Liverpool FC Forum

by **bigmick** » Mon Oct 19, 2009 8:57 pm

JoeTerp wrote:
bigmick wrote:Fecking hell, shoock horror Mick's posts are too long . At least we can agree on something anyway.

My sincere apologies for forcing people to read them under the barrel of a gun.

if you can get newkit posters to agree, I suggest we send you to the Middle East next. Maybe you should get on some Palestine and Israli forums and just start posting at length

They could use me as a deterrant Joe, "fecking sort it out you bunch of c...s or we'll send that fecking knob Jockey bigmick in to talk to you about rotation". It'd be over in seconds laugh:.

by **LFC2007** » Mon Oct 19, 2009 9:05 pm

bigmick wrote:It matters not a jot what the kid did, it's 100% the fault of the officials that the goal stood. As I said earlier, if they don't know the rule for sure, the game should be paused until they find out. It's not a throw in FFS it's a goal, and in a multi million pound industry like football the rules have to applied correctly. It's absolutely open and shut, it clearly states in the rules that the goal is null and void and they should have found out before awarding it.

Nail on head.

by **Emerald Red** » Mon Oct 19, 2009 9:35 pm

Are there people even arguing in here about whether or not that game was decided on that beachball? This is an LFC forum? Or have I mistakingly logged into a Sunderland or Evertonian board?

by **bigmick** » Mon Oct 19, 2009 9:49 pm

Emerald Red wrote:Are there people even arguing in here about whether or not that game was decided on that beachball? This is an LFC forum? Or have I mistakingly logged into a Sunderland or Evertonian board?

Inter club bias aside, for me there can be no arguement, it was 1-0 FFS. If it had been 4-2 and it was the fourth goal, then the arguement that it didn't matter overly may have some traction. As it was though, it was 1-0 and the goal shouldn't have stood.

Now it's not even the same as Sunderland beiong given a ridiculous penalty, because that is a matter of the referees opinion. this isn't. This is a matter of fact, a clear fact which the rules cover 100%. It is exactly the same as if two footballs were on the pitch at the same time and someone scored a goal with one of them. It's the same as one of the teams having twelve players on the pitch at the moment they scored a goal. It's the same as one of their players grabbing hold of the corner flag, spearing the ball before running the full length of the pitch and 'javelining' it past Reina.

The goal is null and void, and therefore so should be the game IMHO. The fact that we played sh!t doesn't even come into it. It was 1-0 when in actual fact it was 0-0 as the goal was erroneaously awarded in a clear contravention of the rules of association football. Either a replay or the points are shared.

If we went to court, we'd win it wouldn't we surely?

by **bunglemark2** » Mon Oct 19, 2009 9:51 pm

Wot the phuck was yer man bringing a beach ball to Sunderland for anyway ? I've never been to that part of the world, but as far as I know, it's not top of the "must go sunbathing" list....

by **bigmick** » Mon Oct 19, 2009 9:55 pm

The kids irrelevent mark, as is the beachball. It's simply a case of the rules being applied, or not. Not even an interpretation of the rules in this case, just the rules. If goals like this stand, then get a couple of ball boys armed with beach balls behind the Man Utd goal on Saturday. As the corners are coming in they can volley them accross the face of the goal to distract Ferdinand and Vidic.

No, the goal doesn't count. It's clearly proven, the referee has incorrectly applied the rules of the game. Replay, and to be fair to Sunderland we have to field the same team which started the match.

by **bunglemark2** » Mon Oct 19, 2009 10:03 pm

bigmick wrote:The kids irrelevent mark, as is the beachball. It's simply a case of the rules being applied, or not. Not even an interpretation of the rules in this case, just the rules. If goals like this stand, then get a couple of ball boys armed with beach balls behind the Man Utd goal on Saturday. As the corners are coming in they can volley them accross the face of the goal to distract Ferdinand and Vidic.

No, the goal doesn't count. It's clearly proven, the referee has incorrectly applied the rules of the game. Replay, and to be fair to Sunderland we have to field the same team which started the match.

Mate, I know it's irrelevant. I'm not even blaming him to be honest. Though I do wonder why Reina didn't put a boot through the damn thing, or biaatch-slap some steward behind the goal and make him take it away. WTF was it doing in the back of the net ?
All pointless observations now though....
Though I don't see any chance the match being replayed, not a hope...

by **Emerald Red** » Mon Oct 19, 2009 10:11 pm

bigmick wrote:
Emerald Red wrote:Are there people even arguing in here about whether or not that game was decided on that beachball? This is an LFC forum? Or have I mistakingly logged into a Sunderland or Evertonian board?

Inter club bias aside, for me there can be no arguement, it was 1-0 FFS. If it had been 4-2 and it was the fourth goal, then the arguement that it didn't matter overly may have some traction. As it was though, it was 1-0 and the goal shouldn't have stood.

Now it's not even the same as Sunderland beiong given a ridiculous penalty, because that is a matter of the referees opinion. this isn't. This is a matter of fact, a clear fact which the rules cover 100%. It is exactly the same as if two footballs were on the pitch at the same time and someone scored a goal with one of them. It's the same as one of the teams having twelve players on the pitch at the moment they scored a goal. It's the same as one of their players grabbing hold of the corner flag, spearing the ball before running the full length of the pitch and 'javelining' it past Reina.

The goal is null and void, and therefore so should be the game IMHO. The fact that we played sh!t doesn't even come into it. It was 1-0 when in actual fact it was 0-0 as the goal was erroneaously awarded in a clear contravention of the rules of association football. Either a replay or the points are shared.

If we went to court, we'd win it wouldn't we surely?

Yep, mick. 100%. Another thing is, that one the second it happened, I was furious and baffled at the same time as to how it stood. Reason being is that I understood that there was a law in the game that dictates to prevent such a thing happening, being that if a foreign object that interfers with the state of play enters the field, that play must be stopped in order for it to be cleared. Now, if I'm not a trained Fifa official, or haven't read the official rule book, how is it that I knew and undertood this, yet a supposed trained official of one of the worlds top professional leagues didn't understand this? It's a f*ckin farce. The state of the refeering in this league is a joke and has been for some time.

by **bigmick** » Mon Oct 19, 2009 10:12 pm

bunglemark2 wrote:Though I don't see any chance the match being replayed, not a hope...

No we've left it too long. We should have been on the phone to FIFA at hlaf time. We should have told the ref that we were only coming out for the second half so as to avoid causing a riot in the ground, but that we would be making strong representations to the relative authorities to question the legality of the goal. We could have shown him the relevent section in the rule book and got him to admit liability there and then, to back up our case.

Soon as the game was finished, we should have got our lawyers onto it. It should have been all over Radia 5 and SKY by the time the Sunderland fans were walking in their front doors.

I'm absolutely convinced that's what the Mancs would have done. Either that or just score two goals themselves anyway.

by **bunglemark2** » Mon Oct 19, 2009 10:17 pm

bigmick wrote:I'm absolutely convinced that's what the Mancs would have done. Either that or just score two goals themselves anyway.

Exactly !
Worse still, maybe even that bell-end Owen would've got one...

by **LFC2007** » Mon Oct 19, 2009 10:45 pm

I doubt very much they'd have sanctioned a replay. In fact I'm pretty certain it isn't possible in these circumstances.

It's as much 'matter of fact' as when a goal isn't given when the ball clearly passes over all of the line, and yet to my knowledge there hasn't ever been a replay sanctioned after such an error. I think that's best for the game, otherwise the possibilities for appeals suddenly extend to quite a number of incidents, and the ramifications of re-scheduling don't do anyone any favours particularly when your schedule is already extremely tight. As an aside, (hypothetically) at appeal you wouldn't argue that the mistake cost the team the game (you cannot know whether they would have won had the mistake not occurred), you'd argue that the gravity of the error countenances a replay.

by **Sir Roger** » Mon Oct 19, 2009 11:57 pm

bigmick wrote:
bunglemark2 wrote:Though I don't see any chance the match being replayed, not a hope...

No we've left it too long. We should have been on the phone to FIFA at hlaf time. We should have told the ref that we were only coming out for the second half so as to avoid causing a riot in the ground, but that we would be making strong representations to the relative authorities to question the legality of the goal. We could have shown him the relevent section in the rule book and got him to admit liability there and then, to back up our case.

Soon as the game was finished, we should have got our lawyers onto it. It should have been all over Radia 5 and SKY by the time the Sunderland fans were walking in their front doors.

I'm absolutely convinced that's what the Mancs would have done. Either that or just score two goals themselves anyway.

I agree
But it seems that
a: nobody on that pitch or on the sidelines knows the rules of football
b: we are not a team, or manager who complains about such things. If it was tiny tears Terry or old purple nose, they would have kicked off and possibly walked off at such an injustice. But Rafa accepted it and is actually getting credit for not using it as a reason for the loss. If he didnt want to be seen to be using it as an excuse for losing, surely he could have ripped into the ref and his assistants for gross incpmpetence?
Football itself is full of such incidents which, although having a dramatic effect on the outcome of the match and eventually the standing in the league table, are just accepted as being part of the game. It seems there is neither the will nor the ability to stop such things happening. Disgraceful and embarrassing really...

by **LFC2007** » Tue Oct 20, 2009 12:23 am

TBH, I don't think it needed to be highlighted.

by **Sir Roger** » Tue Oct 20, 2009 12:26 am

LFC2007 wrote:TBH, I don't think it needed to be highlighted.

Why not?

by **LFC2007** » Tue Oct 20, 2009 12:32 am

Sir Roger wrote:
LFC2007 wrote:TBH, I don't think it needed to be highlighted.

Why not?

I think balloon-gate has a certain uniqueness about it - you don't see it too often, not with a balloon that size anyway.
It'll stay in the memory so it didn't need any embellishment from the manager.

Besides, if he came out and delivered a public rebuke, he'd no doubt have been portrayed as a sore loser.

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