Liverpool FC Forum

by **GYBS** » Thu Sep 25, 2008 3:14 pm

ah well it was nearly 4 years ago

by **Number 9** » Thu Sep 25, 2008 3:15 pm

Judge wrote:
GYBS wrote:it was aplay on words from Andy wit Grays commentary when Gerrard scored that screamer against Olympiakos in 2004 - Think his words were get in there son you beauty

i think you mean What A Hit Son

that means if you play the letters around you should be called WASH

Or SHAW!!

by **GYBS** » Thu Sep 25, 2008 3:16 pm

I can see this going on for a while now

by **Judge** » Thu Sep 25, 2008 3:18 pm

Number 9 wrote:
Judge wrote:
GYBS wrote:it was aplay on words from Andy wit Grays commentary when Gerrard scored that screamer against Olympiakos in 2004 - Think his words were get in there son you beauty

i think you mean What A Hit Son

that means if you play the letters around you should be called WASH

Or SHAW!!

nice one baz

by **Roger Red Hat** » Thu Sep 25, 2008 3:25 pm

or WANK

oh no, that doesn't work does it?

by **maypaxvobiscum** » Thu Sep 25, 2008 7:31 pm

Effes wrote:Who was the clot who said he'd rather see us lose 6-0 to Arsenal to give us a wake up call?

Whoever it was needs a wake up call himself.

hey that was me. but i didnt say 6-0. i would like us to score a goal at least

nah but seriously go read the thread again. it was one of those ''said in the heat of moment'' thing where i was feeling really frustrated trying to put my point across to GYBS.

by **maypaxvobiscum** » Thu Sep 25, 2008 7:35 pm

Lee J wrote:or WANK

oh no, that doesn't work does it?

What A Nice Kick

by **kazza** » Thu Sep 25, 2008 8:32 pm

LFC2007 wrote:To my mind, defending a player is normal, abusing your own manager/players, and even coaches is not normal and is unacceptable.

by **maypaxvobiscum** » Thu Sep 25, 2008 8:42 pm

kazza wrote:
LFC2007 wrote:To my mind, defending a player is normal, abusing your own manager/players, and even coaches is not normal and is unacceptable.

spewing off vulgarities is not cool for sure. but what about justified criticism?

by **Sabre** » Thu Sep 25, 2008 9:10 pm

Justified criticism is ok. In these posts there has been justified criticism, but that's not always like that.

And GBYS' defence of Kuyt admirable. Our fellow member has defended the player on a red shirt even when he has been compared to Berbatov. People laugh because Berbatov is a better player, but GBYS does well to defend the player in red and saying Berbatov still has to prove his worth in a top club, he's just defending our player with every resource he has and for me that's not laughable.

Kuyt is compared to one of the most expensive players in the league. We do not do that with Hyypia and Carraguer, we do not compare them with the best CB in the world, we appreciate them for what they are with their good attributes, and we learn to not give much importance to their known weaknesses, nothing to do with being local lads or not (Hyypia isn't) it's just the normal thing we do with players that are red but are not our scape goats. We forgive Arbeloa's, Hyypias and Carraguer's mistakes, I don't see why we can't do a bit of that with Kuyt, who besides works a lot.

I just would like to see us acknowledging Kuyt's weaknesses, but also naturally appreciating his strong points, just like Xabi did the other day when he explained that they started to control the game when Kuyt was deeper, instead of saying it's our merit.

And he does a couple things more than running a lot, the other day against Stoke he made some strengthy runs and a couple of good passes. OF course he's not an Etoo an Aguero a Villa or a Berbatov, but I don't know neither if it's realistic to think about a Liverpool with a world class player in every position. Surely in every winning team in any country there have been world class players but also "water carriers" people who do ugly job?

Let's appreciate Kuyt for what he is. Let's acknowledge aswell he's not top class (we aren't blind) but let's not kill him because he isn't. He hasn't costed 30 M after all -- he wasn't cheap neither. Or at the very least let's not insult him!

by **maypaxvobiscum** » Thu Sep 25, 2008 9:37 pm

hi Sabre. i do apppreciate Kuyt's hardwork and what he brings to the team. i do feel however he wouldnt have to work as hard as he does if he could control the ball better. maybe he runs and tracks back so much that when he finally gets to the box to shoot he has no energy left to score. the way i see it, Gerrard should be on the right, with Kuyt as second striker instead of Keane. I feel Keane, for the price we paid isnt worth it though i hope he goes on to prove me wrong starting with a goal on his derby debut.

the money could well be spent on an area that needed beefing up and that would be right back. if we had a right back we was really good at defending AND attacking (the way Cosmin Contra did when he was at Alaves), Kuyt could keep his berth at right wing as he could support the defender when he pushes forward. otherwise i find he our right side is being wasted with Kuyt there.

he offers hardly any threat to the oppo. he rarely gets into positions to score and when he does he misses it or it bounces off somewhere and goes in. i would prefer my right winger to be a right winger and attack instead of tracking back so much as it defeats the purpose of having DMs and DFs. maybe Rafa is to be blamed for placing Kuyt at his current position as he feels he's the best we've got there but why not Gerrard? we could do with

gerrard---xabi---mash---riera

that could accomodate the best 3 midfielders we have. and perhaps someone like El-Zhar could play behind Torres. i find the youngster, unlike Kuyt has the flair and trickery to beat players and win us valuable free kicks or penalties just like how Sinama was capable of doing so. all in all i do appreciate Kuyt but i dont see and understand why he is so undroppable. he isnt as fast as Ngog or Babel or El-Zhar and thats such a dent to our counter attacks.

by **tonyeh** » Thu Sep 25, 2008 10:45 pm

Judge wrote:
GYBS wrote:it was aplay on words from Andy wit Grays commentary when Gerrard scored that screamer against Olympiakos in 2004 - Think his words were get in there son you beauty

i think you mean What A Hit Son

that means if you play the letters around you should be called WASH

http://video.google.com/videopl....f&hl=en

by **Jimmy the Weasel** » Thu Sep 25, 2008 10:51 pm

WAHSWAH is it then!

by **Sabre** » Thu Sep 25, 2008 11:19 pm

I agree many things of that post max, not the bit about Kuyt getting ran out of energy because he tracks back too much though. It's true that on front of the goal he shoots to the doll, a expression we use here he shoots without aiming, "to see what happens", he lacks that finishing quality a top class striker needs to have.

But I don't agree that much he doesn't get into positions to score, he recently for instance tapped in a good cross of Riera, running well to the second post while our other striker came to the first. I hope that kind of finnishing will occur more often, those appeareances in the second post with a decent crosser is the kind of thing I want to see with RIera, and something we hadn't for ages.

I'll defend Kuyt aswell making a criticism of Pennant, who should have posed more competition in the right wing, and to Rafa, the man who hasn't brought someone that can sit down Kuyt bringing a proper player for there. Just as I think Rafa has provided a good future to the Liverpool CB (I was worried about how we'd replace Hyypia and Carra on the long term), and just as I think he was spot on with Torres, and armouring a strong central midfield, I think in the wings Rafa hasn't been spot on. He's had time to bring someone good for the right, but we've always played with a patch there, either Luis Garcia who was versatile, or Kuyt, or who wasn't supposed to play there, or we tried Benayoun to see what happens... too many patches and not permanent solutions.

The only time we hadn't a patch in the right was the time in which Gerrard played there and excelled. I wonder why Rafa was dismissing criticism back then in the lines of "if Gerrard scores 30 in central midfield then I'll think about it", and now isn't trying a formula that was succesful in the past. If it's because there are players looking at his eyes and telling what to do, then Rafa should go somewhere else where he has the control of the dressroom. My suspicion is that for some reason most of us fail to see, he does rate a lot Kuyt's work in the right.

I for one would love to see

gerrard---xabi---mash---riera

playing, Like you.

Kuyt isn't what we all dream, but he has not the fault of being a tough worker and having little competition from other members of the squad. Those members of the squad deserve more stick when we moan about the right wing.

by **bigmick** » Fri Sep 26, 2008 1:05 am

In fairness Sabes it was the fella who was defending Kuyt who compared him to Berbatov, comparing their goal scoring records in their respective first seasons, given they cost an initial similar fee. He was then asked (not unreasonably) that since he had brought Berbatov into it, who did he think was the better footballer.

There then followed hours of pointless posturing where we skirted around the issue, rather than just accpeting the obvious fact that Berbatov is a better footballer. As you say Sabes, it doesn't really matter anyway but there is little wonder people get exasperated trying to discuss things sensibly with a faction which keep churning out utter nonsense.

We all know he works hard. We all know he puts in more effort than pretty much anybody else in the team. We all know that you don't necessarily need a World Class player in every position. Most of us accept that with the exception of Gerrard he's the best bet on the right in a 4-5-1. Most of us accept he's a nice bloke, and a hard worker.

Some of us though have grave reservations about Kuyt in a 4-4-2 on the right, and even more so up front but as you say Sabes, it isn't his fault he remains our best bet. During the last day or so though we've been comparing him first with Berbatov, and latterly with Wayne Rooney who is also "just a willing runner". I'm all for defending any player and any point of view, but it does get to the point where it's bordering on the ridiculous.

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