Liverpool FC Forum

by **GYBS** » Thu Jan 29, 2009 7:35 pm

well think that game was just a poor game mate . we have a lot of solid players - dependable but only really have gerrard or torres who can do something extra to create us something - especially when it comes down to breaking down 10 man brick walls .

by **devaney** » Thu Jan 29, 2009 9:16 pm

dawson99 wrote:
Effes wrote:
dawson99 wrote:
tonyeh wrote:
dawson99 wrote:
heimdall wrote:I notice that nobosy actually offered an explanation to my question of how rafa is a tactical genius, not htat anyone has ever answered that one.

Rafa is the most overrated manager in the world, he has little grasp of tactics, feck all knowledge of how to motivate, fecking useless at transfers and makes a pr1ck of himself in almost every press conference.

in short he needs to pick up his Sombrero and feck off, and if any players want to join him they are more than welcome too!!

Rafa picks the players(both interms of transfer and team sheet) and instructs them, so if they all play sh1t then it is of course down to him, stop making damned excuses for him!!

Look at the CL final where he brought on Didi to see a master tactitcian (ok, some said he should have always started it)

Rafa is football, he eats sleeps and drinks it. Slag off his decisions if you like, but to say he has no good tactics is naive.

As for thje sombrero talk, thought you were better than that mate

He changed a couple of guys around and got lucky in Istanbul, nothing more.

There were no tactics or strategies at play.

He's certainly been exposed this season as no tactician, especially where subs are concerned. Last night was absurd and so was the Everton game.

Some of our players may need to up their game, but it's Raphael Benitez that is in serious need of sitting down and reflecting on what HE is doing wrong this year...and change it.

Of course there were strategies, he changed to 3 at the back allowing Stevie to push further up the pitch as Didi and Alonso swept up the problems...

Finnan was injured at half time.. his hand was forced......
just thought I'd let you know.

not forced for the 3 at the back though, Rafa has a cool head, we gotta have faith

Rafa got lucky in Istanbul! What the fk was Kewell doing starting the game. The only useful thing he did was getting injured which allowed Vlad to come on and made a serious contribution. Finnan was injured and Didi came on. THIS WAS NOT THE WORK OF A MASTER TACTICIAN! Bayer Lev, Juve and Chelsea were very different and Rafa deserves a lot of credit for three very impressive performances and that's really where Liverpool won the CL. Let's face it Rafa's :censored:

ups in the early stages of the competiton left a lot to be desired and only a do or die effort, with Stevie G rallying the team got the result we needed against Olympiakos.

If Rafa is a tactical genius then why did he take Gerrard off. Why did he take Torres off again. If Rafa thought they were the worst two players on the pitch at the time of the substitutions he was watching a very different game to me - SAME STORY AS AGAINST EVERTON and now Rafa has a go at Bruce for Wigan's tactics in the same way as he had a go at Moyes. IS THIS MAN REALLY WORTH £25m OVER THE NEXT FIVE YEARS - MY ANSWER HAS TWO LETTERS !!!!!

by **teamleader1** » Thu Jan 29, 2009 9:39 pm

stmichael wrote:the substitutions once again were completely baffling last night. once again we ended up with our two biggest goal threats off the pitch. to say gerrard was "tired" is absolute garbage. what the hell is keane supposed to do in 7 minutes?

Maybe give soft lad Rafa an excuse to keep him out of the team for the next 4 games?

After all he never scored or made that much of an impression on the game compared to the outstanding contributions of Lucas & Babel :sniffle

Well thats how Rafa will read it! :veryangry

by **tonyeh** » Thu Jan 29, 2009 10:50 pm

GYBS wrote:but he still cant play every single game - we have plenty of big games coming up and players cant play every single game .

You just contradict for the sake of contradicting don't you.

Last night was a big match. Sunday is a big match. For these matches you should play your best team.

Lucas doesn't belong in that equasion.

This is a crucial phase, made all the more crucial by Benitez's nonsense. It's essential to play the best team available and not to drop points at this juncture, because if you do, it won't matter a jot which other big games are coming up.

by **GYBS** » Thu Jan 29, 2009 11:08 pm

devaney wrote:
dawson99 wrote:
Effes wrote:
dawson99 wrote:
tonyeh wrote:
dawson99 wrote:
heimdall wrote:I notice that nobosy actually offered an explanation to my question of how rafa is a tactical genius, not htat anyone has ever answered that one.

Rafa is the most overrated manager in the world, he has little grasp of tactics, feck all knowledge of how to motivate, fecking useless at transfers and makes a pr1ck of himself in almost every press conference.

in short he needs to pick up his Sombrero and feck off, and if any players want to join him they are more than welcome too!!

Rafa picks the players(both interms of transfer and team sheet) and instructs them, so if they all play sh1t then it is of course down to him, stop making damned excuses for him!!

Look at the CL final where he brought on Didi to see a master tactitcian (ok, some said he should have always started it)

Rafa is football, he eats sleeps and drinks it. Slag off his decisions if you like, but to say he has no good tactics is naive.

As for thje sombrero talk, thought you were better than that mate

He changed a couple of guys around and got lucky in Istanbul, nothing more.

There were no tactics or strategies at play.

He's certainly been exposed this season as no tactician, especially where subs are concerned. Last night was absurd and so was the Everton game.

Some of our players may need to up their game, but it's Raphael Benitez that is in serious need of sitting down and reflecting on what HE is doing wrong this year...and change it.

Of course there were strategies, he changed to 3 at the back allowing Stevie to push further up the pitch as Didi and Alonso swept up the problems...

Finnan was injured at half time.. his hand was forced......
just thought I'd let you know.

not forced for the 3 at the back though, Rafa has a cool head, we gotta have faith

Rafa got lucky in Istanbul! What the fk was Kewell doing starting the game. The only useful thing he did was getting injured which allowed Vlad to come on and made a serious contribution. Finnan was injured and Didi came on. THIS WAS NOT THE WORK OF A MASTER TACTICIAN! Bayer Lev, Juve and Chelsea were very different and Rafa deserves a lot of credit for three very impressive performances and that's really where Liverpool won the CL. Let's face it Rafa's ups in the early stages of the competiton left a lot to be desired and only a do or die effort, with Stevie G rallying the team got the result we needed against Olympiakos.

If Rafa is a tactical genius then why did he take Gerrard off. Why did he take Torres off again. If Rafa thought they were the worst two players on the pitch at the time of the substitutions he was watching a very different game to me - SAME STORY AS AGAINST EVERTON and now Rafa has a go at Bruce for Wigan's tactics in the same way as he had a go at Moyes. IS THIS MAN REALLY WORTH £25m OVER THE NEXT FIVE YEARS - MY ANSWER HAS TWO LETTERS !!!!!

so when we win its the players when we loose its rafa ?

Yes finnan got injured and he brought on didi but you do know he was going to bring off traore anyway - he only changed who was coming off - so even before finnan was injured he was changing tactics and that credit of the tactical change was given to him by both carra and gerrard .

by **redrover** » Fri Jan 30, 2009 12:43 am

do you remember me saying last week that if we keep this up we may end up fighting for 4th place and you responded with "over reaction of the year ". well now its a reality but sure you wont have anything said against your beloved rafa no matter how damning the evidence.

by **GYBS** » Fri Jan 30, 2009 12:45 am

well at the moment 4 teams are fighting for places 1-4 .

by **GYBS** » Fri Jan 30, 2009 12:46 am

and also as has been stated by ciggy earlier in another thread - why do people seem happy that they may have been proved right about any verdicts or damning opinions about players team or managers ?

by **heimdall** » Fri Jan 30, 2009 1:12 am

GYBS I have a question for you and its not a p1ss take I promise you.

What would it actually take for you to loose faith in Rafa or will it never happen no matter what he does?

I would love to have your optimism, it must be fantastic but i deal in facts and reality and I'm sory but Rafa is no good, especially in the league. Come the end of the season and we'll be scrapping it out for 4th again.

by **Leonmc0708** » Fri Jan 30, 2009 1:15 am

heimdall wrote:GYBS I have a question for you and its not a p1ss take I promise you.

What would it actually take for you to loose faith in Rafa or will it never happen no matter what he does?

I would love to have your optimism, it must be fantastic but i deal in facts and reality and I'm sory but Rafa is no good, especially in the league. Come the end of the season and we'll be scrapping it out for 4th again.

Gerrards substitution has made me think, think and think again about it.

But its made me question him, not lose faith.

The man has given me personally some of my greatest times supporting LFC, in some of the most amazing stadia on the planet.

I have faith in him, even if I question his thinking, ideas and decision making at times.

by **NANNY RED** » Fri Jan 30, 2009 1:23 am

Leonmc0708 wrote:
heimdall wrote:GYBS I have a question for you and its not a p1ss take I promise you.

What would it actually take for you to loose faith in Rafa or will it never happen no matter what he does?

I would love to have your optimism, it must be fantastic but i deal in facts and reality and I'm sory but Rafa is no good, especially in the league. Come the end of the season and we'll be scrapping it out for 4th again.

Gerrards substitution has made me think, think and think again about it.

But its made me question him, not lose faith.

The man has given me personally some of my greatest times supporting LFC, in some of the most amazing stadia on the planet.

I have faith in him, even if I question his thinking, ideas and decision making at times.

So eloquently put. if i say so meself, Same convo i had with a lad at the game last night

by **bigmick** » Fri Jan 30, 2009 1:32 am

And faith is great. Another thing which should be considered is that just because none of the fans can understand a decision, it doesn't necessarily mean it was wrong. Nobody I don't think could understand Gerrard coming off, but it doesn't mean per se that it's wrong. It's a reasonable assumption that the manager knows more about football than us lot, so if I really believed in him I wouldn't be throwing the towel in after the Wigan game either.

When you really look at it, nothing was all that new. He heavily rotated but it was hardly the first time. He left out two of our best players this season, but once again ditto. We didn't set up attacking, or did we really go in for the kill at 1-0, but that's how Rafa plays it. The subs were seemingly off the wall, but once again etc etc. If you have faith and you believe then obviously you hope that there is method in the apparent madness, method which although you can't fathom is tangible.

I used to believe there was method, and although I didn't agree with it I felt I could understand the gradual building process. The last eighteen months I'm not so sure. The signings, the set ups, the treatment of players, the rants and the demeanour are the ones of a man who has lost the thread for me. There is a grapeshot look of somebody who is chancing their arm. I still don't agree with the methodology, but I don't even think it is followed through properly now.

Unless there really is a rafalution between now and the end of the season, it's time for the golden handshake and thanks very much.

by **GYBS** » Fri Jan 30, 2009 1:48 am

heimdall wrote:GYBS I have a question for you and its not a p1ss take I promise you.

What would it actually take for you to loose faith in Rafa or will it never happen no matter what he does?

I would love to have your optimism, it must be fantastic but i deal in facts and reality and I'm sory but Rafa is no good, especially in the league. Come the end of the season and we'll be scrapping it out for 4th again.

Leon has got the answer spot on - one thing i learnt from my uncle growing up with him going to matches is always to have faith in the team and manager no matter what - that doesnt mean you cant question what is going on and why is the manager doing this that or the other but will still have faith - that has never wavered in 20 odd years and it wont .

by **Emerald Red** » Fri Jan 30, 2009 2:24 am

I turned my stream off after the pen was given. I never seen the Gerrard sub. But a mate told me that Keane came onto the pitch and was gesturing to the players to get a grip and encouraging them to get a winner. Now, here's my question: Steven Gerrard, as amazing a player that he is, does the talking with his football, but shouldn't he be doing this with the players and not Keane? It's great that you summon God-like powers and influence for big finals, Steve; but games like this in the league should be treated the same.

by **LegBarnes** » Fri Jan 30, 2009 3:02 am

bigmick wrote:And faith is great. Another thing which should be considered is that just because none of the fans can understand a decision, it doesn't necessarily mean it was wrong. Nobody I don't think could understand Gerrard coming off, but it doesn't mean per se that it's wrong. It's a reasonable assumption that the manager knows more about football than us lot, so if I really believed in him I wouldn't be throwing the towel in after the Wigan game either.

When you really look at it, nothing was all that new. He heavily rotated but it was hardly the first time. He left out two of our best players this season, but once again ditto. We didn't set up attacking, or did we really go in for the kill at 1-0, but that's how Rafa plays it. The subs were seemingly off the wall, but once again etc etc. If you have faith and you believe then obviously you hope that there is method in the apparent madness, method which although you can't fathom is tangible.

I used to believe there was method, and although I didn't agree with it I felt I could understand the gradual building process. The last eighteen months I'm not so sure. The signings, the set ups, the treatment of players, the rants and the demeanour are the ones of a man who has lost the thread for me. There is a grapeshot look of somebody who is chancing their arm. I still don't agree with the methodology, but I don't even think it is followed through properly now.

Unless there really is a rafalution between now and the end of the season, it's time for the golden handshake and thanks very much.

Hang on faith rafa is now god ?

I thought robbie was only god at liverpool ?

:love:

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