Liverpool FC Forum

by **akumaface** » Wed Jul 28, 2004 7:03 pm

I don't know how to describe Murphy but he looks to me as a very confident person that don't seem to care what others think of him. I like his competitiveness and poise. He seems very strong mentally simply from the way he takes the penalty kick. As many of you had pointed out, he is a very intelligent player but lacking consistency. To be fair, not many LFC players played consistantly over the last couple of seasons. So, we can't blame it on one person. I believed that if only one player being inconsistant, that may be an isolated problem but when most of the team not playing consistantly, I think that maybe more of a coaching problem.

by **115-1073096938** » Wed Jul 28, 2004 7:05 pm

Greece will never be a world class team playing like that. we were successful very briefly when we played like that, but faded very soon. that type of play goes stale.

i'm talking about "great" teams stu. great teams. of course there are always exceptions to the rule like Greece, but they will never win anything ever again, neither will Latvia.

if you'd be happy playing like Greece then thats your preference. if you remember, we used to play like that, and look what happened. it wares off. teams like arsehead and the mancs never win things by playing like that, and thats why they continue to be good teams.
murphy would never get into teams like the ones i mean, he would get into the teams you go on about, but they are not great/championship winning teams.

That type of play doesn't go stale at all. That type of play relies upon the right players and the attitude. Guess what lad... the same goes for every system in the world. You play to your strengths and it improves your chances of success. Look at Real Madrid for gods sake. They play the most open game in world football and attack all the time. It doesn't make you a great side. You have to have a mix and theres nothing wrong with being better defensively than going forward.

Great teams? Listen lad. Italy... Beat that... all the italian clubs, they've ALWAYS played "defensive" football... Lad... Football is about playing to your strengths. If you have a team of slow players you don't make them race other players by playing long passes. Its all about playing the right way. That is the way that best suits your players. If thats one touch so be it, if thats 10 men behind the ball, so be it.

If Liverpool tried to play Arsenal or Madrid at there own game, they'd get goosed. They would probably lose by about 4 or 5.

The reason Brazil are the most successful nation and play attacking football is because thats their strength. Thats what they are good at. Can you imagine Brazil trying to take on England in a physical battle? The reason Italy are the most successful europian team is because they played to there strengths.

by **LFC #1** » Thu Jul 29, 2004 7:25 am

agree Stu 100%, That's how u win games play to your strenghths and try to take advantage of weaknesses in the other team.

If someone asked me what would you rather see? attacking LFC side who is entertaining but don't win ******, or a well structured side who grind out results and play to their strengths, and win major honours, I know what i would pick, I think it is pretty obvoius, win the titles however you can.

by **begintoend** » Thu Jul 29, 2004 7:34 am

Yes. All of ya has a point.

Winning is all that matters. If the team plays a strategy knowing that they can control their opponent, ultimately winning will not be an issue.

Attacking football does not always produce winning football. Though I admit that the percentage is higher.

All we need to know is the opponents weakness and use our strengths to exploit that. That's playing to the team's strength. All players have a role and must be discipline to carry out their task. Be it attacking or defensive style, winning 1-0 or 7-0, winning is all that matters.

by **115-1073096938** » Thu Jul 29, 2004 10:08 am

Steven Gerrard's role...

Protect the back 4, drive forward and get into the box at every oppurtunity, shoot occassionally, carry the ball, play long and short passe and start moves from a deep position and generally try to control matches.

Harry Kewell, run with the blal out wide and try and supply crosses from the byline and inside the box, be more unselfish and get in the box more.

Owen, use pace and movement to get in behind defences, also drift wide and run at opponents. To in effective coming deep although often plays the right ball would much rather see him in wide positions comin into the middle of the pitch and making runs from there.

The key is to use Gerrards alround ability, Hyypia's defensive class, Kewell's wing pay and Owen's pace and alround ability in the bestt system. Do that and you won't go far wrong.

by **banana** » Thu Jul 29, 2004 10:50 am

Wake up Stu. You claim Murphy is no worse than Ljungberg? Where have you been the last 5 years? Ljungberg has scored 10+ goals every season since he came to arsenal. He has won bags of throphies. He is extremely hard working. Always running up and down tearing the opposition apart with his strenght and stamina. He likes to make deep runs, getting into dangerous positions which is the reason behind his impressive goal scoring record. He is also an excellent defender, tackling and dispossesing other players. He is an established international and one of sweden's finest footballers. Together with Ibrahimovich and Henke Larsson he forms a deadly trio.

Murphy's goals usually comes from penalty kicks or long shots/free kicks. He usually strolls around the centre of the park. If football was all about passing the ball, converting penalties and shooting, I'd reckon he be a good player. But there is strenght, stamina, heading, determination, balance, flair, tackling. All missing in Murphy's repertoaire. He makes no deep runs, can't go past defenders. His work rate is ok, but he never tackles or steals the ball from the opposition because his pace and strenght always lets him down. Murphy plays well against the lesser teams, but when the opposition is tough he goes missing. He has never made it on the international stage.

by **whylongball?** » Thu Jul 29, 2004 12:33 pm

stu_the_red, very accurate with ur comments!

D.M will play a lot better if he improves his fitness, and become excellent if he can shoot like Scholes(very much like Scholes but not as good).I think his through balls will help Cisse & co. score a lot of goals this season if he can fight for his place.

by **115-1073096938** » Thu Jul 29, 2004 5:36 pm

Banana, don't speak to me lad, your comments just wind me up. Some of the stuff you say has no foundation or even truth in it and you are blinded by your hatred of some our players. Murphy and Owen are the sort of players this club needs to move forward and you consistently slag them off... i'm sorry lad, but i'm not the one who needs to wake up, its you. Benitez, Evans, Eriksson, Thompson and Houllier aren't all wrong. What makes you think you have more knowledge or are a better judge of player than any of these?

Ljungberg is quick, makes great runs, has good stamina and works really hard. Thats it. He certainly doesn't tear defences to pieces and i'm sorry but he's not an excellent defender.

Murphy is a better passer, sets more goals up, has more game intelligence, better from set pieces, has good vision and technique and works just as hard. Both are pretty similar in terms of ability. Ljungberg wouldn't make us a better team in the same way someone like Pires or Vieira would. He probably is SLIGHTLY better than Murphy, but not by much.

Him and Lampard are very overated players.

by **begintoend** » Fri Jul 30, 2004 4:43 am

Murphy is a good player. That's all.

Murphy is the better passer, has more game intelligence, better from set pieces, has good vision and technique. But his lack of pace irks me. He packs less aggression in challenges.

Ljungberg is not highly rated though. He is an important player in Wenger's plans. Still he makes good runs into the box, passes well, shoots well and covers the strikers in their positions. Overall, Ljungberg edges out Murphy as a better midfield.

Murphy at most is a good squad player. Now that Smicer is injured, I see Murphy to feature more in Benitez plans.

by **jim_morrison_supported_liverpool** » Sun Aug 01, 2004 5:54 pm

stu_the_red wrote:
Greece will never be a world class team playing like that. we were successful very briefly when we played like that, but faded very soon. that type of play goes stale.

i'm talking about "great" teams stu. great teams. of course there are always exceptions to the rule like Greece, but they will never win anything ever again, neither will Latvia.

if you'd be happy playing like Greece then thats your preference. if you remember, we used to play like that, and look what happened. it wares off. teams like arsehead and the mancs never win things by playing like that, and thats why they continue to be good teams.
murphy would never get into teams like the ones i mean, he would get into the teams you go on about, but they are not great/championship winning teams.

That type of play doesn't go stale at all. That type of play relies upon the right players and the attitude. Guess what lad... the same goes for every system in the world. You play to your strengths and it improves your chances of success. Look at Real Madrid for gods sake. They play the most open game in world football and attack all the time. It doesn't make you a great side. You have to have a mix and theres nothing wrong with being better defensively than going forward.

Great teams? Listen lad. Italy... Beat that... all the italian clubs, they've ALWAYS played "defensive" football... Lad... Football is about playing to your strengths. If you have a team of slow players you don't make them race other players by playing long passes. Its all about playing the right way. That is the way that best suits your players. If thats one touch so be it, if thats 10 men behind the ball, so be it.

If Liverpool tried to play Arsenal or Madrid at there own game, they'd get goosed. They would probably lose by about 4 or 5.

The reason Brazil are the most successful nation and play attacking football is because thats their strength. Thats what they are good at. Can you imagine Brazil trying to take on England in a physical battle? The reason Italy are the most successful europian team is because they played to there strengths.

stu, that type of play does go stale.
in the case of greece and liverpool, i t wasnt a case of the manager playing to his streghths, Houllier in particular actually built the team like this, cos he thought thats how a team should play, that was his philosophy, and guess what?
i dont agree. teams should never be built like that. teams should only be built like that when, as you say, that is its existing strengths. we didnt have to turn into this defensive team. he had enough bank balance to build any team system
he wanted.
i'll say it again. teams like that dont work, especially in the prem. the italian teams had flair and skill also. german teams had technique etc. teams like Houllier's liverpool will ALWAYS GO STALE COS THERE IS NO VARIABLES. you need to be able to adapt to a few different ways of playing or you get sussed out. this is what happened to Liverpool. it is so obvious stu.

by **jim_morrison_supported_liverpool** » Sun Aug 01, 2004 6:03 pm

oh yeah, and where's all the "italian" world cups and european victories, club and international. on the world stage italy are like houlliers liverpool at club level. always thereabouts but no silverware (recently). and ac milan were not defensive when they won the european cup.
you actually prove yourself wrong by saying "italian teams always play defensively" then you say "you should play to your strengths". are you saying that italians are genetically born to play defensive football, so the temas are always like that??? dont be so silly. you choose to play the way you want cos its the philosophy you believe in. if you were correct then these italian teams would churn oout different systems all the time, as they would be "playing to their strengths" (as different types of players come along).

bloody hell stu all this just to defend murphy and houlliers regime.

by **barnesrush** » Thu Aug 05, 2004 2:13 pm

its not genetic but some countries produce types of players with certain characteristics. take brazil for example. one reason you could give for them playing such skillful football is the training methods alot of the kids are put through involve using smaller balls to improve touch.

dont know what methods the italians use but generally they have very strong defensive units and are often quite dirty with it which may be a national trait or may be cos they are taught to be from an early age

by **jim_morrison_supported_liverpool** » Thu Aug 05, 2004 4:35 pm

italians are paranoid about football results becoz of media and fans' pressure. they still choose to play like this.

by **woof woof !** » Thu Aug 05, 2004 7:44 pm

I don't go along with this "Italians play defensive football " line . Sure ,5-10 years ago if you checked the Italian league results there was hardy ever more than 3 goals scored in a game, week in week out. But IMO there has been a dramatic change in Italian footy in recent years. Sure ,they are quick to close up shop when threatend but given the sniff of an opportunity they are not slow in getting forward
in numbers. The siege mentality of "a draw will do " has been replaced by a much more aggressive counter attacking policy , and if that exposes a weakness in the opposition they will press on.

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