Liverpool FC Forum

by **Igor Zidane** » Sun Oct 24, 2010 5:33 pm

You put it so much better than me tony , great post.

by **Emerald Red** » Sun Oct 24, 2010 6:14 pm

Big Niall wrote:
Igor Zidane wrote:
Big Niall wrote:
roberto green wrote:
Big Niall wrote:quote]
so considering she won 3 elections out of 3, the majority of british people are ?

Nope just that most are southern selfish b@stards who look after themselves first who have no family values.

I think most people vote for the government that will be best for them.

Well that's what your f.uckin slag of a mate brought into this country . ME ME ME , F.UCK everyone else . Aslong as i'm alright jack . Privatise whole industries and f.uck the consequenses, f.uck the people that lose there jobs and f.uck the towns and cities that were destroyed by here policies . Aslong as you can buy your shares in british gas that's all ok . F.uckin scum of the earth that government . Your middle class and you benefited from her policies but tough sh!t on the working class who were broken by her . Nice ,you must be so proud of yourself.

what's to stop a working class person staying in school, doing well, go to university and get a good degree and then one of the many high paying jobs in London. London was booming in the 1980s.

People have the power to decide their own future. If you drop out of education early or don't put in the work in school, then they are increasing the chances of having a hard life.

the manufacturing base in the UK is in decline, nothing you can do about it . In the future the gap between the highly educated and the rest will get bigger.

You're so full of bollox (and yourself) that it's untrue.

BTW, Thatcher's evil claws extended to well beyond the mainland UK. Her Cromwellian plans for the North of Ireland were nothing short of pure tyranical madness and thank f*ck that never got approved of. She also supplied landmines and munitions to the Khmer Rouge, lending her old mate Pol Pot a bit of a hand, and this was after the fact that the atrocities of the Killing Fields came to light. A rotten c*nt of the highest order, and this is the kind of b@stard you'd vote for?

by **Benny The Noon** » Sun Oct 24, 2010 6:17 pm

Big Niall wrote:
Igor Zidane wrote:
Big Niall wrote:
roberto green wrote:
Big Niall wrote:quote]
so considering she won 3 elections out of 3, the majority of british people are ?

Nope just that most are southern selfish b@stards who look after themselves first who have no family values.

I think most people vote for the government that will be best for them.

Well that's what your f.uckin slag of a mate brought into this country . ME ME ME , F.UCK everyone else . Aslong as i'm alright jack . Privatise whole industries and f.uck the consequenses, f.uck the people that lose there jobs and f.uck the towns and cities that were destroyed by here policies . Aslong as you can buy your shares in british gas that's all ok . F.uckin scum of the earth that government . Your middle class and you benefited from her policies but tough sh!t on the working class who were broken by her . Nice ,you must be so proud of yourself.

what's to stop a working class person staying in school, doing well, go to university and get a good degree and then one of the many high paying jobs in London. London was booming in the 1980s.

People have the power to decide their own future. If you drop out of education early or don't put in the work in school, then they are increasing the chances of having a hard life.

the manufacturing base in the UK is in decline, nothing you can do about it . In the future the gap between the highly educated and the rest will get bigger.

Spoken like the true middle class **** you are .

Twa.tcher looked after middle class f.ucking pr.icks and ruined the lives of millions of Nothern Working Class (and Welsh) Families .

Typical f.ucking Tory looking after the rich south and the same will happen with the current PM.

by **Emerald Red** » Sun Oct 24, 2010 6:20 pm

This knob thinks everyone has equal rights and opportunites in life to first get into a good school, get good grades, then every college in the land will have enough space to take everyone in, give them good grades again, then every Uni will have enough space (of course everyone can afford to pay for it in his mind) take them in, get degrees, then walk out of Uni and straight into a nice cushy job! Not in my f*cking world, mate!

by **tonyeh** » Sun Oct 24, 2010 7:21 pm

Big Niall wrote:what's to stop a working class person staying in school, doing well, go to university and get a good degree and then one of the many high paying jobs in London. London was booming in the 1980s.

People have the power to decide their own future. If you drop out of education early or don't put in the work in school, then they are increasing the chances of having a hard life.

Unfortunately Niall, you don't get to put your kids through a Uni if you're on the dole, with no hope of securing work in the future.

That was the reality that faced many Northern families in the 80's (Southern too). The opportunity simply wasn't there for an awful lot of people.

Coupled with that, the idea of "class" and "knowing your place" was very prevailent in British society and Thatcher tried her best to further that concept. Many working class kids just didn't go to college or university and that was that.Thankfully, a lot of that particular sentiment seems to have disappeared these days and a much higher emphasis is now placed on education and its benefits. But, in the late 70's / early 80's, the opposite was still very much entranched in the social system of Britain.

And also, by and large, people DON'T have much power over their futures in any real capacity. You have to deal with the cards that are dealt to you.

It helps an awful lot though, if you have some means to help you get by and that's hard when the industry you (or your father) worked in for 25 years is smashed and you find yourself abandoned, with no hope.

Grand notions of University go out the window pretty quick.

by **Reg** » Sun Oct 24, 2010 7:25 pm

tonyeh wrote:However, she was supportive of early 80's London city business. The Yuppies generally did well out of Thatcher and the financial sector in general was kept afloat. Of course, that didn't help many people when their houses went in to negative equity later in the 80's after England experienced their first property crisis largely due to the deregulation act of 1980.

I'm not going to get involved in a political debate because folks hav their own interpretation of events and their causes and consequences, sufficient to say I disgaree with every point Tonyeh made (Privatisation never works? :-) ) however its worth being aware of the ECONOMICAL aspects of Maggie's period in power.

One point thats hasn't been mentioned is the City's big bang and the great benefits that brought the country, making us a financial powerhouse with the jobs and wealth that brought. Bear in mind th multiplier effect before someone replies it only affected the few.

Economically, Maggie worked turned this country round, politically she sacrificed her legacy (popularity) to create 30 years of growth.

History will judge she said the right decision.

by **maypaxvobiscum** » Sun Oct 24, 2010 7:33 pm

whats the meaning of "on the dole" ?

by **tonyeh** » Sun Oct 24, 2010 8:02 pm

maypaxvobiscum wrote:whats the meaning of "on the dole" ?

Social welfare Maypax.

dole

by **Big Niall** » Sun Oct 24, 2010 9:19 pm

Reg wrote:
tonyeh wrote:However, she was supportive of early 80's London city business. The Yuppies generally did well out of Thatcher and the financial sector in general was kept afloat. Of course, that didn't help many people when their houses went in to negative equity later in the 80's after England experienced their first property crisis largely due to the deregulation act of 1980.

I'm not going to get involved in a political debate because folks hav their own interpretation of events and their causes and consequences, sufficient to say I disgaree with every point Tonyeh made (Privatisation never works? :-) ) however its worth being aware of the ECONOMICAL aspects of Maggie's period in power.

One point thats hasn't been mentioned is the City's big bang and the great benefits that brought the country, making us a financial powerhouse with the jobs and wealth that brought. Bear in mind th multiplier effect before someone replies it only affected the few.

Economically, Maggie worked turned this country round, politically she sacrificed her legacy (popularity) to create 30 years of growth.

History will judge she said the right decision.

very well put.

by **Big Niall** » Sun Oct 24, 2010 9:23 pm

tonyeh wrote:
Big Niall wrote:what's to stop a working class person staying in school, doing well, go to university and get a good degree and then one of the many high paying jobs in London. London was booming in the 1980s.

People have the power to decide their own future. If you drop out of education early or don't put in the work in school, then they are increasing the chances of having a hard life.

Unfortunately Niall, you don't get to put your kids through a Uni if you're on the dole, with no hope of securing work in the future.

That was the reality that faced many Northern families in the 80's (Southern too). The opportunity simply wasn't there for an awful lot of people.

Coupled with that, the idea of "class" and "knowing your place" was very prevailent in British society and Thatcher tried her best to further that concept. Many working class kids just didn't go to college or university and that was that.Thankfully, a lot of that particular sentiment seems to have disappeared these days and a much higher emphasis is now placed on education and its benefits. But, in the late 70's / early 80's, the opposite was still very much entranched in the social system of Britain.

And also, by and large, people DON'T have much power over their futures in any real capacity. You have to deal with the cards that are dealt to you.

It helps an awful lot though, if you have some means to help you get by and that's hard when the industry you (or your father) worked in for 25 years is smashed and you find yourself abandoned, with no hope.

Grand notions of University go out the window pretty quick.

you have put together some good points here. Some of the others could do with thinking about their points in the same way you have. There is way too much swearing and a lack of coherent arguments by the anti thatcher crowd.

by **Benny The Noon** » Sun Oct 24, 2010 9:26 pm

Big Niall saying there is too much swearing - now that's ironic

by **Big Niall** » Sun Oct 24, 2010 9:27 pm

Emerald Red wrote:You're so full of bollox (and yourself) that it's untrue.

BTW, Thatcher's evil claws extended to well beyond the mainland UK. Her Cromwellian plans for the North of Ireland were nothing short of pure tyranical madness and thank f*ck that never got approved of. She also supplied landmines and munitions to the Khmer Rouge, lending her old mate Pol Pot a bit of a hand, and this was after the fact that the atrocities of the Killing Fields came to light. A rotten c*nt of the highest order, and this is the kind of b@stard you'd vote for?

supporting wrotten regimes is part of politics. In the 1980s the cold war was on and communists were seen as a major threat, hence people like pinochet were supported.

You pick the side you are less against and do a deal with them. Just yesterday the Iraq information showed the US turned a blind eye to many attrocities that "their" Iraqis were doing.

Politics has always been that way and always will.

by **LFC2007** » Sun Oct 24, 2010 9:34 pm

Made some necessary economic reforms but managed that change in a way that caused untold social strife, particularly in the North and regions. The great irony in all of it is that she projected herself as a woman of victorian values; of family, stability, deference etc..

by **Reg** » Sun Oct 24, 2010 10:05 pm

LFC2007 wrote:Made some necessary economic reforms but managed that change in a way that caused untold social strife, particularly in the North and regions. The great irony in all of it is that she projected herself as a woman of victorian values; of family, stability, deference etc..

Would say you're understating the massive strength of character and determination needed to bring about those changes. I dont think any other politician at the time or since had the ability to achieve what she achieved domestically, whilst playing such a strong role in global politics be it either aligning with Ronald Reagan to bring about the collapse of the Soviet Union or fighting our corner in the EEC 'Give me the rebate I want or we'll pay nothing' - and europe repeatedly backed down, but also in policy and other aspects. She also formed powerful relationships with Helmut Schimdt and Mitterand to ensure europe got heard on the world stage.

I understand many of you hate her, however it doesn't mean you shouldnt have an appreciation of her achievements.

by **RED BEERGOGGLES** » Sun Oct 24, 2010 11:09 pm

I would suspect that given her fragile mental health and subsequent dementia she has very little memory of her callous and disgraceful repression of the Miners Strike and the close knit communities she destroyed ... maybe she has little or no recollection of the misery she inflicted on Workingclass people and the families she destroyed ....it may even be that she shuffles of this mortal coil oblivious of the riots and violence she inflicted on her own country due to her introduction of the Poll Tax ..... It certainly would be a futile effort on her part if she could possibly recollect the sinking of The Belgrano an unarmed troop ship that she personally gave the order to be destroyed .....and one would certainly hope she may with her last breath remember that she held in high esteem and indeed considered that well known genocidal dictator General Pinochet as a personal friend .................. needless to say I very much doubt she will hear the parties all over England that will welcome her demise .....

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