Liverpool FC Forum

by **Sabre** » Thu Mar 06, 2008 11:04 pm

bigmick wrote:He's a fabulous footballer and no mistake. Sabre had his doubts but to be fair he wasn't on his own, I had grave reservations myself when you looked at the size of the fee and his stats in Spain. There was much debate before he signed and TBPH, I would definately have erred on the side of not spending the money. I guess thats why I run a sex shop etc etc (doesn't sound as impressive as a computer scientist but it's the best I can do I'm afraid).

Cheers for that comment. Maybe computer scientist sounds impressive but it's just the way we're called here. I'm a humble worker by all accounts

I'll confess what was behind my comments back then. It had nothing to do with him playing for an archenemy, he always seemed an ok lad to be honest.

Back then I felt we needed an out and out striker, what we were looking for, the so called 20+ goal striker. At the same time I saw people very excited with Torres. I feared to see yet another Morientes case and I preffered to chill down people and perhaps chosed to highlight his flaws and ignore the bright side.

His numbers were not that good in here. For instance, he's now making hat tricks with some ease, right? we all see and love that. Well, do you know how many hat tricks he did before Liverpool? One. Against San Marino, with Spain. He never managed to do that in Atletico, he got 13-16 goals a season, and quite a lot of them were penalties.

And lastly, I saw that Atletico, a big club, mind you, the third of Spain, tried to build a team around Torres and never quite managed to reach UEFA competition. So, could he be the the world class striker Liverpool needed? it wasn't easy, and I had seen failing one of my fav strikers in that task (Morientes).

My point? I was completely WRONG. *But* I made my assessment not due to stupid prejudices for being Atletico, but for the reasons mentioned. I tried to give my honest view.

At least this time I feel great for the lad and the club, so I can live with the jokes of the forum members

.

by **redtrader74** » Thu Mar 06, 2008 11:12 pm

Also Sabre, had you tried to say anything positive i'm sure you'd have been given stick for being Spanish eh? :;):

by **Sabre** » Thu Mar 06, 2008 11:15 pm

Also Sabre, had you tried to say anything positive i'm sure you'd have been given stick for being Spanish eh?

Chico listo.

Means clever lad.

by **redtrader74** » Fri Mar 07, 2008 12:05 am

sé que soy
:laugh:

by **bigmick** » Fri Mar 07, 2008 12:28 am

It's mucho b0ll0cks Red

. No seriously though, most people who have expressed doubts about Rafa's methodology, in fact the absolutely overwhelming majority couldn't give a feck where he's from just so long as he "picks his best team" more consistently. OK so Sabes was wrong about Torres, and Morientes, and Gonzales etc, so by the law of averages sooner or later he's gonna call one right. It could be that rotation is that "sooner or later" you never know

It could be worse of course, he could have tipped up Robert Earnshaw or liked Pelligrino, or indeed mused about the possibility of Kuyt or Sissoko becoming a legend at Anfield :laugh:

I know a certain somebody probably still reads this place as well so I'll try and provoke a PM from him, he could have said Dean Ashton was destined for greatness also

by **god_bless_john_houlding** » Fri Mar 07, 2008 12:58 am

I think Torres has benifited from Gerrard greatly this season, it's meant that the goal tally hasn't rested solely on Torres' shoulders. I also think Torres has benifited from being partnered with Kuyt a great deal, because it's meant Torres doesn't have to do the tracking back and he can concentrate on scoring. The same with when he's played with Crouch. With Crouch, Torres hasn't be the focus for the first ball so he can take up positions for goalscoring positions.

His goal tally and performances are little short of magical, but the rest of side need their credit aswell for his performances. Just another great number 9 for the Liverpool fans to admire.

by **Sabre** » Fri Mar 07, 2008 1:07 am

bigmick wrote:It's mucho b0ll0cks Red . No seriously though, most people who have expressed doubts about Rafa's methodology, in fact the absolutely overwhelming majority couldn't give a feck where he's from just so long as he "picks his best team" more consistently. OK so Sabes was wrong about Torres, and Morientes, and Gonzales etc, so by the law of averages sooner or later he's gonna call one right.

It didn't hurt the Gonzalez, nor the Morientes, nor the Torres. It's all true.

But the "etc" was extremely insulting.

Mind you, despite not being remembered because it's irrelevant, my predictions on Xabi's brothers failure and how Garrido would end up in Man City's bench, plus my optimism on Xabi Alonso, proves that when it comes to prediction of local Spanish lads in England, I'm as reliable as tossing a coin to the air

. So it's unfair to say I get everything wrong

Managers get players wrong, and of course so we do! We could revisit Kuyt's I know it's early thread for instance :rasp

Or although it seems unbelievable now, we could see that many posters had a lot of doubts on Reina even after his second season, which is even worse than failing to predict how will do someone in a new club.

As for Rafa's criticism, and leaving a comment out of context aside, I've always defended the right to express criticism about the methodology, provided that words like "clown" and "clueless twát" are not used to express the doubts.

by **Kukilon** » Fri Mar 07, 2008 12:48 pm

I had huge doubts about Torres and so did lots of others in here. I think Torres benefitted from this by not having extreme preassure on him in the beginning.

by **Sabre** » Fri Mar 07, 2008 1:08 pm

Aguirre, Torres' former coach says today that he's very happy for Torres and it has been not a surprise for him.

In his opinion, his better performance is not due to luck. In Aguirre's opinion "there are level headed and strong personality characters in Liverpool like Gerrard, Carraguer and Rafa and Torres doesn't have to bear with all the pressure any more, he can rely on those men aswell"." In Atletico he coudn't eat an ice cream without being bothered", Aguirre explains.

"I saw him recently and could hug Fernando. I saw him changed, confident, and really enjoying the experience" he described.

by **woof woof !** » Fri Mar 07, 2008 5:59 pm

Fernando Towers won't triumph in the premiership.

And you can quote me on that.

Sabre

In fairness to Sabre he wasn't alone.

People on here immediately dismiss Forlan as not being good enough for the club, yet they are keen on Torres..

Baffling.

the Specialist

Bent is probably a better option for us than torres

Stoney

People talking about signing Torres....bad idea. He's not that good in La Liga and i just dont think that he'll succeed in the Premier League. He's definitely going to a flop.

Red_Guy

Torres, i agree with sabre and anyone who says he is overrated, he is!

Metalhead

Once again, I hope we don't get Torres, good player but over rated and not the answer to our striking problem

Paul C

I have a bad feeling about torres, He would be to lightweight like many spanish players that come over here

Roberto Green

we need a true world class finisher " well Torres aint it not even close.

Rush Job

Guess we all put our foot in our mouths sometimes.

by **Sabre** » Fri Mar 07, 2008 6:10 pm

woof woof ! wrote:
Fernando Towers won't triumph in the premiership.

And you can quote me on that.

Sabre

The more I read my "And you can quote on me on that" the more I laugh. It just helps to not take ourselves too seriously.

by **metalhead** » Fri Mar 07, 2008 6:10 pm

woof woof ! wrote:
Fernando Towers won't triumph in the premiership.

And you can quote me on that.

Sabre

In fairness to Sabre he wasn't alone.

People on here immediately dismiss Forlan as not being good enough for the club, yet they are keen on Torres..

Baffling.

the Specialist

Bent is probably a better option for us than torres

Stoney

People talking about signing Torres....bad idea. He's not that good in La Liga and i just dont think that he'll succeed in the Premier League. He's definitely going to a flop.

Red_Guy

Torres, i agree with sabre and anyone who says he is overrated, he is!

Metalhead

Once again, I hope we don't get Torres, good player but over rated and not the answer to our striking problem

Paul C

I have a bad feeling about torres, He would be to lightweight like many spanish players that come over here

Roberto Green

we need a true world class finisher " well Torres aint it not even close.

Rush Job

Guess we all put our foot in our mouths sometimes.

I just had a pie in my face.

by **tubby** » Fri Mar 07, 2008 6:39 pm

Werk

by **tubby** » Fri Mar 07, 2008 6:40 pm

woof woof ! wrote:
Fernando Towers won't triumph in the premiership.

And you can quote me on that.

Sabre

In fairness to Sabre he wasn't alone.

People on here immediately dismiss Forlan as not being good enough for the club, yet they are keen on Torres..

Baffling.

the Specialist

Bent is probably a better option for us than torres

Stoney

People talking about signing Torres....bad idea. He's not that good in La Liga and i just dont think that he'll succeed in the Premier League. He's definitely going to a flop.

Red_Guy

Torres, i agree with sabre and anyone who says he is overrated, he is!

Metalhead

Once again, I hope we don't get Torres, good player but over rated and not the answer to our striking problem

Paul C

I have a bad feeling about torres, He would be to lightweight like many spanish players that come over here

Roberto Green

we need a true world class finisher " well Torres aint it not even close.

Rush Job

Guess we all put our foot in our mouths sometimes.

Not me...I said he would be class from the start so fook the lot of ya :rasp

by **Bad Bob** » Fri Mar 07, 2008 6:49 pm

I'm actually glad we're revisiting some of these pre-season perceptions about Torres. Yes, they seem funny now given what the lad's done but I assure you that there were a lot of those kinds of comments circulating at the time--I probably said something similar, TBH. What's important to realize is that those reservations weren't based on nothing--the lad's record in Spain was decent not stellar and there was a legitimate question mark about whether he'd do the business for us or not.

My point? Rafa is not getting anywhere near the credit he deserves for gambling on Torres this summer. It was his first chance to spend big and he opted to go for a player that was no guarantee of success. Had Torres flopped, it would have been another nail in Benitez's coffin with a fair few supporters. As it turned out, he didn't flop but don't let anyone tell you that bringing him in was a no-brainer. Rafa took a big risk with El Nino and it paid off so he should get some credit. Fantastic signing. :nod

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