Liverpool FC Forum

[jim_morrison_supported_liverpool]

there's absolutely billions of threads and posts ont his site all trying to sum up the liverpool team, manager, and all the things to do with the club at the moment.

the thing is, we all know everyone is entitled to their opinion, but you have to make opinions based on information. you cant just blurt out anything. opinons should be informed by facts.
at the moment there isnt nearly enough facts for basing all these opinions on. we've had 8 games this season. its a whole new era. why have we got all these people trying to sum up the club, the way the team is performing, how it should be performing, whats wrong, who's sh*te  etc etc etc.

truth is, you say you're entitled to your opinion, and you are. everyone is entitled to say what they want to say, about anything. but if you want your opinons to be valued you have to base them on facts and information, and we dont have enough about the liverpool set up at the moment for everyone to be shouting all this nonsense, its not the sh*tbag option to be saying "give them time", its not at all. its a way of saying, "lets wait and see before we judge because we really dont know whats going on yet."

this post isnt aimed at anyone in particular, but personally, its getting boring on this site now, all the threads are becoming the same because people just wont shut up about liverpool and all their faults and shortcomings and bad signings, and people are defending against that. it just goes round and round.

[maximus]

there's absolutely billions of threads and posts ont his site all trying to sum up the liverpool team, manager, and all the things to do with the club at the moment.

the thing is, we all know everyone is entitled to their opinion, but you have to make opinions based on information. you cant just blurt out anything. opinons should be informed by facts.
at the moment there isnt nearly enough facts for basing all these opinions on. we've had 8 games this season. its a whole new era. why have we got all these people trying to sum up the club, the way the team is performing, how it should be performing, whats wrong, who's sh*te  etc etc etc.

truth is, you say you're entitled to your opinion, and you are. everyone is entitled to say what they want to say, about anything. but if you want your opinons to be valued you have to base them on facts and information, and we dont have enough about the liverpool set up at the moment for everyone to be shouting all this nonsense, its not the sh*tbag option to be saying "give them time", its not at all. its a way of saying, "lets wait and see before we judge because we really dont know whats going on yet."

this post isnt aimed at anyone in particular, but personally, its getting boring on this site now, all the threads are becoming the same because people just wont shut up about liverpool and all their faults and shortcomings and bad signings, and people are defending against that. it just goes round and round.

JBG, Supersub take note................close the sight with immediate effect 

Although Jimbo I do agree with you

[bRy]

Completely agree.
8 games into the season is too early to assess anything, particularly when the team is bouncing from good home performaces to average away performances.

People should be grateful for the fact that we are unbeaten in the Premiership at home and were impressive at home in the Champions League. Home form must come first when the club is being rebuilt and sooner or later the away form will come. And to be honest, the facts don't tell the whole story in terms of our performances away from home.

1. spurs game - dominated the first half in Benitez's first game in charge and managed a draw away to a remarkably improved Tottenham side who aren't faring too badly at the start of the season

2. - bolton game - we were robbed of a point against an in-form bolton side who managed a draw at highbury of all places.

3. - utd game - i managed to miss seeing this game, however reports say we were outplayed, yet we only lost 2-1. At the start of the season there are games that you hope to win, but don't necesarily expect to win. ie Utd away, Chelsea away, Arsenal away, Newcastle away. What's more important is that we beat these teams at home, as last year's performances against the big three at home didn't net us one single point.

This week at Chelsea shall be a good test for the side and perhaps a good mental indicator of which players can rebound from a poor performance, particularly after their manager criticizes them in the media.

As for criticism of players such as Cisse who are new to the club, it must be remembered that they are adapting to life in the Premiership. Personally, Cisse's contribution of 2 goals in 6 games already is cause for optimism due to the fact that he will be adapting to a completely new environment and that he hasn't featured for the whole 90 minutes in every one of those games.

Come January, perhaps that's when we and Benitez will have a clearer indication of where we stand and some more serious analysis may be provided on more concrete facts.

[JBG]

this post isnt aimed at anyone in particular, but personally, its getting boring on this site now, all the threads are becoming the same because people just wont shut up about liverpool and all their faults and shortcomings and bad signings, and people are defending against that. it just goes round and round.

That's the crux of Internet forums, you get a lot of good points and a lot of bad.

Some people are very quick to slam the team one week before praising it to the high heavens the next. Its the nature of what Big Al used to call kicklebugger fans.

This thing goes in cycles: sometimes we get some excellent threads here for a few weeks and then we can go back into a trough again of poor posting.

Everyone's entitled to their opinion, but obviously voicing that opinion in front of others is another matter. Certain people have deeply routed rascist convictions which is their opinion, but if they go sprouting it to others then that's a different thing altogether.

I guess what you are saying Jim is that there's a difference between a mere opinion and an informed opinion. An informed opinion is where you have knowledge of all or most of the facts of an issue, thought about them for a while, and then formed an opinion. This is different to where someone doesn't really know what they are talking about and forms and immediate and kneejerk opinion on the issue. Both opinions may be equally wrong or right, but personally I prefer hearing from somebody that knows what he or she is talking about and its clear that they have thought about what they are saying.

An example: I think cricket is a pointless sport and boring but I accept that's an uninformed opinion because I don't understand the rules of the game, have never played it, and in fact know hardly anything about it all. That's my kneejerk, uninformed opinion, but to a cricket lover, my opinion would be dumb and stupid.

[kindaconfused]

I guess its what you want out of the forum, if you want informed opinion then you look for it, if you want to read emotional issues then the forum is the place for it.

Surely there is room for all and with your Premiership members forum isnt that the place for more informed comment?

I also post in a quiet forum and I don't think I would like it to change but then that is a tad selfish.

I feel frustrated as well because the management of clubs interests me but its difficult to tempt peeps away from the traditional who plays well and who doesnt and who we should sell and not.

I saw JBG post an interesting article about agents and their role in football but I don't think the topic took off. I vote with me finger if it doesn't interest ME then I don't read and if does then I post.

The dilema for the forum is that they are trying to attract members and can't control what they write about and I've had a few spats with JBG in this regard.

But at the end of the day I would rather come into a forum and see some life than a forum that is struggling without any comments!

PS  Just thought surely the forum should be arranged (managed sorry JBG) in such a way that we can all get what we want out of it. As Mag Thatcher said the "forum is not for turning" in other words I dont think its gonna change unless yer do something to make it easier to find what interests you.

If the older members dont want it to change then perhaps you should put a hold on membership, go back to when you felt it was better and make a cruel cut. Just a suggestion as I'm almost old enuff to be an elder statesman.

[jim_morrison_supported_liverpool]

the point of my post is that its these kneejerk uninformed opinions that are making the site sh*t.  i'm not slaggin the site in any way. the debate is all good. the disagreements are good, thats what m,akes a good forum. and there's always good and bad points, thats why i come on the site.
but when the site is littered with how bad everything is, after a loss, trawling your way through them all looking for something interesting is a pain in the @rse.

its almost like junk mail

[kindaconfused]

jim_morrison_supported_liverpool

Calm down calm down....joking. I know, I'm not disagreeing with what you say but I dont think yer can stop peeps posting what they do therefore the alternative is to try and manage and signpost it better which is surely what the Premiership members forum attempts to do.

I like all comments but I have to admit some of the topics are repetitive or disintergrate off topic.

I'm not having a go at all just joining in the debate!

Surely its better to have more members than none and if the consequence of that is some posting are not quality then so be it or then the Mods step in and edit or reduce/stop membership....the choice is the Mods?

[JBG]

Agreed Kinda: people vote with their fingers (er....by typing that is).

Its good that everybody doesn't agree with each other, otherwise the forum would be a very boring place. Conflict is the essence of a forum, although I'd prefer it to be a conflict of opinions rather than a conflict of personalities, which unfortunately regularly occurs and every person is guilty of it.

Some of the "older" members get annoyed at times as they have been here a long time and I guess it can be frustrating for them going back over old ground when a newbie posts a topic that was debated to death a few months ago. However, thats the old members problem as the "newbie" is perfectly entitled to start the thread, and if the older members don't like that, they shouldn't reply to it.

As for rows and spats, this place was unreal last season as everyone was angry with what was happening on the playing field. I think most people agreed that Houllier should go.....then Stu_the_Red joined the forum, and sparks started to fly! 

[kindaconfused]

John Barnes' Granny

Agreed but don't forget me joining date which must make me one of the elder statesman?

Also what about a bit of "creative swiping" - nickin ideas from other forums to see how they cope with the issue. It would seem the issue is to increase the membership without losing the quality but can it be done. I dont think JBG has addressed this issue in his reply yet?

[JBG]

kinda: you are still pointing the finger at the mods.

As you can see from the rules above, only about 0.000001 posts or threads ever get deleted. Accidental multiple postings occasionally get deleted, or in the case of site vandalism caused by the Gobs.*i*e family, spam posts.

Very very seldomly well a thread get deleted on its merits, such as a rascist thread or a thread started by a rival fan insulting Scousers, or making offensive remarks about Hysel or Hillsborough.

I disagree with an awful lot of the posts on the forum but if I feel strongly enough I reply to them, neither Supersub, LFC or I have ever deleted a thread we disagreed with.

We occasionally lock a thread which degenerates into slagging matches or abuse, but the positive side to locking threads is that they can be unlocked.

There is zero tolerance to off topic threads which will be moved as off topic threads can only add to the problems Jim has outlined above.

[anfieldadorer]

can moderator make posting format? Like introduction, objectives, facts, conclusion, recommendation

[kindaconfused]

JBG

Its funny how you see me "having a go" that is not the case, all I'm saying is we can't control the issue and yer cant tell peeps what to write about so all yer can do is to try and organise it so peeps can find what they want to read without going through postings that don't interest them.

Tell me whether you think this is having a go at the mods?

[kindaconfused]

anfieldadorer

I assume yer question is for a moderator so I've left it, if its addressed to me let me know and I'll have a go.

[Redrider]

Most opinions of Fan's have got to be based on a little knowledge. The only people who know what is really going on or how a player is really progressing and performing are the coaching staff at the club's. So unless you happen know some of these people it is very difficult for the average punter to have a truely 'informed' opinion.
Anyway, what's wrong with having an opinion, informed or not and expressing it on this Forum. That's what it's here for and I would rather fall out with the like of Jim Morrison than someone I really care about.
PS. I am Knack all to do with Kinda, even though he has also contributed to this Topic.

[JBG]

JBG

Its funny how you see me "having a go" that is not the case, all I'm saying is we can't control the issue and yer cant tell peeps what to write about so all yer can do is to try and organise it so peeps can find what they want to read without going through postings that don't issue them.

Tell me whether you think this is having a go at the mods?

   

Thats EXACTLY what I've been blue in the face trying to tell you for the past forthnight!!!!!!!!!!!

BTW AnfieldAdorer, go sit in the corner, we're all still cross at you over Shantigate.

Bomb blast near my office, my @rse!