Liverpool FC Forum

by **DAV** » Wed Nov 03, 2004 1:15 pm

i don't pretend to be an expert on how our scouting policy works.To be honest it baffels me, some of the signings we do and where they come from, and of course the huge amounts of money they cost.
It seems to be a fact that alot of over seas players need time to adjust to the premiership, which i can understand because of the way football is played here.
Some make it, alot don't.
We have spent milions after millions on alot of these kind of players. As have other clubs (spurs the best example)
When all around the premiership their are alot of british players with just as much talent who would not need to adapt.
Take Chelsea, scott parker,Glen johnston and even Joe Cole.
They arn't happy and would jump at the chance to play every week. Even if at present we arnt currently as bigger club as them.
Don't get me wrong i love seeing overseas players with natural talent. Zola, Di canio to name a couple.
Also why don't we look at foreign players who have played in the premier for some time at clubs such as villa,bolton and other mediocre teams.
Their would be no problem with time to settle in with them.
angel
malbronque
i like the look of that jaidi at bolton
Anelka (i no he seems to cause trouble with other players)
EDU-isn't he on a Free this summer

All i ever seem to here with Liverpool is
"He could be come a great player"
With the 100 odd million Houlier spent, how many of his overseas signings, could you honestly say were great or even good or even worth the money?

Obviously our new manager know's a great deal about football, and has the track record to show this.
His signings
Alonso is natural talent.
Garcia looks handy
Nunez?
Josemi- ok, but i don't think he's added anything we didn't already have.
Cisse- not his signing, hasn't yet fitted in (may never)

To sum up

do we have any scouts who watch the premiership?

by **Redtribe** » Wed Nov 03, 2004 1:42 pm

no of course not!!!!!

by **Redrider** » Wed Nov 03, 2004 2:30 pm

Has Ron Yeats been sacked yet ? He is/was Chief Scout.
After the wasted Houllier millions, he should be 'keel hauled' and handed over to the Boy Scouts Association for remedial training and therapy.

by **Boocity** » Wed Nov 03, 2004 5:33 pm

I heard that Ron's the ex-chief scout, but don't quote me on it

by **115-1073096938** » Wed Nov 03, 2004 7:18 pm

Good post.

While i can see what you're getting at i can also see it from the other side of the arguement.

Cheyrou was an example imo. I saw him play 3 times for Lyon, once he scored a blinder against the mancs... the other two he was superb and extremely creative, setting chances and moves up with excellent passing, vision and imagination. He looked a level above everyone on the pitch when playing in france.

His technique, passing and vision are superb. He had alot of other excellent attributes. He could have improved and been excellent had he been in the right enviroment.

Look at the standard in France. No-one can tell me division 1 sides would storm there league. I'd say the top 10-12 in there league would be lower premiership teams. The best sides would be half decent premiership sides.

SOME players need time to adapt. Others don't. Look at Garcia, Immidiate impact. Now he's faded and doesn't look half the player. To me that shows he needs time to adapt. He's certainly got ability. Alonso, well if i'm honest, he's a different class of player. To me he looks like something special.

Potential is easy to spot, bringing out that potential is a hard think to do. Its about improving ability, then implimenting it into a game on a consistent basis. A good example of what i mean is Heskey in his first season at Anfield. Improved his touch, strength, balence and skill then we started to reap the benefits. Confidence and feeling fresh are also factors of this.

Judging form and ability are also different things. I'm ****** at explaining what i mean and i'm goin for me tea, back to explain later.

by **DAV** » Thu Nov 04, 2004 8:16 am

I'm all 4 bringing in talent, even if they need time.
Only problem with us at the moment, is, any and every player we buy are needed in the first team starting from the minute they land in the country.
whatever Striker we buy in January, must be someone who can fit straight in, now that Cisse is injured. (trying not to put to much pressure on whoever it is) but time is somthing we can not wait 4, if we r to continue with our improvement and qualify 4 the champions league again.

I know this is living in the past
but the way it use to be was
bring in a player
play him in the reserves and put him on the bench until such time as the player has adapted.

(nothing to do with my post but)
LAST NIGHT
didn't think i would ever say this
THANK GOD 4 BISCAN AND TRIORE
THEY WERE EXCELLENT

by **azriahmad** » Thu Nov 04, 2004 9:27 am

At the risk of incurring your wrath and be on the receiving end of your admonishes, Stu, I don't agree with a word you say about Garcia having faded and is half the player he was after his debut. He has been contributing to the team, perhaps not scoring in all of the games but he fits what Benithez liiks for in a versatile attacker who can play up front, behind the strikers or eide midfield. This comment should apply to Kewell. The other guy who has failed to score enough is Cisse - for a 14 million striker, he lacks goal instincts and only has pace (I admit a lot of it) but he loses possession way too easily and does not drop back enough to link-up.

Maybe we are not playing the right system for him. His Auxerre goals have come from him receiving the final balls and stroking the ball home or him outpacing the defenders or plain headers. Benithez seem to require his forwards to drop a bit and receive the ball from the midfielders and sometimes run at defenders. Cisse can run away from defenders when chasing the ball, not run at defenders. His pace is his main asset, that is why he did better out at the flanks than in the middle in his last home game.

Garcia is doing well at home, his away form has to improve. Biscan has improved a lot, as has Traore. Cheyrou is like Cisse, too lightwieght for the Premiership.

by **adayinthelife** » Thu Nov 04, 2004 3:22 pm

The problem with overseas players like Garcia and cheyrou is although skillful they are lightweight.

To play in the prem lge you have to be strong and tough and some players just will never be cut out for it.

Garcia looks about 10 stone dripping wet but yet has a toughness about him and IMO will improve physically unlike cheyrou.

Most players cannot adapt unless they can compete physically as they just haven't got the time and space they get overseas.

As teams this season have sat deep at Anfield Garcia has had the space to show his skills but away from home it has been a different story.

by **charwell** » Fri Nov 05, 2004 1:23 am

Being a bit harsh on Cisse and Garcia aren't we? I think Garcia looks a quality player, that goal against Charlton for eg was recent and was the sign of a class act. Cisse looked like an outstanding raw prospect who could only improve and I was pleased with his endevour. It is nigh on impossible to land on foreign shores and be a world beater so the injury is a cruel blow. Have faith in Rafa. The good times are just around the corner ladies and gents

by **A.B.** » Fri Nov 05, 2004 2:03 am

Garcia is a quality player. He is not a natural striker but he can play as one. He can improve away but he's briliant at home. Just look at his goal against Charlton, briliant. One of the best goal's I've seen this season.

Give Garcia a bit more time and his away form will get better while his home form is solid.

by **ivor_the_injun** » Fri Nov 05, 2004 3:14 am

I think the sad thing is that we haven't seemed willing to trawl the lower divisions like we used to. I can't think of a single decent player that we brought in from anywhere other than the Premiership (recently relegated teams aside) since Rob Jones marched into the first team back in the early 90s.

There are clearly very good homegrown players in the lower English league, but - because raw talent comes even cheaper on the continent - we don't seem to want to get involved. If Carragher and Kirkland pick up knocks in a game, we could be looking at an LFC first team without any UK players involved, which although not unprecedented, is something that would disappoint me.

Although I don't know much about Bowditch, I am encouraged that we've clearly had people looking at him. Hopefully this is a sign that Benitez is thinking of the bigger picture - young lads coming through the Academy need English players to look up to.

by **Starbridge42** » Fri Nov 05, 2004 1:43 pm

I dont think they so much need English players to look up to as they need accademy graduates to look up to. If in the future that Whitebread (sp?) lad becomes a superstar and the youngsters look up to him I dont think it will matter that hes American since he would've come up through the accademy. they need people who've done it before to be there to show them if they apply themselves they can do it too.

by **115-1073096938** » Fri Nov 05, 2004 1:50 pm

I think the sad thing is that we haven't seemed willing to trawl the lower divisions like we used to. I can't think of a single decent player that we brought in from anywhere other than the Premiership (recently relegated teams aside) since Rob Jones marched into the first team back in the early 90s.

There are clearly very good homegrown players in the lower English league, but - because raw talent comes even cheaper on the continent - we don't seem to want to get involved. If Carragher and Kirkland pick up knocks in a game, we could be looking at an LFC first team without any UK players involved, which although not unprecedented, is something that would disappoint me.

Although I don't know much about Bowditch, I am encouraged that we've clearly had people looking at him. Hopefully this is a sign that Benitez is thinking of the bigger picture - young lads coming through the Academy need English players to look up to.

So you think the players in the lower leagues are all good enough?

Two words.... GET REAL!

the best two strikers in Division one are Roberts and Ellington, neither have the ability to to play for a top premier league side. Theres probably a handfull of players who can play in the premiership in the lower leagues if that.

Also as for not being able to name one since Rob Jones, try Danny Murphy.

In the first division the only player i've seen with premierhip potential (to play at a top team) is Michael Dawson, at the moment its still only potential.

by **Leonmc0708** » Fri Nov 05, 2004 1:57 pm

Guess whos Back, Back AGAIN,Guess whos back,guess whos back,guess whos back

STU is Back

No more Mr Nice Guy :angry:

by **Leonmc0708** » Fri Nov 05, 2004 4:32 pm

Redrider wrote:Has Ron Yeats been sacked yet ?

Idiot.

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