Liverpool FC Forum

[The Grudge]

What planet are you on?, this is not the football part of the forum it is the "General chat forum"- hence its name .

You are the twa,t for coming on here and moaning about what we have to say, shallow little digs?

What are you on about son?, your arguments are a joke.

OK Boss...sorry i'll get my out of here!

[Ciggy]

If i comb my hair it is insignificant!
As insignificant as your shallow little digs about territory and religion on an internet forum about LFC!

Listen lads all i can say is that from when the world kicked off and played football with man there have been many fouls and the referees are usually unable to control the play!
There has been,is and always will be war and hate!

In my opinion football is a getaway from the reality of sh'ite like that and in a way football and LFC are more important to me than any white boy,nigga,muslim or whatever.

Choose your labels carefully guys and whern ya placed them make sure its in the right place!

I think youve been watching to much of this.

[metalhead]

First of all, don't these factions have right to fight any occupants (i.e foreign soldiers) in the country? the French did this in WW2 against Nazil troops IN France, but where they terrorists? I mean its resistance against invasion, they weren't a threat to the U.S or any other foreign government OUTSIDE the country. These FACTIONS did what they had to do because they thought this was oppression, 1982 was the Israeli invasion, also lebanon was in civil war. When this happened in 1983, the U.S withdrew their forces. Hizballah of 1985 is different than Hizballah right now, Sayyed Hasan Nasrallah became Hizballah leader in 1992, so it basically changed.

Second of all, people in Towns, Villages and cities in the south of Lebanon support Hizballah, mostly the fighters are from these area, born and raised there. Its hard to say Hizballah are not allowed to be there in these villages and towns, when mostly locals are fighting with hizballah. Plus it was Israel who started this, maybe not directly, but indirectly by breaking lebanese airspace (who they are continuely doing so right now) or they had troops patrolling into lebanese lands. Then the kidnapping happened, you may say it was unjustified, but I think it was for a cause, to bring back lebanese prisoners who were captured 22 years ago! As you said Israel respone was unjustified, they started air-raiding, Hizballah told them to stop or they will hit back by katyusha rockets, but Israel didn't stop and they destroyed all our infrastructure killing innocent people on the way. Also, would you have thought that IF hizballah have never shot a single rocket into israel, the israel government would have stopped the war? I mean over 95% of the Israel population where behind last year's war, but when Hizballah started firing rockets into israel, The people felt insecure, they felt scared, and I feel for them because this is war! so the poll ratings for the war decreased, to an extent when Sayyed Hasan Nasrallah said he will hit Tel Aviv, if israel don't stop, that the israelians made protests to end this. Why is that? the protests against the government is for us? to stop the government from killing innocent lebanese children? No, they were in fear, thats normal. Basically, I think, I answered your question, on why hizballah fired these rockets, its self-defence.

Your comparison to WW2 is ridiculous, you are comparing the actions of a crazed dictator intent on world domination with the actions of who exactly? Israel? The U.S.? The U.S. weren't occupying Lebanon and the attacks were on a multimnational peacekeeping force, it's just a silly comparison.

The comparison is stupid, so stupid I can't believe I'm even having to respond to it.

These factions killed over 200 U.S. troops sent on a PEACEKEEPING mission, but you call this justified resistance, resistance to what? They were never occupiers. Peacekeepers analogous to Nazi invaders? Get real mate.


You say Hezbollah are from these towns and villages, it is against U.N. law to do what they did.


It may have started with Israel entering Lebanese airspace, but is launching Katyusha rockets or dragging up a 22 year old dispute over captured soldiers a sensible way to respond?

Israel should never have responded in the way they did, it's unacceptable and I have no support for Israel whatsoever on that basis - but you cannot excuse the initial actions of Hezbollah in firing gratuitously over the border with no aim other than to injure and kill as many people as possible. I don't see how you consider it self defence when the initial aggressor was Hezbollah, Israel were right to try and respond by targeting missile bases - unfortunately some of these missile bases were located in villages which is against U.N. law and is why so many more people were killed. Isarel went way over the top in their response and for that they should be reprimanded, but you cannot argue that Hezbollah were right to suddenly start firing rockets at civilians in Israel.

Fair enough mate, i agree, a stupid comparision.

Peacekeeping force? care to explain why a U.S navy in 1979 started bombing the mountains in lebanon? is that peacekeeping? or in the early 1980's the U.S war planes raided many sites in lebanon because of suspected PLOs in those sites, they are in a peacekeeping mission ofcourse. Plus You can't call them peacekeeping force when its ONLY one side have asked them to come in? I mean a peacekeeping force should be implemented when having ALL Lebanese parties to accept them .The U.S didn't get permission from other parties, and they were warned! Even the French.

The initial aggressor wasn't hizballah, it was Israel. Lebanon was never in peace with Israel, Israel used aggression before the war happened, in fact i forgot to add that there were some incidents that happened. For example, a 17 year old lebanese boy was killed by israeli troops next to the border because they "suspected" him of going into the border, which he wasn't. Another incident is that Israeli battleships were roaming into lebanese sea area next to the city of Tyre and killed a fisherman there, is that justified? Sayyed Hasan made one point to the Israelis, He told them "You hit us, and we hit you back" simple as that! When Israel started raiding the south and the southern suberb of beirut, Hizballah took 2 days to retaliate, because they gave them a chance to stop, but Israel didn't. If you can't call firing rockets into israel other than self-defence, then what do you call it? All i know, Israel started hitting us before hizballah retaliated.

Furthermore, Hizballah has changed its philosophy when Sayyed Hasan Nasrallah became the leader, He was very critical about 9/11, he is also helping the UNIFEL to set up comfortably in the south and cooperating with them, doesn't sound like a Terrorist organization to me. Also, they were part of the Lebanese government, we had ministers who were hizballah in the government. Every lebanese citizen know that they aren't terrorists, mearly a resistance whose sole purpose is to resist any foreign attacks (doesn't mean all lebanese citizens likes them though). Also missle bases? Hizballah doesn't have missle bases, just trucks with rockets on them, plus they mostly fire from top of mountains and rarely from villages or towns.

[metalhead]

Metalhead..with reading your posts over a year or two i thought you had a brain!
I was mistaken mate..you are as big of a fool as the idiots you fight with and if not more so beacuse in subtle educated ways you fuel the fire of hate!It really looks like at times that your main objective is to put across ideals that others may not want to taste!

You coat your veiws with reason(in your mind) but to us your views are so close to the bone that a wink would make an earthquake..You are smart but not very clever,not travelled,intelligent but not streetwise!

If you have any balls you will get yourself off here and join the crusade to be killed,rather than fill British bandwidth with anti west cr@p you pathetic little brown nerd!

Do i know you? 

[LFC2007]

First of all, don't these factions have right to fight any occupants (i.e foreign soldiers) in the country? the French did this in WW2 against Nazil troops IN France, but where they terrorists? I mean its resistance against invasion, they weren't a threat to the U.S or any other foreign government OUTSIDE the country. These FACTIONS did what they had to do because they thought this was oppression, 1982 was the Israeli invasion, also lebanon was in civil war. When this happened in 1983, the U.S withdrew their forces. Hizballah of 1985 is different than Hizballah right now, Sayyed Hasan Nasrallah became Hizballah leader in 1992, so it basically changed.

Second of all, people in Towns, Villages and cities in the south of Lebanon support Hizballah, mostly the fighters are from these area, born and raised there. Its hard to say Hizballah are not allowed to be there in these villages and towns, when mostly locals are fighting with hizballah. Plus it was Israel who started this, maybe not directly, but indirectly by breaking lebanese airspace (who they are continuely doing so right now) or they had troops patrolling into lebanese lands. Then the kidnapping happened, you may say it was unjustified, but I think it was for a cause, to bring back lebanese prisoners who were captured 22 years ago! As you said Israel respone was unjustified, they started air-raiding, Hizballah told them to stop or they will hit back by katyusha rockets, but Israel didn't stop and they destroyed all our infrastructure killing innocent people on the way. Also, would you have thought that IF hizballah have never shot a single rocket into israel, the israel government would have stopped the war? I mean over 95% of the Israel population where behind last year's war, but when Hizballah started firing rockets into israel, The people felt insecure, they felt scared, and I feel for them because this is war! so the poll ratings for the war decreased, to an extent when Sayyed Hasan Nasrallah said he will hit Tel Aviv, if israel don't stop, that the israelians made protests to end this. Why is that? the protests against the government is for us? to stop the government from killing innocent lebanese children? No, they were in fear, thats normal. Basically, I think, I answered your question, on why hizballah fired these rockets, its self-defence.

Your comparison to WW2 is ridiculous, you are comparing the actions of a crazed dictator intent on world domination with the actions of who exactly? Israel? The U.S.? The U.S. weren't occupying Lebanon and the attacks were on a multimnational peacekeeping force, it's just a silly comparison.

The comparison is stupid, so stupid I can't believe I'm even having to respond to it.

These factions killed over 200 U.S. troops sent on a PEACEKEEPING mission, but you call this justified resistance, resistance to what? They were never occupiers. Peacekeepers analogous to Nazi invaders? Get real mate.


You say Hezbollah are from these towns and villages, it is against U.N. law to do what they did.


It may have started with Israel entering Lebanese airspace, but is launching Katyusha rockets or dragging up a 22 year old dispute over captured soldiers a sensible way to respond?

Israel should never have responded in the way they did, it's unacceptable and I have no support for Israel whatsoever on that basis - but you cannot excuse the initial actions of Hezbollah in firing gratuitously over the border with no aim other than to injure and kill as many people as possible. I don't see how you consider it self defence when the initial aggressor was Hezbollah, Israel were right to try and respond by targeting missile bases - unfortunately some of these missile bases were located in villages which is against U.N. law and is why so many more people were killed. Isarel went way over the top in their response and for that they should be reprimanded, but you cannot argue that Hezbollah were right to suddenly start firing rockets at civilians in Israel.

Fair enough mate, i agree, a stupid comparision.

Peacekeeping force? care to explain why a U.S navy in 1979 started bombing the mountains in lebanon? is that peacekeeping? or in the early 1980's the U.S war planes raided many sites in lebanon because of suspected PLOs in those sites, they are in a peacekeeping mission ofcourse. Plus You can't call them peacekeeping force when its ONLY one side have asked them to come in? I mean a peacekeeping force should be implemented when having ALL Lebanese parties to accept them .The U.S didn't get permission from other parties, and they were warned! Even the French.

The initial aggressor wasn't hizballah, it was Israel. Lebanon was never in peace with Israel, Israel used aggression before the war happened, in fact i forgot to add that there were some incidents that happened. For example, a 17 year old lebanese boy was killed by israeli troops next to the border because they "suspected" him of going into the border, which he wasn't. Another incident is that Israeli battleships were roaming into lebanese sea area next to the city of Tyre and killed a fisherman there, is that justified? Sayyed Hasan made one point to the Israelis, He told them "You hit us, and we hit you back" simple as that! When Israel started raiding the south and the southern suberb of beirut, Hizballah took 2 days to retaliate, because they gave them a chance to stop, but Israel didn't. If you can't call firing rockets into israel other than self-defence, then what do you call it? All i know, Israel started hitting us before hizballah retaliated.

Furthermore, Hizballah has changed its philosophy when Sayyed Hasan Nasrallah became the leader, He was very critical about 9/11, he is also helping the UNIFEL to set up comfortably in the south and cooperating with them, doesn't sound like a Terrorist organization to me. Also, they were part of the Lebanese government, we had ministers who were hizballah in the government. Every lebanese citizen know that they aren't terrorists, mearly a resistance whose sole purpose is to resist any foreign attacks (doesn't mean all lebanese citizens likes them though). Also missle bases? Hizballah doesn't have missle bases, just trucks with rockets on them, plus they mostly fire from top of mountains and rarely from villages or towns.

It was a multinational force, not a unilateral force. One side? It was a multinational force, what don't you understand about that? Killing 200 soldiers who slept at night in a barracks as part of a peacekeeping mission? Not terrorism? You must have a strange definition of terrorism.

The second part, you cite a few incidents of aggression from Israel. I could cite similar ones from Hezbollah, but that is no excuse to start firing thousands of Katyusha rockets into Israel with no aim whatsoever. Self- defence? What goal does firing thousands of rockets at civilians achieve?

It was clear that Hezbollah exploited small towns and villages near the Israeli border as places to launch rocket attacks from - mobile ones but still located in villages off the Israeli border, just to make it that bit harder for Israel to target them and take the blame for any subsequent civilan casualties.The photographic evidence was shown at the time of the conflict proving this. But you'll deny it and we're back to square one.

[metalhead]

Do you understand retaliation? Hizballah retaliated, they did not fire first! Do you think Hizballah will stand there and watch Israel bomb the hell out of the south? Photographic evidence? you mean hizballah flags in buildings or houses? does that really mean that hizballah forces are camping there? No! it means these are civilians who support Hizballah who have flags. My neigbhor has a Hizballah flag on his balcony, so it doesn't mean he is a soldier with them. Plus I've seen sites where Israel hit, mostly in mountain tops, I've seen a whole forest burnt down by israeli planes because its where hizballah fired rockets.

You misunderstood me, I didn't mean one sided force, I'm saying a one side containing several lebanese parties wanted the force in lebanon, where as the other side of lebanese parties are against that decision.

[LFC2007]

Do you understand retaliation? Hizballah retaliated, they did not fire first! Do you think Hizballah will stand there and watch Israel bomb the hell out of the south? Photographic evidence? you mean hizballah flags in buildings or houses? does that really mean that hizballah forces are camping there? No! it means these are civilians who support Hizballah who have flags. My neigbhor has a Hizballah flag on his balcony, so it doesn't mean he is a soldier with them. Plus I've seen sites where Israel hit, mostly in mountain tops, I've seen a whole forest burnt down by israeli planes because its where hizballah fired rockets.

You misunderstood me, I didn't mean one sided force, I'm saying a one side containing several lebanese parties wanted the force in lebanon, where as the other side of lebanese parties are against that decision.

Retaliation, sure I understand retaliation but where will firing thousands and thousands of Katyusha rockets get you in trying to stop Israel?


Photographic evidence, as in, PHOTO'S from reconaissence aircraft of missile launchers in villages in Southern Lebanon.


200 U.S. troops killed in a barracks with a multinational peacekeaping force housed in it, I don't care what side you are on, that is unacceptable and is the act of terrorists.

[metalhead]

Do you understand retaliation? Hizballah retaliated, they did not fire first! Do you think Hizballah will stand there and watch Israel bomb the hell out of the south? Photographic evidence? you mean hizballah flags in buildings or houses? does that really mean that hizballah forces are camping there? No! it means these are civilians who support Hizballah who have flags. My neigbhor has a Hizballah flag on his balcony, so it doesn't mean he is a soldier with them. Plus I've seen sites where Israel hit, mostly in mountain tops, I've seen a whole forest burnt down by israeli planes because its where hizballah fired rockets.

You misunderstood me, I didn't mean one sided force, I'm saying a one side containing several lebanese parties wanted the force in lebanon, where as the other side of lebanese parties are against that decision.

Retaliation, sure I understand retaliation but where will firing thousands and thousands of Katyusha rockets get you in trying to stop Israel?


Photographic evidence, as in, PHOTO'S from reconaissence aircraft of missile launchers in villages in Southern Lebanon.


200 U.S. troops killed in a barracks with a multinational peacekeaping force housed in it, I don't care what side you are on, that is unacceptable and is the act of terrorists.

Fine you have your views on what hizballah is and I have mine, so lets not go into circles as you said 

I'm in no one side, I just don't want to see my country be a place where Iran and the U.S solve their dispute, I don't want it to be a battlefield.

[dawson99]

why is it that people always ruin threads, what has this gotta do with salmon rushdie writing a book?

basically, anyone who says that he should be killed for writing words should be shot. simple as.

you cant order a fatwa every time someone says something you dont agree with, fricking idiots need to grow up and learn to intergrate with the 21st century

[metalhead]

why is it that people always ruin threads, what has this gotta do with salmon rushdie writing a book?

basically, anyone who says that he should be killed for writing words should be shot. simple as.

you cant order a fatwa every time someone says something you dont agree with, fricking idiots need to grow up and learn to intergrate with the 21st century

Do you really think that the majority of educated muslims care if he got knighted or not? NO!

I'm one of them 

He can criticise islam as much as he want, he is going to hell not me 

[dawson99]

he wont go to hell for words doofus

and i didnt mean u, i meant anyone who said it would be ok for him to be killed, which of course u never said.

[metalhead]

he wont go to hell for words doofus

and i didnt mean u, i meant anyone who said it would be ok for him to be killed, which of course u never said.

I was being sarcastic at the end 

[dawson99]

me too!

hehe

anyways, lets just say some people went alittle over the top

[zarababe]

why is it that people always ruin threads, what has this gotta do with salmon rushdie writing a book?

basically, anyone who says that he should be killed for writing words should be shot. simple as.

you cant order a fatwa every time someone says something you dont agree with, fricking idiots need to grow up and learn to intergrate with the 21st century

so true Dawsonio - how can a thread about 'salmon' turn in to something so serious reminds me of the hoo ha surrounding that author.... now let me see what was his name... oh yes

'Salman' Rushdie.. uncanny that ay 


   

[destro]

why is it that people always ruin threads, what has this gotta do with salmon rushdie writing a book?

basically, anyone who says that he should be killed for writing words should be shot. simple as.

you cant order a fatwa every time someone says something you dont agree with, fricking idiots need to grow up and learn to intergrate with the 21st century

so true Dawsonio - how can a thread about 'salmon' turn in to something so serious reminds me of the hoo ha surrounding that author.... now let me see what was his name... oh yes

'Salman' Rushdie.. uncanny that ay 


   

I think the whole thing smells a bit fishy to me