Liverpool FC Forum

Top · by **tonyeh** » Sat Oct 24, 2009 2:37 am

Madmax wrote:I quite liked how jack straw and that indian lady stated how other ethnics joined forces and died for this country in WW2. Griffins response was my daddy was there where was yours (jacks) loool..

Unfortunately, Straw and that "Indian lady" need to go back and read up on both wars just to find out how absurd their efforts were at trying to fool a modern audience into thinking that the makeup of Allied forces were a multiracial boiling pot of harmony fighting for the good of everyone.

It's absolute bollox.

Both the British and American forces in WWII were incredibly racist institutions and practiced segregation. Even white Quebecer French suffered racial abuse when they were stationed in England with Bomber Command.

My dad was based in Aldershot during the war at a Canadian camp and said that French Canadians were treated very differently than other Canadians...and you wouldn't have seen a black face for miles.

I have to say, I am truely sick of this false impression of the Second World War that's bounced around these days, whenever race is mentioned.

NO Allied Nations went into that war on a platform of fighting for racial harmony.

The ONLY Allied Nation that didn't have strict regualtions on its racial and sexual makeup was the U.S.S.R.

...And to see Jack Straw, a man instumental in the killing of hundreds of thousands of Iraqis in a war based on absolute lies, try to highjack the Second World War for his own grubby little political ends was sickening.

Top · by **LFC2007** » Sat Oct 24, 2009 3:22 am

Well the fact is that many millions of ethnically different peoples gave their lives for this country in WWII, and the overriding point is that we ought to remember the efforts of those of all colours, creeds and nationalities who came together, not just the efforts of the 'indigenous' population.

Top · by **tonyeh** » Sat Oct 24, 2009 3:51 am

There's a huge difference between remembering something and hijacking it to futher an outragious lie for political ends, by people who haven't a clue what they are talking about or even give a crap at the end of the day.

And "many millions" died for Britian in the Second World War?

That's an extreme exaggeration.

Top · by **LFC2007** » Sat Oct 24, 2009 4:21 am

I'm not getting carried away with who said it, but it's clearly relevant in challenging the ideals of the BNP. The contributions of all soldiers from our former colonies who served for Britain (or alongside Britain) should be noted just as much as any other.

Top · by **Woollyback** » Sat Oct 24, 2009 8:52 am

question time, the director's cut

Top · by **JBG** » Sat Oct 24, 2009 9:46 am

tonyeh wrote:
Madmax wrote:I quite liked how jack straw and that indian lady stated how other ethnics joined forces and died for this country in WW2. Griffins response was my daddy was there where was yours (jacks) loool..

Unfortunately, Straw and that "Indian lady" need to go back and read up on both wars just to find out how absurd their efforts were at trying to fool a modern audience into thinking that the makeup of Allied forces were a multiracial boiling pot of harmony fighting for the good of everyone.

It's absolute bollox.

Both the British and American forces in WWII were incredibly racist institutions and practiced segregation. Even white Quebecer French suffered racial abuse when they were stationed in England with Bomber Command.

My dad was based in Aldershot during the war at a Canadian camp and said that French Canadians were treated very differently than other Canadians...and you wouldn't have seen a black face for miles.

I have to say, I am truely sick of this false impression of the Second World War that's bounced around these days, whenever race is mentioned.

NO Allied Nations went into that war on a platform of fighting for racial harmony.

The ONLY Allied Nation that didn't have strict regualtions on its racial and sexual makeup was the U.S.S.R.

...And to see Jack Straw, a man instumental in the killing of hundreds of thousands of Iraqis in a war based on absolute lies, try to highjack the Second World War for his own grubby little political ends was sickening.

Correct and well said, although the French had north and west African troops, although I agree with your point 100%.

Top · by **Benny The Noon** » Sat Oct 24, 2009 11:14 am

Griffin and BNP are co.cks of the highest order but unfortunatly the program has shot their profile through the roof and they will get more backing now .

Top · by **7_Kewell** » Sat Oct 24, 2009 1:55 pm

LFC2007 wrote:Well the fact is that many millions of ethnically different peoples gave their lives for this country in WWII, and the overriding point is that we ought to remember the efforts of those of all colours, creeds and nationalities who came together, not just the efforts of the 'indigenous' population.

spot on. People from the empire travelled thousands of miles to fight for Britiain and the BNP would erase that from the history books if they could, just like the Nazi's did in regards to the German Jewish contribution in WW1.

Top · by **tonyeh** » Sat Oct 24, 2009 2:26 pm

JBG wrote:
tonyeh wrote:
Madmax wrote:I quite liked how jack straw and that indian lady stated how other ethnics joined forces and died for this country in WW2. Griffins response was my daddy was there where was yours (jacks) loool..

Unfortunately, Straw and that "Indian lady" need to go back and read up on both wars just to find out how absurd their efforts were at trying to fool a modern audience into thinking that the makeup of Allied forces were a multiracial boiling pot of harmony fighting for the good of everyone.

It's absolute bollox.

Both the British and American forces in WWII were incredibly racist institutions and practiced segregation. Even white Quebecer French suffered racial abuse when they were stationed in England with Bomber Command.

My dad was based in Aldershot during the war at a Canadian camp and said that French Canadians were treated very differently than other Canadians...and you wouldn't have seen a black face for miles.

I have to say, I am truely sick of this false impression of the Second World War that's bounced around these days, whenever race is mentioned.

NO Allied Nations went into that war on a platform of fighting for racial harmony.

The ONLY Allied Nation that didn't have strict regualtions on its racial and sexual makeup was the U.S.S.R.

...And to see Jack Straw, a man instumental in the killing of hundreds of thousands of Iraqis in a war based on absolute lies, try to highjack the Second World War for his own grubby little political ends was sickening.

Correct and well said, although the French had north and west African troops, although I agree with your point 100%.

And by and large, the Armée de Terre treated those colonial troops like merde.

Apart from the famous "French Foreign Legion", which in fact was made up of mostly whites, the Colonials were very much second line bullet fodder for the most part. Ill equipped and segregated.

Besides, ALL of the major combatant Nations made use of Colonial troops during the war. There was nothing "honourable" about it, or racially harmonious either. Nazi Germany raised Foreign divisions that made use of coloured soldiers too.

Top · by **tonyeh** » Sat Oct 24, 2009 2:30 pm

7_Kewell wrote:
LFC2007 wrote:Well the fact is that many millions of ethnically different peoples gave their lives for this country in WWII, and the overriding point is that we ought to remember the efforts of those of all colours, creeds and nationalities who came together, not just the efforts of the 'indigenous' population.

spot on. People from the empire travelled thousands of miles to fight for Britiain and the BNP would erase that from the history books if they could, just like the Nazi's did in regards to the German Jewish contribution in WW1.

Many foreign nationals may have gone to fight in a British uniform, but the are a huge number of reasons why they did. Most of those reasons had nothing to do with "fighting for Britain".

The absolute top reason why foreigners enlist in other Nations army's is regular pay.

Top · by **tubby** » Sat Oct 24, 2009 3:47 pm

Judge wrote:
LFC2007 wrote:
Judge wrote:
bavlondon wrote:Switch on BBC news....looks like madness down at White City.

white city?? wtf do u mean by that !!

BBC HQ in Shepherd's Bush. It's sort of white and pretty large.

dont be so Fu*king sarcastic

I bet your feeling a bit stupid right now after seeing that picture. :laugh:

Top · by **tubby** » Sat Oct 24, 2009 3:56 pm

tonyeh wrote:
Madmax wrote:I quite liked how jack straw and that indian lady stated how other ethnics joined forces and died for this country in WW2. Griffins response was my daddy was there where was yours (jacks) loool..

Unfortunately, Straw and that "Indian lady" need to go back and read up on both wars just to find out how absurd their efforts were at trying to fool a modern audience into thinking that the makeup of Allied forces were a multiracial boiling pot of harmony fighting for the good of everyone.

It's absolute bollox.

Both the British and American forces in WWII were incredibly racist institutions and practiced segregation. Even white Quebecer French suffered racial abuse when they were stationed in England with Bomber Command.

My dad was based in Aldershot during the war at a Canadian camp and said that French Canadians were treated very differently than other Canadians...and you wouldn't have seen a black face for miles.

I have to say, I am truely sick of this false impression of the Second World War that's bounced around these days, whenever race is mentioned.

NO Allied Nations went into that war on a platform of fighting for racial harmony.

The ONLY Allied Nation that didn't have strict regualtions on its racial and sexual makeup was the U.S.S.R.

...And to see Jack Straw, a man instumental in the killing of hundreds of thousands of Iraqis in a war based on absolute lies, try to highjack the Second World War for his own grubby little political ends was sickening.

I think your the one who needs to maybe do some homework.

As William Archer once said- “The moment Britain gets into trouble elsewhere, India, in her present temper, would burst into a blaze of rebellion.”

India played a significant part in World War One. However, India’s part in the war is frequently overlooked as a result of the horrors experienced in trench warfare and by Europe’s tendency to home in on battles such as those fought at the Somme and Verdun, which many assume only Europeans fought in.

When was broke out in 1914, India was in a state of growing political unrest. The Indian National Congress had gone from being a group that simply discussed issues to a body that was pushing for more self-government. Before the war started, the Germans had spent a great deal of time and energy trying to stir up an anti-British movement in India. Many shared the view that if Britain got involved in a crisis somewhere in the world, Indian separatists would use this as an opportunity to advance their cause.

These fears were unfounded. When war was declared on August 4th, India rallied to the cause. Those with influence within India believed that the cause of Indian independence would best be served by helping out Britain in whatever capacity India could – including the Indian National Congress. Offers of financial and military help were made from all over the country. Hugely wealthy princes offered great sums of money, and even areas outside of British India offered help – Nepal offered help and in total sent 100,000 Gurkhas and the Dalai Lama in Tibet offered 1000 of his troops to the cause. Despite the pre-war fears of unrest, Britain, in fact, could take many troops and most of her military equipment out of India as fears of unrest subsided. Indian troops were ready for battle before most other troops in the dominions.

Indian troops were on the Western Front by the winter of 1914 and fought at the first Battle of Ypres. By the end of 1915, they had sustained many casualties. Along with the casualties from sickness, the decision was taken to withdraw the Indian Corps from front line duty at the end of 1915.

In total, 800,000 Indian troops fought in all the theatres of the war with 1½ million volunteering to fight. They fought in most theatres of war including Gallipoli and North and East Africa. In all 47,746 were classed as killed or missing with 65,000 wounded.

The Indian Corps won 13,000 medals for gallantry including 12 Victoria Crosses. Khudadad Khan won the Corps first Victoria Cross.

Such was the cost of the war, that India’s economy was pushed to near bankruptcy.

The Indian support given to Britain’s cause surprised the establishment in Britain. ‘The Times’ wrote:

“The Indian empire has overwhelmed the British nation by the completeness and unanimity of its enthusiastic aid.”

For its endeavours, India expected to be rewarded with a major move towards independence or at the least self-government. When it became obvious that this was not going to happen, the mood in India became more militant. During the last phases of the war Mahatma Ghandi said:
“Seek ye first the recruiting office, and everything will be added unto you.”

The British government’s post-war attitude quickly alienated Ghandi and was a great stimulus for his independence movement.

In 1919, the Government of India Act was introduced.

This introduced a national parliament with two houses for India.

About 5 million of the wealthiest Indians were given the right to vote (a very small percentage of the total population)

Within the provincial governments, ministers of education, health and public works could now be Indian nationals

The act planned for a commission to be held in 1929, to see if India was ready for more concessions/reforms.

However, the British controlled all central government and within the provincial governments, the British kept control of the key posts of tax and law and order.
Many in India felt that they had been badly let down by the British government for their part played in World War One. However, despite this feeling of being let down, India was to play a significant part in World War Two.

At the outbreak of World War II, the Indian army numbered 205,000 men. Later during World War II the Indian Army became the largest all-volunteer force in history, rising to over 2.5 million men in size.[9] These forces included tank, artillery and airborne forces. Indian soldiers earned 30 Victoria Crosses during the Second World War.

At the height of the World War, more than 2.5 million Indian troops were fighting Axis forces around the globe.[4]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/India_in_World_War_II

Top · by **Madmax** » Sat Oct 24, 2009 4:31 pm

Good info bav.. A lil history lesson.

Top · by **Reg** » Sat Oct 24, 2009 6:08 pm

tonyeh wrote:The ONLY Allied Nation that didn't have strict regualtions on its racial and sexual makeup was the U.S.S.R.

You're right mate, they shipped whole populations from the Baltics to Centra Asia to populate new conquests, they starved millions to death in the Caucauses regions to force them out, they used forced labour to construct thouands of miles of railway lines in which thousands died in the most harsh conditions and ... they sent completely untrained ethnic uzbeks, turkmens, kazaks etc.. to fight the germans who had no chance, no chance of survival whatsoever.

In fact the russians were so nice the Ukraines welcomed the germans and when the russians pushed the germans back, many ukraines fled the on going russians along with the germans. Finally as you kow from your soviet history, Stalin executed all the officiers and senior nco's in the late 30's so when Hitler invaded they were a completed leaderless and inexperienced army, hence they were battered.

Your comment is economical with the truth in the extreme, Stalin didnt need racist policies as he hated mankind as a whole.

Top · by **heimdall** » Sat Oct 24, 2009 6:22 pm

tonyeh wrote:
JBG wrote:
tonyeh wrote:
Madmax wrote:I quite liked how jack straw and that indian lady stated how other ethnics joined forces and died for this country in WW2. Griffins response was my daddy was there where was yours (jacks) loool..

Unfortunately, Straw and that "Indian lady" need to go back and read up on both wars just to find out how absurd their efforts were at trying to fool a modern audience into thinking that the makeup of Allied forces were a multiracial boiling pot of harmony fighting for the good of everyone.

It's absolute bollox.

Both the British and American forces in WWII were incredibly racist institutions and practiced segregation. Even white Quebecer French suffered racial abuse when they were stationed in England with Bomber Command.

My dad was based in Aldershot during the war at a Canadian camp and said that French Canadians were treated very differently than other Canadians...and you wouldn't have seen a black face for miles.

I have to say, I am truely sick of this false impression of the Second World War that's bounced around these days, whenever race is mentioned.

NO Allied Nations went into that war on a platform of fighting for racial harmony.

The ONLY Allied Nation that didn't have strict regualtions on its racial and sexual makeup was the U.S.S.R.

...And to see Jack Straw, a man instumental in the killing of hundreds of thousands of Iraqis in a war based on absolute lies, try to highjack the Second World War for his own grubby little political ends was sickening.

Correct and well said, although the French had north and west African troops, although I agree with your point 100%.

And by and large, the Armée de Terre treated those colonial troops like merde.

Apart from the famous "French Foreign Legion", which in fact was made up of mostly whites, the Colonials were very much second line bullet fodder for the most part. Ill equipped and segregated.

Besides, ALL of the major combatant Nations made use of Colonial troops during the war. There was nothing "honourable" about it, or racially harmonious either. Nazi Germany raised Foreign divisions that made use of coloured soldiers too.

The Nazi army had coloured soldiers! I find that very hard to beleive as it would go very much against the Nazi ideology, do you have any facts on that.

In any case you are missing the point a bit i think. The BNP is hijacking WW2 to claim that it was only the whites against the Nazis when there were many many coloured troops also fighting the Nazis, whether they were treated the same as "inigenous" troops is kind of irrelevant. Back in those days racisim was far more widespread, and thank goodness we have come a long way since then, in part due to victory in WW2.

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