Liverpool FC Forum

by **Bam** » Tue Dec 09, 2008 4:30 am

Fo Dne wrote:
bigmick wrote:
Fo Dne wrote:Gerrard's been head and shoulders above him. Obviously you don't count Gerrard in player of the year though as its unfair to compare anyone to him.

In all honesty there's something in that. Gerrard even on an off day illuminates each and every game he plays in with moments of sheer, blinding quality. Even against Blackjburn where he wasn't anywhere near his best, he still scored a goal and he does it week in, week out.

I probably wouldn't disagree with there Stu, though he has been below his best he's still been our most influential player. Apart from Gerrard though, it's Alonso.

Just a quickie as some people are talking about Reina being player of the season. Though he is excellent, I don't go for that. I thought he should have saved the free kick against Man City was it, and definately the header against Tottenham.

I dunno what game you were watching Mick but against Blackburn he was quality. He was everywhere and deserved his goal after a superb performance.

That has got to be up there with "worst post of the year", I dont know about Mick but you certainly wasnt watching the same game I was Stu.

That is complete tosh, Gerrard was gnash in the first half. I hardly remember him completing a pass. Infact it was his sloppy ball to Pedersten or whatever the feck he's called that led to the best shot on goal in the first half. Gerrard had a mare in the first half, and was only just better in the second. Take off the 'Gerrard Glasses' mate, Hyypia was MotM and Alonso had a better game than Gerrard TBF.

Infact Stu, you seem to praise up Gerrard more after he's had a mediocre performance than when he's had a blinder, in which you talk down how good he was and the fact he cant dictate a game and all the blah blah blah. Sometimes lad you dont make sense.

by **Bam** » Tue Dec 09, 2008 4:35 am

Yes, his demise was too exagerated, and no one can deny it because they were ready to sell on the cheap

His "demise" wasnt exagerated atall.

I dont care what the 'My Humble Alonso' crew are saying about him now, even though they're all coming out of the woodwork saying they were right all along. Shame the same cant be said about rotation ! But thats a different matter, one in which the Pro's are keeping quiet about.

Alonso in the past two seasons previously to this was very ordinary at it wasnt any surprise to see teams willing to bid 12 Million for the Spanaird, his form didnt justify a higher amount. But now with the kick up the @rse he's needed his form does justify a fair bit more than 12 Million, he has been one of our best players this season and looking in back it does seem as though it would of been a big mistake in letting him go. He looks a different player now and because of this I'm glad Rafa touted him around to other sides accross the continent because if not we probably would of seen the same old mundane Alonso of the last two seasons.

I think he has been our best consistent player this season, above Gerrard. Kuyt too although he's slightly gone off the boil somewhat and dried up infront of goal like a Nuns snatch. But still he's done his fair share to warrant a shout, Mascha has been okay to IMO and Carra as always has been our rock.

by **Sabre** » Tue Dec 09, 2008 12:10 pm

Bam wrote:
Yes, his demise was too exagerated, and no one can deny it because they were ready to sell on the cheap

His "demise" wasnt exagerated at all.

I dont care what the 'My Humble Alonso' crew are saying about him now, even though they're all coming out of the woodwork saying they were right all along. Shame the same cant be said about rotation ! But thats a different matter, one in which the Pro's are keeping quiet about.

Alonso in the past two seasons previously to this was very ordinary at it wasnt any surprise to see teams willing to bid 12 Million for the Spanaird, his form didnt justify a higher amount. But now with the kick up the @rse he's needed his form does justify a fair bit more than 12 Million, he has been one of our best players this season and looking in back it does seem as though it would of been a big mistake in letting him go. He looks a different player now and because of this I'm glad Rafa touted him around to other sides accross the continent because if not we probably would of seen the same old mundane Alonso of the last two seasons.

I think he has been our best consistent player this season, above Gerrard. Kuyt too although he's slightly gone off the boil somewhat and dried up infront of goal like a Nuns snatch. But still he's done his fair share to warrant a shout, Mascha has been okay to IMO and Carra as always has been our rock.

All right, all right

There's no point in discussing who said what really. This thread is only the last of many about Alonso.

I don't think our fellow newkitters are bored enough to look that old threads, so I won't bring those threads neither to prove wrong the masters of the art of backtracking. I couldn't care less at this point.

So, for the record, I'll hold my hand up, look at the thought police and confess:

<confession>

Alonso was never harshly critizised, you never said he was too slow for the PL, you were right about him, your criticism was sensible.

The ones who defended the player were OTT and just under massive hysteria, because we all know players get always fair criticism in newkit.

You were right to say we should have accepted the Juventus offer for the money they offered, and you're right now.

The same people that were anti Rafa, you were right about it, calling those who defended the manager happy clappy in the best case. You told us the reality like it is. The likes of Tomkins were full of shíte.

You were right about our lack of progress, you were right about the gap with Manchester United, and you were right to bring once and again comparisons with Ferguson. You also were right about Riera, infact, you were right about everything. You're also right now we're top of the table, because, needless to say, you were right about rotation.

Those of us who defended Alonso was a spanish international and a quality player, those of us who thought Rafa was making us progress were WRONG (note the caps), biased, and with unrealistic views. In three words, YOU WERE RIGHT </confession>

All that said, I'm glad you're able to appreciate some quality in the player now. I'll go back to the ignoring you mode and stop being a wind up merchant as you call me, and I won't recover old posts on Alonso just focus in the present and future of the player. Which I hope it will be long in this club, and I hope you'll keep patient when he has a lower form and still reckon he's a quality player not to be swapped for just any midfielder.

Remember, players do not go from top class to water carrier and again to top class. They may have bad forms, they may struggle coming from injury, but players do not forget playing football. Class is permanent, form is not.

Oh, and I'll truly confess that rotating less is having some benefits, despite I don't find it a key factor. Not that we play fluent, not that it's magic, but it has helped some players who may need some continuity. I hope that policy hasn't a price to be paid later, but we're not there yet, and I wouldn't touch ANYTHING if something is working.

(1) Disclaimer: This post is only aimed to Bam, and only to Bam.

by **Bam** » Tue Dec 09, 2008 1:09 pm

I won't bring those threads neither to prove wrong the masters of the art of backtracking.

?

by **Bam** » Tue Dec 09, 2008 1:27 pm

I don't think our fellow newkitters are bored enough to look that old threads, so I won't bring those threads neither to prove wrong the masters of the art of backtracking. I couldn't care less at this point.

Here we go, misunderstanding the English language again. I am not backtracking, Alonso did play like a water carrier, Alonso is slow and does turn slower than the titanic. Just because the lad has finally found some discent form, it doesnt all of a sudden mean he's gained a shed load of pace from nowhere and turns on a six pence as quick as Torville & Dean.
No, like I said Alonso still has his weaknes's but this time around he's showing us his qualities.
What now seems the only mistake and half the newkitt board made was the fact about selling him. It does now look as though it would of been a mistake, but I'm admitting it not backtracking.

Alonso was never harshly critizised, you never said he was too slow for the PL, you were right about him, your criticism was sensible.

Yes I know I was right about him, he was critised and rightly so, why are you trying to backtrack for me and say that I never said he was too slow. He is slow and he hasnt gained pace all of a sudden.

But then again you're undying love for you're "humble Xabi" was over exagerated to the point where you're tried to claim he wasnt in a blip. Yet everyone including Benitez could see
he was.

You were right to say we should have accepted the Juventus offer for the money they offered, and you're right now.

No I was wrong, I can admit that its a shame you cant do the same thing in certain instances, but hey if you're not man enough .... By the way admitting I was wrong isnt backtracking.

The same people that were anti Rafa, you were right about it, calling those who defended the manager happy clappy in the best case. You told us the reality like it is. The likes of Tomkins were full of shíte.

You're mate Stu is calling him the clown now, but that doesnt bother you does it. Oh thats right you like consistency, even if it means being consistently wrong. Duh !

You were right about our lack of progress, you were right about the gap with Manchester United, and you were right to bring once and again comparisons with Ferguson. You also were right about Riera, infact, you were right about everything. You're also right now we're top of the table, because, needless to say, you were right about rotation.

Yes, again I was right I'll take that one thankyou very much. Riera though I dont know what you're on about tbph and I doubt you actually do.

Those of us who defended Alonso was a spanish international and a quality player, those of us who thought Rafa was making us progress were WRONG (note the caps), biased, and with unrealistic views. In three words, YOU WERE RIGHT

Feck me Emile Heskey is an international, dont go thinking every international is a great player, remember one Mark Gonzalez :laugh:

The real progress has only been made obvious this season, rotation probably has something to do with that. :;):

by **Fo Dne** » Tue Dec 09, 2008 1:33 pm

Bam wrote:
Fo Dne wrote:
bigmick wrote:
Fo Dne wrote:Gerrard's been head and shoulders above him. Obviously you don't count Gerrard in player of the year though as its unfair to compare anyone to him.

In all honesty there's something in that. Gerrard even on an off day illuminates each and every game he plays in with moments of sheer, blinding quality. Even against Blackjburn where he wasn't anywhere near his best, he still scored a goal and he does it week in, week out.

I probably wouldn't disagree with there Stu, though he has been below his best he's still been our most influential player. Apart from Gerrard though, it's Alonso.

Just a quickie as some people are talking about Reina being player of the season. Though he is excellent, I don't go for that. I thought he should have saved the free kick against Man City was it, and definately the header against Tottenham.

I dunno what game you were watching Mick but against Blackburn he was quality. He was everywhere and deserved his goal after a superb performance.

That has got to be up there with "worst post of the year", I dont know about Mick but you certainly wasnt watching the same game I was Stu.

That is complete tosh, Gerrard was gnash in the first half. I hardly remember him completing a pass. Infact it was his sloppy ball to Pedersten or whatever the feck he's called that led to the best shot on goal in the first half. Gerrard had a mare in the first half, and was only just better in the second. Take off the 'Gerrard Glasses' mate, Hyypia was MotM and Alonso had a better game than Gerrard TBF.

Infact Stu, you seem to praise up Gerrard more after he's had a mediocre performance than when he's had a blinder, in which you talk down how good he was and the fact he cant dictate a game and all the blah blah blah. Sometimes lad you dont make sense.

Thats probably because you was sitting in a completely different part of the world watching a completely different match.

Funny how Aldo (at the game) gave man of the match to Gerrard, weird the way Setanta gave him man of the match and also strange how the match of the day commentators also said he deserved his goal.

All of which had something in common. They were there.

He produced some brilliant passes, he pressed the ball, made alot of runs and was generally everywhere on the pitch. He played an excellent pass through for which he couldn't even be arsed challenging for and was the only genuine attacking threat on the day.

Sami Hyypia did play very well aswell, but he completely lost Santa Cruz for the goal and didn't even put a challenge in so for me was not man of the match, as for Xabi, that was probably his worst game of the season in productivety and alround play, all he done in the first half was get the ball 5 yards infront of the centre backs, give it to the centre backs or the goalkeeper and then hide. The second half he stepped it up alot but still wasn't fantastic.

I find it quite amusing you bang on about how "creative" Gerrard is and then one game in particular where he looked the most likely to do anything for 69 minutes you say he had a "mare". If thats Gerrard having a "mare" lad he can have a "mare every week as far as I'm concerned.

To be quite honest, you're the only two Liverpool fans I've heard say otherwise and I find it staggering.

by **Fo Dne** » Tue Dec 09, 2008 1:37 pm

Bam wrote:
I don't think our fellow newkitters are bored enough to look that old threads, so I won't bring those threads neither to prove wrong the masters of the art of backtracking. I couldn't care less at this point.

Here we go, misunderstanding the English language again. I am not backtracking, Alonso did play like a water carrier, Alonso is slow and does turn slower than the titanic. Just because the lad has finally found some discent form, it doesnt all of a sudden mean he's gained a shed load of pace from nowhere and turns on a six pence as quick as Torville & Dean.
No, like I said Alonso still has his weaknes's but this time around he's showing us his qualities.
What now seems the only mistake and half the newkitt board made was the fact about selling him. It does now look as though it would of been a mistake, but I'm admitting it not backtracking.

Alonso was never harshly critizised, you never said he was too slow for the PL, you were right about him, your criticism was sensible.

Yes I know I was right about him, he was critised and rightly so, why are you trying to backtrack for me and say that I never said he was too slow. He is slow and he hasnt gained pace all of a sudden.

But then again you're undying love for you're "humble Xabi" was over exagerated to the point where you're tried to claim he wasnt in a blip. Yet everyone including Benitez could see
he was.

You were right to say we should have accepted the Juventus offer for the money they offered, and you're right now.

No I was wrong, I can admit that its a shame you cant do the same thing in certain instances, but hey if you're not man enough .... By the way admitting I was wrong isnt backtracking.

The same people that were anti Rafa, you were right about it, calling those who defended the manager happy clappy in the best case. You told us the reality like it is. The likes of Tomkins were full of shíte.

You're mate Stu is calling him the clown now, but that doesnt bother you does it. Oh thats right you like consistency, even if it means being consistently wrong. Duh !

You were right about our lack of progress, you were right about the gap with Manchester United, and you were right to bring once and again comparisons with Ferguson. You also were right about Riera, infact, you were right about everything. You're also right now we're top of the table, because, needless to say, you were right about rotation.

Yes, again I was right I'll take that one thankyou very much. Riera though I dont know what you're on about tbph and I doubt you actually do.

Those of us who defended Alonso was a spanish international and a quality player, those of us who thought Rafa was making us progress were WRONG (note the caps), biased, and with unrealistic views. In three words, YOU WERE RIGHT

Feck me Emile Heskey is an international, dont go thinking every international is a great player, remember one Mark Gonzalez
The real progress has only been made obvious this season, rotation probably has something to do with that.

by **Sabre** » Tue Dec 09, 2008 1:38 pm

Stu matey, as I told you yesterday before my siesta, you've got to get off Rafa's back.

You'll ignore me as always, but, hey, I'll tell you it again.

by **Bam** » Tue Dec 09, 2008 1:41 pm

Thats probably because you was sitting in a completely different part of the world watching a completely different match.

That old chestnut hey, Oh and I suppose you was at the game, do me a favour. You're Newkitts very own Jimmy Hill.

Funny how Aldo (at the game) gave man of the match to Gerrard, weird the way Setanta gave him man of the match and also strange how the match of the day commentators also said he deserved his goal.

All of which had something in common. They were there.

He produced some brilliant passes, he pressed the ball, made alot of runs and was generally everywhere on the pitch. He played an excellent pass through for which he couldn't even be arsed challenging for and was the only genuine attacking threat on the day.

You carry on following the opinions of Pundits, I myself have my own mind and Gerrard wasnt "superb" far from it. Its funny, like I said when Gerrard does have these blinding performances you're the first person to come on here and play down his performances. Then when he has an ordinary game you come on and say how superb he was, you're either very special and need the attention or you just forget how often you actually contradict yourself.

Sami Hyypia did play very well aswell, but he completely lost Santa Cruz for the goal and didn't even put a challenge in so for me was not man of the match, as for Xabi, that was probably his worst game of the season in productivety and alround play, all he done in the first half was get the ball 5 yards infront of the centre backs, give it to the centre backs or the goalkeeper and then hide. The second half he stepped it up alot but still wasn't fantastic.

Its funny how you pick up the fact the Hyypia was at fault for their goal, yet the whole fecking team fell asleep on their corner. How did he completely loose Santa Cruz if we are playing zonal defending anyway ?

by **Bam** » Tue Dec 09, 2008 1:42 pm

Fo Dne wrote:
Bam wrote:
I don't think our fellow newkitters are bored enough to look that old threads, so I won't bring those threads neither to prove wrong the masters of the art of backtracking. I couldn't care less at this point.

Here we go, misunderstanding the English language again. I am not backtracking, Alonso did play like a water carrier, Alonso is slow and does turn slower than the titanic. Just because the lad has finally found some discent form, it doesnt all of a sudden mean he's gained a shed load of pace from nowhere and turns on a six pence as quick as Torville & Dean.
No, like I said Alonso still has his weaknes's but this time around he's showing us his qualities.
What now seems the only mistake and half the newkitt board made was the fact about selling him. It does now look as though it would of been a mistake, but I'm admitting it not backtracking.

Alonso was never harshly critizised, you never said he was too slow for the PL, you were right about him, your criticism was sensible.

Yes I know I was right about him, he was critised and rightly so, why are you trying to backtrack for me and say that I never said he was too slow. He is slow and he hasnt gained pace all of a sudden.

But then again you're undying love for you're "humble Xabi" was over exagerated to the point where you're tried to claim he wasnt in a blip. Yet everyone including Benitez could see
he was.

You were right to say we should have accepted the Juventus offer for the money they offered, and you're right now.

No I was wrong, I can admit that its a shame you cant do the same thing in certain instances, but hey if you're not man enough .... By the way admitting I was wrong isnt backtracking.

The same people that were anti Rafa, you were right about it, calling those who defended the manager happy clappy in the best case. You told us the reality like it is. The likes of Tomkins were full of shíte.

You're mate Stu is calling him the clown now, but that doesnt bother you does it. Oh thats right you like consistency, even if it means being consistently wrong. Duh !

You were right about our lack of progress, you were right about the gap with Manchester United, and you were right to bring once and again comparisons with Ferguson. You also were right about Riera, infact, you were right about everything. You're also right now we're top of the table, because, needless to say, you were right about rotation.

Yes, again I was right I'll take that one thankyou very much. Riera though I dont know what you're on about tbph and I doubt you actually do.

Those of us who defended Alonso was a spanish international and a quality player, those of us who thought Rafa was making us progress were WRONG (note the caps), biased, and with unrealistic views. In three words, YOU WERE RIGHT

Feck me Emile Heskey is an international, dont go thinking every international is a great player, remember one Mark Gonzalez
The real progress has only been made obvious this season, rotation probably has something to do with that.

That still doesnt beat you're "Gerrard was superb" post :kungfu:

by **Fo Dne** » Tue Dec 09, 2008 1:55 pm

Bam wrote:

Thats probably because you was sitting in a completely different part of the world watching a completely different match.

That old chestnut hey, Oh and I suppose you was at the game, do me a favour. You're Newkitts very own Jimmy Hill.

Funny how Aldo (at the game) gave man of the match to Gerrard, weird the way Setanta gave him man of the match and also strange how the match of the day commentators also said he deserved his goal.

All of which had something in common. They were there.

He produced some brilliant passes, he pressed the ball, made alot of runs and was generally everywhere on the pitch. He played an excellent pass through for which he couldn't even be arsed challenging for and was the only genuine attacking threat on the day.

You carry on following the opinions of Pundits, I myself have my own mind and Gerrard wasnt "superb" far from it. Its funny, like I said when Gerrard does have these blinding performances you're the first person to come on here and play down his performances. Then when he has an ordinary game you come on and say how superb he was, you're either very special and need the attention or you just forget how often you actually contradict yourself.

Sami Hyypia did play very well aswell, but he completely lost Santa Cruz for the goal and didn't even put a challenge in so for me was not man of the match, as for Xabi, that was probably his worst game of the season in productivety and alround play, all he done in the first half was get the ball 5 yards infront of the centre backs, give it to the centre backs or the goalkeeper and then hide. The second half he stepped it up alot but still wasn't fantastic.

Its funny how you pick up the fact the Hyypia was at fault for their goal, yet the whole fecking team fell asleep on their corner. How did he completely loose Santa Cruz if we are playing zonal defending anyway ?

by **Bam** » Tue Dec 09, 2008 1:56 pm

Almost as funny as you logging on a day after Ciggy returns .....

Weirdo.

by **Fo Dne** » Tue Dec 09, 2008 1:56 pm

Bam wrote:Its funny how you pick up the fact the Hyypia was at fault for their goal, yet the whole fecking team fell asleep on their corner. How did he completely loose Santa Cruz if we are playing zonal defending anyway ?

Do you know what Zonal Marking is or how it works? No? Didn't think so.

by **Bam** » Tue Dec 09, 2008 1:57 pm

Fo Dne wrote:
Bam wrote:Its funny how you pick up the fact the Hyypia was at fault for their goal, yet the whole fecking team fell asleep on their corner. How did he completely loose Santa Cruz if we are playing zonal defending anyway ?

Do you know what Zonal Marking is or how it works? No? Didn't think so.

by **Fo Dne** » Tue Dec 09, 2008 1:58 pm

Bam wrote:Almost as funny as you logging on a day after Ciggy returns .....

Weirdo.

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