Liverpool FC Forum

Mascherano was another who was over hyped for me. Couldn't pass, no goals in him, to one dimensional. Good if you were under the cosh. But not much else.

But in essence, you are correct, we can and must do better than Lucas if we're going to once again become a decent side.

only me » Tue Sep 03, 2013 9:04 pm wrote:

RED BEERGOGGLES » Tue Sep 03, 2013 8:37 pm wrote:I think Lucas needs a player beside him who can win the ball back quickly and then distribute it intelligently
Lucas breaks up and disrupts more of the opponents play than posters give him credit for ,and in terms of
a defensive mid he's one of the best .....You only have to look at the money Spudz paid for Paulinho who
in my opinion is cumbersome and bereft of any precision. Teams like Arsenal would thrive with a player of
Lucas's calibre in their midfield. 



Lucas's importance to the team is often understated ,doing the dirty work in midfield is a thankless task ,but
its no surprise to see him being undervalued by some .....As some things never change .

And some forget that not long ago we had Alonso and Mash playing the same position....We could do a lot better ,in fact we must.

Do you honestly believe Alonso would have been as successful  if he didn't have someone breaking up play alongside him  ?

Blame the manager, its his team, his signings. When I saw that we had not signed any big names, I thought wed finish about 8th. We may do still.

RED BEERGOGGLES » Tue Sep 03, 2013 10:13 pm wrote:

only me » Tue Sep 03, 2013 9:04 pm wrote:

RED BEERGOGGLES » Tue Sep 03, 2013 8:37 pm wrote:I think Lucas needs a player beside him who can win the ball back quickly and then distribute it intelligently
Lucas breaks up and disrupts more of the opponents play than posters give him credit for ,and in terms of
a defensive mid he's one of the best .....You only have to look at the money Spudz paid for Paulinho who
in my opinion is cumbersome and bereft of any precision. Teams like Arsenal would thrive with a player of
Lucas's calibre in their midfield. 



Lucas's importance to the team is often understated ,doing the dirty work in midfield is a thankless task ,but
its no surprise to see him being undervalued by some .....As some things never change .

And some forget that not long ago we had Alonso and Mash playing the same position....We could do a lot better ,in fact we must.

Do you honestly believe Alonso would have been as successful  if he didn't have someone breaking up play alongside him  ?

In a word...

Absolutely.

Alonso was, and still is, world class.

Alonso's talent is not in question ,but even he needed a player alongside him to disrupt the opponents play.

if only jay spearing was a foot taller 

The lads an expert at it himself.

Watch him play, when the opposition have the ball and spray a clearance about it always falls to him. He reads the game brilliantly, was a great tackler and has unbelievable positional sense. He lacked speed and pace but he didn't need it.

He'd be immense next to Gerrard in this current set up, funnily enough this is the set up I wanted under the dictator with Gerrard and Alonso next to each other and a Coutinho/Suarez type in behind Torres...

red till i die!! » Tue Sep 03, 2013 10:39 pm wrote:if only jay spearing was a foot taller 

Spearing wasn't bad... again though, he wasn't very good haha. Could pass and tackle, good decisions. Just lacked sharpness and going forward he was poor. His head seemed to go when in the opposition half.

StuYesThatStu » Tue Sep 03, 2013 9:10 pm wrote:Mascherano was another who was over hyped for me. Couldn't pass, no goals in him, to one dimensional. Good if you were under the cosh. But not much else.

But in essence, you are correct, we can and must do better than Lucas if we're going to once again become a decent side.

mascherano was a tremendous player! you have got to be a wind up merchant

ycsatbjywtbiastkamb » Tue Sep 03, 2013 10:47 pm wrote:

StuYesThatStu » Tue Sep 03, 2013 9:10 pm wrote:Mascherano was another who was over hyped for me. Couldn't pass, no goals in him, to one dimensional. Good if you were under the cosh. But not much else.

But in essence, you are correct, we can and must do better than Lucas if we're going to once again become a decent side.

mascherano was a tremendous player! you have got to be a wind up merchant

this lad is famous on here yakka, he has matured now though 

StuYesThatStu » Tue Sep 03, 2013 9:42 pm wrote:The lads an expert at it himself.

Watch him play, when the opposition have the ball and spray a clearance about it always falls to him. He reads the game brilliantly, was a great tackler and has unbelievable positional sense. He lacked speed and pace but he didn't need it.

He'd be immense next to Gerrard in this current set up, funnily enough this is the set up I wanted under the dictator with Gerrard and Alonso next to each other and a Coutinho/Suarez type in behind Torres...

No he wouldn't , like I said earlier Gerrard is a spent force after half time ,and I seriously doubt Alonso would put in twice the graft
to cover him while he drops ever deeper into our own half.

StuYesThatStu » Tue Sep 03, 2013 9:42 pm wrote:The lads an expert at it himself.

Watch him play, when the opposition have the ball and spray a clearance about it always falls to him. He reads the game brilliantly, was a great tackler and has unbelievable positional sense. He lacked speed and pace but he didn't need it.

He'd be immense next to Gerrard in this current set up, funnily enough this is the set up I wanted under the dictator with Gerrard and Alonso next to each other and a Coutinho/Suarez type in behind Torres...

No he wouldn't , like I said earlier Gerrard is a spent force after half time ,and I seriously doubt Alonso would put in twice the graft
to cover him while he drops ever deeper into our own half.

It was bull the first time you said it, just because you said it twice doesn't make you right... 

Gerrard did drop deep, because the defence also dropped deep. Sometimes its down to the midfield, on Sunday though the amount of times Gerrard tried to drag them out and the manager and defenders were telling him to stay in was ridiculous.

As for Mascherano... tremendous? Nar. Decent yeah, but a centre mid who can't score a goal or even pass a ball is a bit like a clown that can't juggle. Pointless.

I can see that Lucas is still very underrated by our fans. I can assure everyone that we would have been overrun in midfield in all three games this season right in the first half if we had Allan for example instead of Lucas. His job is to break up play and put pressure on the opposition if he can't make the tackle. His job is a very important part of the game. I remember last season how easily we got overrun in midfield by players such us Mulumbu when Lucas was missing. The one that is having trouble doing defensive work is Gerrard. He may do the attractive sliding tackle every now and then but he struggles to keep up pace even with average players and is usually out of gas for the second half so Lucas has to play on his own (who is also not fit enough yet). I think that Lucas is as good as any DM in the league and we should give him more credit for what he does.

I'd like to discuss about our options though. Lucas is obviously an automatic starter, but what happens if he gets injured or when runs out of steam during a game? We'll need someone to do the defensive work and Allen and Alberto aren't really suitable for that job. I like this discussion about our defenders and their ability to play at DM if needed. Agger isn't suited for that position and although both Toure and Sakho have played there, I don't think that they are the kind of DM that Rogers wants. Ilory on the other hand, although I have never seen him play, looks like he has the potential to be a good DM. He won't even need to be too physically strong if he is as fast as they say and apparently he's also good with the ball. I wouldn't want us to do it on regular basis but it's definitely worth a try in some cup game. We really needed options for the DM position and Ilory might be it.

StuYesThatStu » Tue Sep 03, 2013 10:15 pm wrote:It was bull the first time you said it, just because you said it twice doesn't make you right... 

Gerrard did drop deep, because the defence also dropped deep. Sometimes its down to the midfield, on Sunday though the amount of times Gerrard tried to drag them out and the manager and defenders were telling him to stay in was ridiculous.

As for Mascherano... tremendous? Nar. Decent yeah, but a centre mid who can't score a goal or even pass a ball is a bit like a clown that can't juggle. Pointless.

You're perfectly correct Stu.





















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