Liverpool FC Forum

by **DrPepe** » Thu Apr 23, 2009 3:12 pm

tonyeh wrote:
burjennio wrote:back 4 has to move in relation to the shape of the team! Im not having a pop but Im assuming you havnt played too many competitive football matches before, A team has to push up and down the pitch as a unit, whether its attacking or defending, if you dont you'd leave huge gaps of open field for the opposition to exploit and if they are of any standard your side would get creamed.

I'm not suggesting they stay rooted to the spot. Of course they have to move with the attack.

But we were caught seriously off guard the other night and Pepe had nobody in front of him.

once.

not really that criminal that our defenders got up the pitch when we were 3-3 and needed a goal to win the game and to stay in the hunt for the league title...

personally i think we'd be better off practising scoring from corners and killing off teams we dominate, rather than telling the defenders to put an extra man back :idea

by **Festy** » Fri Apr 24, 2009 5:51 am

heimdall wrote:
simolonge wrote:
heimdall wrote:Lets remember that in all likelihood January was the month we lost the prem and that was the month of the rant against Whiskey nose and the whole Keane debacle, how on earth can it be called a master stroke to leave yourself in a position where you are completely reliant on one player (who has had an injury plagued season), Torres.

Although Rafa has been everything right lately, and earning praise even from me, I'm still extremely off with him for hitting the self destruct button in January.

Dont take this the wrong way mate, but where the funk are you from ?

Can't see the relevance but I'm a Norwegian who has grown up in the UK.

There is relevance. A huge one. You have been talking bulshit in every fcking thread. You are behaving like a 'God of forums'/'Grandpa of all the forum members', who is under an illusion that every forum member is your grandchild and you have to teach everyone of them a lesson. Stop your nonsense and concentrate on relevant discussions. :veryangry

Anyways, back on topic. I still think that the decision to buy Robbie was a wise one because he was doing so well for Spurs. Selling him at the right time was also a wise decision. But not getting any replacement was not a wise decision at all. Who knows what difference that replacement player could have made.

by **bigmick** » Fri Apr 24, 2009 9:04 am

Gonna swim against the tide a bit here but I can't see anything wrong with what Heimdall posted. The topic starter asked a question, and Heimdall gave an opinion. Quite a lot of what he said I agree with, as I thought Keanegate was the main reason we will probably not win the title this season, but that is by the by.

I live in hope that one day people will accept everyone has a right to an opinion, and as it's a discussion forum, provided it's not offensive surely they are allowed to voice it?

Many people have already stated that selling keane was a masterstroke. I disagree with this, but where they come from is irrelevent, and i fully accept their right to hold such an opinion.

by **Judge** » Fri Apr 24, 2009 9:09 am

i agree with you mick, folk should leave heimdall alone. much of the stuff he posts is his opinion, just like others on here
in fact some of his stuff is better than the so-called poster posts etc etc. at least he tries to give a balanced argument, or what he thinks - isnt that what its all about??

by **bunglemark2** » Fri Apr 24, 2009 9:12 am

As ever, the voice of reason Bigmick....I think you should throw your CV in for a job as a middle eastern peace envoy

Nah, in all honesty, I think there's merit in both arguments. I wasn't behind the signing of Keane to start with, even if he is a fellow countryman. I've watched him a lot in person in Lansdowne Road and in Croke Park, and his attitude, petulance and lack of leadership skills (as captain) just make him the wrong person to depend on when you're in a fix.
I did hope however that joining a club he has supported as a boy would be the impetus he would require to step up his game to the next level, and I think we saw glimpses of it from time to time. Rafa's handling of the whole situation meant however that whatever Keane tried to do, he was always going to come off second best. So in the end, it WAS a wise decision to offload him.....
Not bringing in a replacement however was inexcusable, but then again, Rafa was so busy with his own feetstamping and putulant outbursts that I doubt he had the time or the support of the club to do so

by **Sabre** » Fri Apr 24, 2009 9:35 am

If the self destruct button was pressed, it was not in January, but in the summer, when we signed Keane.

It seems a case of a player who doesn't admit to fight for a place or be subbed. He wanted to fúck off.

The consequences of the mistake had an end in January, but the true mistake was to sign him up. I don't think a careful planner like Rafa wanted to get rid of Keane without a replacement, but he probably had not many options if the attitude of the player was so negative or incompatible.

We've paid dearly for it. Because, when Rafa signs up somebody for the position, it's because you have to fill some gap in that position. If the player you bring is not what you were seeking, then at the very least you've lost precious time.

by **simolonge** » Fri Apr 24, 2009 10:12 am

If we do not win the league it will be because over 38 games we where not the best team.

Its not won (or lost) in January, never has been and never will be.

by **SuppleMonkey** » Fri Apr 24, 2009 10:40 am

I don't think we can really catergorise selling Keane as a 'masterstroke' I agree with Hemidall somewhat that it was more a case of pressing the self destruct button in January. Although as its panned out it does not look as though the self destruct buttom was wired up to any C4. I think we have gotten away with the fact a replacment was not brought in, I don't think it has been that costly in all honesty.

by **GYBS** » Fri Apr 24, 2009 10:56 am

Cant see how it was self destruct - while keane was here there was nothing but negative stuff going on - on here , at the club, in the media on the stands and from the player himself . Selling him on a football sense was always a risk which in the end turned out to be not a bad choice as football wise it hasnt effected us one single bit and on a non football wise it was a good move as we didnt have to put up with the negative media circus that followed keane every day while at liverpool .

by **stmichael** » Fri Apr 24, 2009 12:14 pm

It's Rafa's one fundamental error this year imo, and one that was fully in his control. He signed a striker who we didn't need and did not improve the team one bit. He then spent too many games trying to accomodate him. That, and the Torres injury, is where the title was lost this season.

by **simolonge** » Fri Apr 24, 2009 12:35 pm

stmichael wrote:That, and the Torres injury, is where the title was lost this season.

You chucked in the towel then mate ?

by **Judge** » Fri Apr 24, 2009 12:38 pm

stmichael wrote:It's Rafa's one fundamental error this year imo, and one that was fully in his control. He signed a striker who we didn't need and did not improve the team one bit. He then spent too many games trying to accomodate him. That, and the Torres injury, is where the title was lost this season.

thats two fundamental errors, say what you mean stmick

by **GYBS** » Fri Apr 24, 2009 12:52 pm

stmichael wrote:It's Rafa's one fundamental error this year imo, and one that was fully in his control. He signed a striker who we didn't need and did not improve the team one bit. He then spent too many games trying to accomodate him. That, and the Torres injury, is where the title was lost this season. and on most occasions where man for man better than their opposition - they just didnt go and get it when it was needed . the whole team must take responsibility for that .

Im sorry but i dont agree - the keane signing and selling has nothing to do with us not winning the title this year (even thou we still can ). the team as whole didnt take their chances when they were then and that is something they must learn from . Yes torres being out and gerrard being out didnt help but we still took to the field every week with a line up more than capable of beating the opposition and on most

by **heimdall** » Fri Apr 24, 2009 12:52 pm

Judge wrote:
stmichael wrote:It's Rafa's one fundamental error this year imo, and one that was fully in his control. He signed a striker who we didn't need and did not improve the team one bit. He then spent too many games trying to accomodate him. That, and the Torres injury, is where the title was lost this season.

thats two fundamental errors, say what you mean stmick

Same error though, we have no backup striker.
Whichever way you look at it Rafa screwed up, either by signing him or by not treating him correctly and being forced to sell him in January. the truly criminal thing was not getting cover in January for Torres and No, Eggnog does not count.

by **GYBS** » Fri Apr 24, 2009 12:54 pm

heimdall wrote:
Judge wrote:
stmichael wrote:It's Rafa's one fundamental error this year imo, and one that was fully in his control. He signed a striker who we didn't need and did not improve the team one bit. He then spent too many games trying to accomodate him. That, and the Torres injury, is where the title was lost this season.

thats two fundamental errors, say what you mean stmick

Same error though, we have no backup striker.
Whichever way you look at it Rafa screwed up, either by signing him or by not treating him correctly and being forced to sell him in January. the truly criminal thing was not getting cover in January for Torres and No, Eggnog does not count.

keane wasnt good enough to be back up striker for torres anyway . and eggnog has managed to get himself on the score sheet quite a few times and getting no replacement has no effected us one single bit .

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