Liverpool FC Forum

I can't see Carroll being too effective for Brendan's style either, I think he'll be favouring a more 'athletic, slimmer, sharper centre forward' who can turn on a 5p and run like the wind.

Carroll has the turning circle of a cruise liner and he's built like a brick out house thus he's heavy and just not nimble enough.

but thats just my thoughts

Roger Red Hat » Wed Jun 06, 2012 12:28 pm wrote:I can't see Carroll being too effective for Brendan's style either, I think he'll be favouring a more 'athletic, slimmer, sharper centre forward' who can turn on a 5p and run like the wind.

Carroll has the turning circle of a cruise liner and he's built like a brick out house thus he's heavy and just not nimble enough.

but thats just my thoughts

Was Graham like that for Swansea ?

Boxscarf » Wed Jun 06, 2012 12:28 pm wrote:

Benny The Noon » Wed Jun 06, 2012 11:16 am wrote:Off course you don't see it.

Carroll had a poor season and it a big lad who struggled until the last month so the colours have been nailed - Carroll is judged by that poor period. And because he is big and good in the air that means automatically he is rubbish on the ground - Crouch suffered the same stereo type

Andy's mobility is the biggest concern to me, there is no question that he's good with his feet i.e. Turning John Terry over in the goal against Chelsea in the 2-1 FA Cup defeat.

He struggled last season because he wasn't getting games in a row to get himself fit but towards the end of the season he was looking sharper and far more mobile.

Benny The Noon » Wed Jun 06, 2012 11:36 am wrote:

Roger Red Hat » Wed Jun 06, 2012 12:28 pm wrote:I can't see Carroll being too effective for Brendan's style either, I think he'll be favouring a more 'athletic, slimmer, sharper centre forward' who can turn on a 5p and run like the wind.

Carroll has the turning circle of a cruise liner and he's built like a brick out house thus he's heavy and just not nimble enough.

but thats just my thoughts

Was Graham like that for Swansea ?

who cares? we're talking about Liverpool now, not Swansea.

Roger Red Hat » Wed Jun 06, 2012 12:38 pm wrote:

Benny The Noon » Wed Jun 06, 2012 11:36 am wrote:

Roger Red Hat » Wed Jun 06, 2012 12:28 pm wrote:I can't see Carroll being too effective for Brendan's style either, I think he'll be favouring a more 'athletic, slimmer, sharper centre forward' who can turn on a 5p and run like the wind.

Carroll has the turning circle of a cruise liner and he's built like a brick out house thus he's heavy and just not nimble enough.

but thats just my thoughts

Was Graham like that for Swansea ?

who cares? we're talking about Liverpool now, not Swansea.

But he used the system at Swansea with the players there - there was no lighting quick striker to turn on a six pence ( because they play better in a counter attack team )

Graham is someone like Carroll and he fitted into the pass and move system - that is the point

But Brendan now has funds available and the prestige of managing Liverpool FC to lure a better quality of striker. not make do.

Roger Red Hat » Wed Jun 06, 2012 12:44 pm wrote:But Brendan now has funds available and the prestige of managing Liverpool FC to lure a better quality of striker. not make do.

Like who ?

Why not try a guy already at the club

i agree benny, got to give carroll the chance. but i think long term we may see another striker join the club. leaner fitter young lad thats like a heat seeking ferret on speed.

Benny The Noon » Wed Jun 06, 2012 11:24 am wrote:From Rodgers

“He’s came here for an awful lot of money and he’s still very young,” Rodgers said. “I don’t think anyone would have argued when they saw his period at Newcastle where he did terrifically well. When you come to a club like this one the shirt weighs much heavier than any other shirt. The expectation and the weight of expectation is phenomenal.


“My job next year is to try and lift some of that weight off the shirt. I’ll take the pressure. The players can just go and concentrate on performing and if you do that you’ll get the result eight or nine times out of 10 because of your talent. That will be the same for Andy and any other player. Then, like I say, we’ll take time to review where we’re at and then look forward.

He'll lift some of the pressure off of Carroll by benching him...

Look at the men who led the line for the teams we were hoping to make ground on last year. Aguero, Rooney, Van Persie, Adebayor and Drogba. Carroll isn’t in their class. He is slower, less agile and technically poorer than all those players. And people are saying he is good on the floor. Do you really think he has as good a touch, footballing brain and is as good a passer as the players I just mentioned?

Can Carroll do better than he has so far? Of course he can. The last 18 months have almost been a non event. Play him upfront for 38 games in a Liverpool team playing well and with good leadership from the sidelines and I would expect him to get 15 goals. But so would Djibril Cisse, Earnshaw, Yakubu, etc, but we don’t want any of those players anywhere near our first team Why? Because despite decent goal returns for their clubs they are very ordinary footballers, just like Carroll.

Carroll comes across as a nice guy and anyone who criticises him for lack of effort on the pitch is talking out their backside. But the truth is that he is out of his depth playing for us and if Spurs had signed him we would all be laughing at them right now for putting their hopes on such a poor player.

And there is nothing wrong with having an open frank discussion on an internet DISCUSSION forum. It doesn’t make you any less of a fan for believing that Carroll is not good enough and should be replaced by a better player.

If I was Gaffer I'd try him out until January then make a decision.

Roger Red Hat » Wed Jun 06, 2012 11:44 am wrote:But Brendan now has funds available and the prestige of managing Liverpool FC to lure a better quality of striker. not make do.

just because he had limited funds at swansea didnt mean he had to go out and buy a target man striker like danny graham. plenty of small, quick strikers around in the lower league`s too he could have signed. there is a generation of fans who just equate target men to ale house footy when infact some of the best footballing teams this country has ever produced had target men up front.

ycsatbjywtbiastkamb » Wed Jun 06, 2012 12:03 pm wrote:

Roger Red Hat » Wed Jun 06, 2012 11:44 am wrote:But Brendan now has funds available and the prestige of managing Liverpool FC to lure a better quality of striker. not make do.

just because he had limited funds at swansea didnt mean he had to go out and buy a target man striker like danny graham. plenty of small, quick strikers around in the lower league`s too he could have signed. there is a generation of fans who just equate target men to ale house footy when infact some of the best footballing teams this country has ever produced had target men up front.

Which teams and who are the target men? I can only think of drogba and drogba in his prime is in another class than Carroll... As much as I hate his diving and crying antics...

The concept of a “target man” basically means having someone playing upfront who you can kick the ball towards regardless of where you on the pitch and he will be big enough and strong enough to get control of the ball most of the time or put an effort on goal. This is a dated strategy, at least for the teams that finish higher up the table.

Over the last 15 years we have seen more and more that teams in the Premiership have moved away from using crosses as the primary method to create chances. And we have seen high balls that bypass the area commonly described as “between the lines” becomes less and less prominent.

First and foremost managers at top clubs will look for players with technical and tactical ability. Then they will look as the other pieces to see if the player will make it in their side. If someone is 7 foot, stronger than Arnold Schwarzenegger and can attack a ball in the air like John Terry, than great. But it’s not a primary reason to buy a player and not what you should base your team on if you want rub shoulders with the best.

I would assume and hope that Rodgers bought Danny Graham to Swansea primarily because he believed he was a good finisher, had strong technical ability and a consistent first touch, a good footballing brain, the ability to participate in build up play, a natural hard worker, etc.

Look at Liverpool... 

Kevin Keegan, Kenny Dalglish, Ian Rush, John Aldridge, Robbie Fowler, Micheal Owen...   all quick and slight of build.