Liverpool FC Forum

Avi Cohen wrote:Spanish people hate Andy Gray? Why? I am going to Castellon at the end of the month Sabre (my Spanish mate is launching a book) and will ask him too.

Spanish people do not hate Gray. They simply don't know who he is.

I hate it because he's an Everton fan, he comments that you're playing badly with 0-0, and when you score he says you're playing well, he's fécking stubborn with criticising the rotation, and again, he's an Everton fan. He's always putting digs here and there. 

LittleHobo wrote:I really hope crouch goes in the jan transfer window and another striker comes in (crouch is a good player dont get me wrong, but when he is there (or for england) it turns us or england into a hoof it long team, i watched so many times today us hoof it long aimlessly........30% of our attacks were of this nature today and that is too many

Bring back Owen....

Someone start this rant 

Ciggy wrote:Oh well we are still second with a game in hand, could have been worse if Chelsea won I think if they had gone top they would have remained there for the rest of the season.

We should take all 3 points next week against Birmingham whilst Man U & Chelsea play each other hopefully a draw there.

The Grudge wrote:So if a supporter decides that Sissoko is great at the start of the season if say he was playing well!Regardless of his future performances he has to stick with that opinion??

Say Sissoko stupidly gave away a penalty in a crucial game then commits a foul for a second yellow and gets sent off changing the game and we loose.Say the next game he plays sh.it and gets dropped...can a supporter not change his opinion of that player based on current facts and form?

Of course he can...Peoples opinions can change as often as players form does,in fact and not surprisingly its players form that influence our veiws on the individual.

People who support LFC have every right to sign Raffas praises or any player when they get it right and do well...We have just as much every right to point out and criticise when a player has a bad day and looks unfit of the shirt.

Its simple really when our team play great we applaud them ....when they dont play so great we still applaud but as supporters criticise when its due...Today was a bad day and if some posters feel as i do that the manager got it wrong they are entitled to say it!!

It does not mean that if we beat Birmingham next week 5-0 we have to say we are cr@p because we were cr@p today does it?

s@int wrote:

Bad Bob wrote:

nobybob wrote:you forgot to highlight the ECT in my post thats were the players and the execution on the pitch comes in

Fair enough and that was my assumption.  I just find it interesting that, for you (and you are far from alone in this), the blame scale goes like this:

1) Rafa's selections
2) Rafa's tactics

(Both spelled out, I might add)

3) player performance

(under the "et cetera" label that presumably also includes unfair fixture scheduling, bad pitch, dodgy reffing, acts of God, and other sundries)

It just seems to me that there are 90+ minutes for 11 very capable footballers to stamp their authority on the game.  If it doesn't happen, they should take responsibility for a big part of that.

I take your point Badbob, but imagine if Rafa had included Gerrard in the starting line up instead of Pennant, Sissoko or Benayoun, he would have immediately have added pace, drive,creativity and more importantly goal threat to the mix. Same if he had played Torres up front instead of Crouch or Voronin.

What was missing today? Pace,drive,creativity and goal threat.

Maybe the players need to shoulder some of the blame for their performances, but I think Rafa sent them into the fight today with one arm tied behind their backs.

Yes the rotation options have improved this season but not to the point where we can leave arguably our 3 best players out (Gerrard, Mascherano, Torres ) Mascherano had to be left out I can understand that, but he should be OK for the CL when his rotation with Gerrard would be more acceptable.

Crouch has looked out of sorts all season, to expect him to come in and sparkle against Campbell and Distin, in a weakened team was a bit optimistic in my view. Torres has been on fire the last few games and scoring so as with Crouch last year leave him out ?

Alonso and Sissoko in midfield isn't a problem in my book, as long as you have the right options in front of them. Even Crouch and Voronin shouldn't be too much of a problem if they have the right options behind them, but to have neither was just a bridge too far.

A bad day at the office for Rafa, hopefully there wont be many more.

Lando_Griffin wrote:And it's simple really that you've totally missed the point I was making.

You can praise and criticise - you just can't alter your opinion on something every week and get away with it without being called fickle.

Are we all understanding now?

slickrick wrote:firstly would like to say hello to all as this is my first post!

thought todays line-up was a joke!
have been reading messages over the last few weeks from people going on about how crouch should get a chance and so on, hopefully today will be sufficient evidence to these fans that crouch is useless!
he never was and never will be fit to wear the red shirt!

peewee wrote:Bm rafa has made the comment that he has 18 players away on international duty so they were tired, i am wondering why gerrard and torres would be any more tired than reina, finnan, agger, crouch, voronin, yossi and alonso. all were away on international duty but were ok to play.

rafa has said it was right to change the players with this in mind. so my question is why would our two most influential players, the 2 players most likely to worry the oppo and create something were warming the bench for the first hour when it became obvious after 20 minutes that the selection wasn't working.

is rafa scared to change early as thats proof he got the starting line up wrong, is it his pride that means he wont change it early? if it is then surely his pride should take second place to the result. i think he is scared of the rotation argument and sticks with a decision (that becomes obvious that it was wrong) to save face and hope that we snatch something to justify his decison.

we could and should have lost that game yesterday, i thought this season he would play one game at a time and treat every game as important without one eye on the european game next week.

the fact remains our 2 most influential players were wasted yesterday, maybe give one a rest, but when he rested 2 we looked clueless.

masherano i can understand, he only arrived back from oz late friday, kuyt i think was more tactical rather than resting him, i think kuyt was dropped, but gerrard and torres i cant understand

Wilhelmsson wrote:

Lando_Griffin wrote:And it's simple really that you've totally missed the point I was making.

You can praise and criticise - you just can't alter your opinion on something every week and get away with it without being called fickle.

Are we all understanding now?

It depends on what you are praising and criticising. If a team plays inconsistently each week, then is it fickle to praise the team for the good performances and then criticise the team for the bad results? IMO it is not, Rafa was praised last week by the majority because he was spot on with tactics, team sheet and approach.

This week it’s slightly different for reasons which have been discussed already.

Lando_Griffin wrote:Oh f*cking dear.

I shall explain this in the simplest terms possible:

It is ok to criticise a performance if it merits it. It is ok to praise a performance if it merits it.

It is NOT ok to change your mind every 2 minutes regarding something that has not changed. (I.E. Rafa's tactical nous.)

As Bad Bob has said - you can blame Rafa all you want, but it's not all his fault. (And now I'll add something:)

You lot keep bleating about him, and the day he leaves you'll be crying your f*cking eyes out.

Now accept that he's the best man for the job, and that players can have off days.

Numpties.

dawson99 wrote:rafa made a mistake yesterday but its too easy to say that after the event.

Lando_Griffin wrote:

Wilhelmsson wrote:

Lando_Griffin wrote:And it's simple really that you've totally missed the point I was making.

You can praise and criticise - you just can't alter your opinion on something every week and get away with it without being called fickle.

Are we all understanding now?

It depends on what you are praising and criticising. If a team plays inconsistently each week, then is it fickle to praise the team for the good performances and then criticise the team for the bad results? IMO it is not, Rafa was praised last week by the majority because he was spot on with tactics, team sheet and approach.

This week it’s slightly different for reasons which have been discussed already.

Oh f*cking dear.

I shall explain this in the simplest terms possible:

It is ok to criticise a performance if it merits it. It is ok to praise a performance if it merits it.

It is NOT ok to change your mind every 2 minutes regarding something that has not changed. (I.E. Rafa's tactical nous.)

As Bad Bob has said - you can blame Rafa all you want, but it's not all his fault. (And now I'll add something:)

You lot keep bleating about him, and the day he leaves you'll be crying your f*cking eyes out.

Now accept that he's the best man for the job, and that players can have off days.

Numpties.