we win it. Step one is giving ourselves the very best opportunity.

Spot on Mick. Did everyone always agree with Shanks , Paisley, Dalglish ......... no. They got things wrong, they made mistakes just as Rafa does.

It makes me laugh when I read some of the rubbish spouted on here at times. If we were at the game, you back the team 100%, once the game is over you go to the pub and discuss the game. You discuss the ref, the players AND the managers decisions.

That's not being disloyal thats being a normal football fan. Same on here, I am sure if Rafa came onto the site people would be a little more circumspect in their posts, as he doesn't we are more open about our views. I thought that was the idea of a football forum, that people could express their views?

Or maybe we should all be sat writing how happy we were to draw another home match. How we think that every decision Rafa makes is sheer genius and every player we have is the best in the world.

Sadly not every player we have is the best in the world and Rafa makes mistakes just like any other human being.

To say that people are "picking on Rafa because of where he comes from" is idiotic. How come Torres seems to have universal approval across the site if thats the case? I think its more due to the fact that he knocks goals in for fun rather than where he comes from which matters.   

We are writing posts on a football forum, they have no impact whatsoever on Rafa. If our posts mattered in the slightest outside this forum I am sure Hicks and Gillett would be out on their ear already and DIC busy building our new stadium.

Some people need to take a chill pill relax and enjoy the football debate rather than worrying if someone doesn't like Rafa. We are not kids, "if you don't like my friend I am not playing with you"   

BTW TOP OF THE LEAGUE IS NOT GOOD ENOUGH! League champions IS good enough. If and when we achieve that .... then its a job well done. You get nothing for being top in December, but a nice shiny cup for winning the League.

No, so when people say that want a home-grown/English/British manager, then that's nothing at all to do with where they're from, is it? (Look back at past threads if you wish to argue the toss.)

Opinions expressed in the pub don't get written down and broadcast globally. Half of the shart expressed on here would result in an impromptu lesson in how to take a punch if said in the boozer, I feel.

I'm not getting into another spat with you. I really can't be bothered with it.

But you surely must see why I get so annoyed at reading constant negativity and overreaction?

[Bam]

Its funny how you cannot question or critise the manager without being lablelled a greedy little fecker who doesnt deserve to see Liverpool win anything.

Is this some kind of thing where your proving how great a supporter you are be agreeing with every decision Rafa's made, you know it doesnt make you a superior supporter in any way shape or form, more of an idiot. If you cant come up you're own opinion and reasoned debate.

I bet any money that Rafa ISNT happy with the dropped points at home to Fulham, West Ham and Hull. He wont be fooled into thinking everything is cushdy, I reckon alarm bells will have started ringing with him because of the fact we cant kill teams off who dont even cost a quarter of the price our squad does.

[Bam]

Same old s.hit on here, it turns into I'm a better supporter than you, instead of footie discussion the usual idiots stir up a s.hit storm.

[Lando_Griffin]

Its funny how you cannot question or critise the manager without being lablelled a greedy little fecker who doesnt deserve to see Liverpool win anything.

Is this some kind of thing where your proving how great a supporter you are be agreeing with every decision Rafa's made, you know it doesnt make you a superior supporter in any way shape or form, more of an idiot. If you cant come up you're own opinion and reasoned debate.

I bet any money that Rafa ISNT happy with the dropped points at home to Fulham, West Ham and Hull. He wont be fooled into thinking everything is cushdy, I reckon alarm bells will have started ringing with him because of the fact we cant kill teams off who dont even cost a quarter of the price our squad does.

Ah, the "Trinity" is complete...

I'd have thought it would take a complete buffoon, sorely lacking a brain to fail to realise that I am one opinionated Mother F*cker.

(But I'll let you off that one, seeing as we're such close friends, Bammy...)

I haven't once said that Rafa is "happy" with the dropped points. In fact, I haven't even touched upon what Rafa might think about them. I am not happy that we have lost points, I am not happy that my curry was cold by the time I got home, I am not happy that I have to work later, I am not happy that I am not in the slightest bit tired, and I am not happy that Kate Beckinsale is no doubt in bed with another man and not me.

However. I do see the brighter side of the situation.
1.) I will still buy from the same curry house next time, safe in the knowledge that these things happen even to the best of us. Plus, it wasn't bad, anyway.
2.) I will not jack my job in, as even though at times it doesn't go according to plan, it's worth it in the end as it pays my bills, and keeps a roof over my head.
3.) Tomorrow is another day, and the sleep I don't get tonight will be caught up tomorrow.
4.) Even though she is probably lying with some poxy b*stard, one day there is a minute chance that she will realise the error of her ways, and leap fanny-first upon my mouth, with the promise of life-long sexual bliss muffled by her inner thighs.

The price of a squad, eh? I bet Chelsea were gutted when they lost to us...