Liverpool FC Forum

by **Bad Bob** » Wed Jun 18, 2008 11:57 am

Bamaga man wrote:As you say he is playing for the best national team in Europe. I havent watched his performances in europe, but are they much better than his performances for Liverpool ?

I'd say that his performances for Holland have been about on par with the way Kuyt played against Arsenal and Chelsea in the CL. He's all action, as ever, but importantly he's causing defenders problems going forward, is creating goals for teammates and has scored a fine one himself. He definitely looks a Liverpool squad player at least now but, like many, I wouldn't hesitate to sell if the right offer came in.

by **66-1112520797** » Wed Jun 18, 2008 12:21 pm

Bad Bob wrote:
Bamaga man wrote:As you say he is playing for the best national team in Europe. I havent watched his performances in europe, but are they much better than his performances for Liverpool ?

I'd say that his performances for Holland have been about on par with the way Kuyt played against Arsenal and Chelsea in the CL. He's all action, as ever, but importantly he's causing defenders problems going forward, is creating goals for teammates and has scored a fine one himself. He definitely looks a Liverpool squad player at least now but, like many, I wouldn't hesitate to sell if the right offer came in.

I know S@int said he'd take someones arm off if they offered 7 million for him. Personally I'd hold out for more and think the Euro championship would only inflate his price.

He is a good squad player and one you cannot imagine would whinge and make it publicly known at his dissapointment at being on the bench, he has the right character IMO. So in that respect he would be useful, but for me personally if an offer came in for around 12 M I'd have to consider it.

I gave him a lot of stick last season for not producing the goals, and equally Rafa to for persisting with him for so long upfront with FA to show for it. But if Rafa cannot get anyone in, in the summer for the RW I'd be hppy to see Kuyt start there ahead of Benayoun and Pennant I think hes deserved it, although like S@int said not the ideal long term solution for a title winning side.

by **Owzat** » Wed Jun 18, 2008 12:30 pm

If we were offered £7m I'd turn it down, he's now shown he can play RM as well as his normal role of striker ie he's versatile. And since we have nowt else bar Gerrard fir to play RM we either fork out for two RMs or keep Kuyt and sign just the one.

Now if someone offered £7m for Jermaine "no need for a new RM" Pennant then I'd have them legally bound to it before they'd pronounced the t in Pennant. What Kuyt has brought to the RM is a player who can score, control the ball, cross, tackle and work hard as well as occaisionally get past his man. I'd certainly like to minimise personnel changes while appreciating that some of our players aren't good enough. Riise, Crouch, Pennant and one or two others could leave IN MY OPINION as they're surplus to requirements and to raise funds. The major concern for me is the attempts to sign Barny which has become a ridiculous saga that Rafa should have ended before it got to £12m. villa fans are so deluded they think Young has proved he was worth near £10m when signed and O'Squeall will wave his magic wand and make Sidwell class

by **Torres25** » Wed Jun 18, 2008 12:35 pm

Young is worth 12 million hes a brilliant young player who is already 1 of the best dead ball delivers in the prem can beat players & chip in with goals

by **JBG** » Wed Jun 18, 2008 12:57 pm

Kuyt seems to be regaining some form, his performances for Holland are far better in Euro 2008 than those he put in for them at WC 2006.

Kuyt has some noticeable weaknesses - lack of pace and skill - but his attitude has always been exemplary and if he recovers his confidence he can be a good squad player for us over the next couple of seasons (although I expect him to continue playing regularly at right wing until such time as we sign a truly top class winger).

by **Toffeehater** » Wed Jun 18, 2008 9:19 pm

SundanceKid wrote:
Toffeehater wrote:Kuyt is not a natural winger clearly , he is a striker who has been converted into playing in the right wing area . He has done good since moving that the postion , 11 goals in total for the season , with 7 assist in the premier league and not too sure about the champions league , plus he adds that little something extra that you don't normally get from players in that position , excellent work rate and attitude , if we don't sign a right winger this season , i think kuyt has earned at least 1 more season in that role before we decide if he has done good or bad and deserves to be sold or is a squad player at best or one to start in the 11

He's a striker that was converted to play the wing area? Come on, I think we've all noticed that. But he his a natural winger, he's got the talent and qualities for it. He doesn't have the homosexual flair that certain other wingers have, but he's still a top quality wing player

He is NOT a natural winger , Hee does not do fancy skills , can't dribble that well , look at proper wingers like quaresma , ronaldo , robben , silva just to name a few . He has done well on the wing but he is not a natural winger . His crossing and goal ratio is decent from the wing and his work rate is brilliant

by **Toffeehater** » Wed Jun 18, 2008 9:24 pm

Ian Rush's Right foot wrote:he is playing well but in a good team, playing expansive fast flowing predominatly counter attacking football

and yes his confidence is sky high,

as for being in "the form of his ife" i don't think so, as in the dutch league he was devestating

I firmly believe that his good showing in the euro's is the result of a good second half of the season for us.

I mean would Van Bastan have picked him to play in that position at all if he hadn't played there & done well for us?

He's also keeping some good dutch players out of the team.

Finally i think it may have been touched on earlier but....

FACT - if he didn't play for us then those fans who have seen his performances in the euro's would be clammering to heap praise and want to sign him (as in the current hype aound the slightly Overated lightweight David Villa)

agree on everything except the part on david villa , he is not over rated or anything , his finishing is superb and he will pounce on any mistake from the defence

by **LFC2007** » Wed Jun 18, 2008 10:20 pm

Bad Bob wrote:
Bamaga man wrote:As you say he is playing for the best national team in Europe. I havent watched his performances in europe, but are they much better than his performances for Liverpool ?

I'd say that his performances for Holland have been about on par with the way Kuyt played against Arsenal and Chelsea in the CL. He's all action, as ever, but importantly he's causing defenders problems going forward, is creating goals for teammates and has scored a fine one himself. He definitely looks a Liverpool squad player at least now but, like many, I wouldn't hesitate to sell if the right offer came in.

by **SundanceKid** » Wed Jun 18, 2008 10:21 pm

Toffeehater wrote:
SundanceKid wrote:
Toffeehater wrote:Kuyt is not a natural winger clearly , he is a striker who has been converted into playing in the right wing area . He has done good since moving that the postion , 11 goals in total for the season , with 7 assist in the premier league and not too sure about the champions league , plus he adds that little something extra that you don't normally get from players in that position , excellent work rate and attitude , if we don't sign a right winger this season , i think kuyt has earned at least 1 more season in that role before we decide if he has done good or bad and deserves to be sold or is a squad player at best or one to start in the 11

He's a striker that was converted to play the wing area? Come on, I think we've all noticed that. But he his a natural winger, he's got the talent and qualities for it. He doesn't have the homosexual flair that certain other wingers have, but he's still a top quality wing player

He is NOT a natural winger , Hee does not do fancy skills , can't dribble that well , look at proper wingers like quaresma , ronaldo , robben , silva just to name a few . He has done well on the wing but he is not a natural winger . His crossing and goal ratio is decent from the wing and his work rate is brilliant

If you are playing wing and you get the job done, and add a little bit more to affect the game. You're a damn good winger. The fact that he does this when spontaneously being assigned as the winger, makes him a natural. All the footwork is for players who are either not aggressive enough to get through or need to change plans while running. Kuyt usually knows what he's going to do the minute he gets the ball so I don't see why he needs to dance like Cristiana

by **SundanceKid** » Wed Jun 18, 2008 10:27 pm

Bad Bob wrote:
Bamaga man wrote:As you say he is playing for the best national team in Europe. I havent watched his performances in europe, but are they much better than his performances for Liverpool ?

I'd say that his performances for Holland have been about on par with the way Kuyt played against Arsenal and Chelsea in the CL. He's all action, as ever, but importantly he's causing defenders problems going forward, is creating goals for teammates and has scored a fine one himself. He definitely looks a Liverpool squad player at least now but, like many, I wouldn't hesitate to sell if the right offer came in.

I agreed with everything till the last sentence. You'd sell him? You can't just expect him to shine right away. I have no clue what's going to turn out of him, but you've got to remember that he doesn't have difficulties scoring in the most important games.

by **Bad Bob** » Thu Jun 19, 2008 1:30 am

SundanceKid wrote:
Toffeehater wrote:
SundanceKid wrote:
Toffeehater wrote:Kuyt is not a natural winger clearly , he is a striker who has been converted into playing in the right wing area . He has done good since moving that the postion , 11 goals in total for the season , with 7 assist in the premier league and not too sure about the champions league , plus he adds that little something extra that you don't normally get from players in that position , excellent work rate and attitude , if we don't sign a right winger this season , i think kuyt has earned at least 1 more season in that role before we decide if he has done good or bad and deserves to be sold or is a squad player at best or one to start in the 11

He's a striker that was converted to play the wing area? Come on, I think we've all noticed that. But he his a natural winger, he's got the talent and qualities for it. He doesn't have the homosexual flair that certain other wingers have, but he's still a top quality wing player

He is NOT a natural winger , Hee does not do fancy skills , can't dribble that well , look at proper wingers like quaresma , ronaldo , robben , silva just to name a few . He has done well on the wing but he is not a natural winger . His crossing and goal ratio is decent from the wing and his work rate is brilliant

If you are playing wing and you get the job done, and add a little bit more to affect the game. You're a damn good winger. The fact that he does this when spontaneously being assigned as the winger, makes him a natural. All the footwork is for players who are either not aggressive enough to get through or need to change plans while running. Kuyt usually knows what he's going to do the minute he gets the ball so I don't see why he needs to dance like Cristiana

by **Bad Bob** » Thu Jun 19, 2008 1:34 am

SundanceKid wrote:
Bad Bob wrote:
Bamaga man wrote:As you say he is playing for the best national team in Europe. I havent watched his performances in europe, but are they much better than his performances for Liverpool ?

I'd say that his performances for Holland have been about on par with the way Kuyt played against Arsenal and Chelsea in the CL. He's all action, as ever, but importantly he's causing defenders problems going forward, is creating goals for teammates and has scored a fine one himself. He definitely looks a Liverpool squad player at least now but, like many, I wouldn't hesitate to sell if the right offer came in.

I agreed with everything till the last sentence. You'd sell him? You can't just expect him to shine right away. I have no clue what's going to turn out of him, but you've got to remember that he doesn't have difficulties scoring in the most important games.

Steady on, lad. He's solid, not a world beater. He can do a job in a couple of positions--without being anywhere near spectacular in either--and he's a model professional so I'm happy to keep him in the squad. But I'd have no hesitation to sell him if someone were to offer us upwards of 8 million pounds because, after watching him for two seasons, I'm confident I've seen enough to say he'll never suddenly turn into a top drawer player that we'd regret letting slip through our fingers.

by **bigmick** » Thu Jun 19, 2008 3:33 am

Totally agree Bob. FWIW I previously valued him at 3 million and got hauled in by the militia for my cheek. I was lucky to escape alive once they spotted that I'd also said Alonso was worth early teens.

I maybe a man of principal and all that old b0ll0cks, but I've also got this self preservationist streak running through me as well. So once a couple of the Zanu PF put a gun to me head and said "go on, mention rotation one more time you feckface and you're dead" I changed my tune just in time. Alonso I'd now take low TO MID teens for, and after his hugely impressive performances in the Euro's Kuyts valuation has shot up to seven million. Euros of course

by **SundanceKid** » Thu Jun 19, 2008 6:25 am

Bad Bob wrote:
SundanceKid wrote:
Bad Bob wrote:
Bamaga man wrote:As you say he is playing for the best national team in Europe. I havent watched his performances in europe, but are they much better than his performances for Liverpool ?

I'd say that his performances for Holland have been about on par with the way Kuyt played against Arsenal and Chelsea in the CL. He's all action, as ever, but importantly he's causing defenders problems going forward, is creating goals for teammates and has scored a fine one himself. He definitely looks a Liverpool squad player at least now but, like many, I wouldn't hesitate to sell if the right offer came in.

I agreed with everything till the last sentence. You'd sell him? You can't just expect him to shine right away. I have no clue what's going to turn out of him, but you've got to remember that he doesn't have difficulties scoring in the most important games.

Steady on, lad. He's solid, not a world beater. He can do a job in a couple of positions--without being anywhere near spectacular in either--and he's a model professional so I'm happy to keep him in the squad. But I'd have no hesitation to sell him if someone were to offer us upwards of 8 million pounds because, after watching him for two seasons, I'm confident I've seen enough to say he'll never suddenly turn into a top drawer player that we'd regret letting slip through our fingers.

Well then I somewhat agree. I couldn't see him getting any bigger than he is now with any other club.

by **stmichael** » Thu Jun 19, 2008 11:56 am

JBG wrote:Kuyt seems to be regaining some form, his performances for Holland are far better in Euro 2008 than those he put in for them at WC 2006.

Kuyt has some noticeable weaknesses - lack of pace and skill - but his attitude has always been exemplary and if he recovers his confidence he can be a good squad player for us over the next couple of seasons (although I expect him to continue playing regularly at right wing until such time as we sign a truly top class winger).

I'd agree with that.

He was undoubtedly ONE of our better players in the 2nd half of the season, but lets be honest he had the time to do it as Rafa kept alot of faith in him. It has to be said that other managers probably wouldnt have given him the same amount of time. He certainly had more of an opportunity than Pennant or Benayoun anyway, so we'll never know if either of them could have improved in the way that he did if they were given as much "match time". Certainly when Pennant started playing more towards the end of the season he was outstanding.

I respect him greatly for over coming his fathers death and actually raising his performances (which he's still doing in the euro'), but as you say he will never be technically gifted enough with the ability to be the player we need on the wing. We need cutting edge, cut throat attacking players, who dont make "bad choices" when they have the ball at their feet....and im afraid to say Dirk will more than often make bad choices when in possesion. That's not to say I think we should get rid though. He's still an extremely valuable asset imo.

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