Liverpool FC Forum

by **RED BEERGOGGLES** » Sun Jul 04, 2010 5:52 pm

Players who have genuinely impressed me in South Africa
albeit from the usual suspects(ie THE GERMANS ) who has looked for you the best 5 players the unsung heroes if you like

Jorge Fucile Porto's Uruguayan defender has been very impressive and for me would fit comfortably into any top team

Nicolas Lodeiro Uruguayan midfielder with Ajax ,albeit from his sending off has looked combative gifted and a genuine playmaker .

Jorge Valdivia of Chile .....a brilliant attacking midfielder with a genuine gift of picking a pass, and his ball skills and close control are equally as impressive

My surprise inclusion is Nigeria's Lukman Haruna although Nigeria had a wretched tournament this lad stayed assured on the ball and his distribution was first class (pity his teammates were dire) reminds me of Chelsea's Mikel

Finally the star of Ghana's attempt at becoming the only African team to reach the Semi's ....Kevin-Prince Boateng... Spurs will be seriously kicking themselves over this one.... brilliant inventive when attacking ,and equally as competitive in Midfield

Well that's who I picked out and sometimes its difficult when the side in question is struggling but class seems to find a way of shining through .... be interested to know other peoples picks excluding the top teams .. I think Uruguay are a genuine surprise inclusion in the last four and that's why I have included them

by **RED BEERGOGGLES** » Sun Jul 04, 2010 5:58 pm

Sorry people posted it in the wrong place oops :blush:

by **RED BEERGOGGLES** » Sun Jul 04, 2010 7:50 pm

could the mods possibly move this to Football World Wide discussion might develop into an interesting thread when put in the right place :oops:

by **Big Niall** » Sun Jul 04, 2010 9:12 pm

RED BEERGOGGLES wrote:could the mods possibly move this to Football World Wide discussion might develop into an interesting thread when put in the right place

any manager that buys a player because he looked good in a few games should be shot.

check out his club form.

by **andy_g** » Sun Jul 04, 2010 9:51 pm

astoundingly enough, big niall is right!

for every villa and ardiles there is a diao and a diouff...

by **RED BEERGOGGLES** » Sun Jul 04, 2010 10:57 pm

The thread doesn't even throw a hint about the purchasing of said players.... it was who impressed for you personally and to pick your top 5

by **Big Niall** » Sun Jul 04, 2010 10:58 pm

andy_g wrote:astoundingly enough, big niall is right!

for every villa and ardiles there is a diao and a diouff...

astoundingly enough - the sun rises in the east.

by **LFC2007** » Sun Jul 04, 2010 11:19 pm

For every Newton and Einstein there is a BigNiall...

This must be the only Liverpool forum without one, but with Roy's Liverpool future hanging by a thread now seems like a good time to start assessing all of the potential candidates for the job, whether for the short-term or the long-term. As we already have three, maybe four, Rafa threads and one giant Roy thread, this is intended to be a relatively Rafa/Roy free zone.

I'll start by listing with a synopsis a selection of managers who might be worth considering or who have previously been put forward as possible candidates for the job, starting with a few of the more experienced candidates:

Kenny Dalglish

Widely regarded as the club's best ever player, he went on to become player-manager for five seasons in the late 80s. In that time the club won three league titles, two FA cups and a League cup....playing arguably the most attractive football of a generation. After a break from the game, he took over at Blackburn whom he guided to second-place in the league and then a league title in 1995. Since then he's had brief but less successful spells at Newcastle and Celtic, before he returned to Anfield in an Ambassadorial/Advisory role last year.

My view: Some say he's "past it", others that he's destined to fail, but taking into account his experience, his record and the esteem with which he's held at the club, I wouldn't be so sure. The game itself has changed to some extent over the last 20 years - it's faster, more physical, more more technical and tactical these days - and the the money and media interest is bigger than ever. But it's still fundamentally the same game of passing and moving, pressing and tackling, and rolling your sleeves up. How much can the ability to scout a player - the ability, say, to distinguish a quality passer from a weaker one - or the ability to motivate and interact with people, be compromised by the passage of time? I wouldn't say it's not a risk because 10 years out of full-time management, and a short spell at that, to me suggests risk, but he otherwise has all the credentials, it may also be his last chance (nostalgia creeping in) and therefore I would welcome his appointment on an interim basis.

Guus Hiddink

A cosmopolitan like Roy, he's managed all over the world, from South Korea, to Russia, to Holland, to Spain, to England and Turkey, but unlike Roy he has high-level experience, and major trophies to his name. At PSV he was assistant manager in the early 1980s before taking the reins himself in 1987. There, he won three league titles, three league cups and a European Cup. He, like so many other foreign managers/players seem to do, had a brief period as a manager in Turkey (Fenerbahce), before taking over Valencia (wikipedia doesn't elaborate). To cut a long story short, he then fecked around Europe for a bit in the 90s without much success, before making his name again in the noughties with the transformation of THAT South Korea side which faired so well in the 2002 World Cup, before another very successful spell back at his beloved Eindhoven - three more league titles, a UCL semi-final appearance (where in the 2nd leg they dominated AC Milan as I recall). Followed: an unfortunate exit in the 2006 world cup as head coach of Australia, and a semi-final appearance with Russia in Euro 2008. His last major was as interim manager of Chelsea, taking over from Scolari. He was something of a revelation in the three or four months he was there, winning 11 of 13 league games, taking them to the brink of a place in the UCL final, and winning the FA cup.

My view: If we could nab him I'd have him. Though his record suggests a preference for the international adventure and so part-time management, at club level he has had notable success at PSV and Chelsea. His range of experience and the context of his successes tells me that he's a very astute manager capable of getting a team to punch above its weight. The downside is, like some of the others, you wouldn't bank on him hanging around for long enough to really build for the long-term. That's if we could prise him away from Turkey, not likely.

Marcello Lippi

Regarded as one of the great Italian managers, Lippi worked his way up the managerial ladder taking on small-medium sized Italian clubs before he getting the call from Juventus, the club where he would make his name. There, in his first spell, he won three league titles and a European cup (plus 2x RU) in five seasons. Like a lot of Italian managers seem to do he then took over a rival club in Inter Milan for a short and unsuccessful spell in 2000. He rejoined Juve the following year and picked up where left off, winning two more Serie 'A' titles and for a third time finishing runner up in the UCL. In 2006 he guided his side to World Cup victory, but in South Africa crashed out at the group stage. He has never managed outside of Italy and doesn't speak English, and don't be fooled by the hair, he's only 62.

My view: It's probably the fact that he's never played or managed outside of Italy that puts me off most, especially now he's older. I guess you could argue that football transcends cultural boundaries, and that he could always learn English etc. like Trappatoni or Capello have done - and he could - but I'd want to be certain he has that desire to learn and adapt. Not my first choice, but with a record like that you wouldn't rule him out.

Ottmar Hitzfeld

Another of the game's elder statesman, Hitzfeld - aka "The General" - made his name at Borussia Dortmund before later establishing himself as one of the all-time greats at Bayern Munich. The Dortmund side he inherited in 1991 finished tenth the previous season; in the six years of his tenure that followed, they would never finish outside of the top four. In his first season Dortmund finished second, level on points with 1st-placed Stuttgart. The season after that they made but lost (to Juve) the final of the UEFA cup. Their rise to the very pinnacle of German and European football arrived soon thereafter; winning two league titles in succession (94/95-95/6) and the European cup in 1996-1997, beating Mr Lippi's Juventus (and they really were THE team to beat) in the final. In 1998 he took over from Trappatoni at Bayern. The side he inherited finished 2nd the season previous, and in his first season there they won the league title by a record margin of 15 points. That season he also guided them to another European Cup final, only to lose to you know who, and you know how. In that most successful six-year period, his Bayern side won four league titles, three German cups and another (his 2nd) European Cup. After a three year break from the game in 2004, he returned to Bayern in 2007, his side completing the league and cup double the following year. He is currently the manager of Switzerland whom he guided to World Cup qualification for the 2010 WC, where despite beating Spain, they were eliminated at the group phase.

My view: I knew he'd won loads at Bayern, and that he'd managed Dortmund to the European cup but I didn't quite realise the scale of his achievements until I dug a little deeper. More specifically, the fact that he took a Dortmund side that had finished tenth, to second and then to successive league titles and finally a European Cup. The potential downside is that he hasn't ventured far from Germany, and so I'd want to be sure that he really was prepared to adapt and live the life of a Liverpool manager. At 61 there is also perhaps less chance he would hang around for the kind of rebuild that we need. Worth sounding out though for sure.

Louis Van Gaal

As manager of Ajax in the early-mid 90s, he brought through and oversaw the success of a golden generation of players. The likes of Edgar Davids, Clarence Seedorf, Edwin van der Saar, Dennis Bergkamp, Patrick Kluivert, Jari Litmanen, and the De Boer brothers, burst onto the world stage under his tutelage. In his six seasons at Ajax he guided them to three league titles, three Dutch Cups, one UEFA cup, and Champions League victory (plus 1x RU). He left Ajax to join Barcelona in 1997, winning successive league titles and the Copa Del Rey, though his tenure was cut short because, it is said, he had difficulties with certain players and/or the Spanish media. That presaged a difficult period in his career. His failure to qualify for the 2002 World Cup (Irish reds will remember that) as manager of his native Netherlands, a brief but frankly disastrous return to Barça, and his early resignation as Ajax technical director (where it was alleged he wanted more control) saw his reputation take a bit of a nosedive. Getting back in the game in 2005 as manager of AZ Alkamaar proved to be an astute career move, however, as - with gradual success that cuminated in a league title win - he began to restore his reputation. (incidentally, you can see certain paralells with Rafa) That was enough to earn him the Bayern job, where in his first season he guided them to a league and cup double, and a Champions League final berth. This season, however, hasn't started so well as they currently sit 14 points off the leaders, Dortmund.

My view: My memories are definitely coloured by that second spell he had at Barça, and his failure to qualify Holland for the World Cup, despite such success at Ajax. It's because of that and the fact that his side are currently well off the pace right in the league as of now that would deter me. Nevertheless, worth looking into.

Jose Mourinho

Disliked by many Liverpool fans for of his Chelsea connections, for taunting fans at the League Cup final, for his part in Anders Frisk's (referee) retirement, and for generally "being a tw@t". Put that to one side and his record, his footballing achievements, are to be admired. Sacked prematurely by Benfica, he soon rose to prominence at rival club Porto, where, in his first full season he won the league, league cup and UEFA cup treble. The following season he won the league again and the Champions League. A move to one of Europe's big leagues beckoned and in the summer of 2004, amid speculation that Liverpool (who he expressed a desire to join)could be his destination, he was signed by Chelsea. With a relatively favourable inheritance and the generous financial backing of Roman Abramovich, he managed Chelsea to back-to-back league titles, breaking the record points total in the process, first finishing 15 and then 11 points clear of the second place side. League and FA cups preceded his departure in 2007, whereafter he took a year out. His next project was Inter Milan, where - as at Chelsea - he transformed an already-good side into one of the very best around, yet again winning successive league titles, and ending with an historic treble win in his final season. His last home league defeat came eight-and-a-half years ago and he is currently manager of Real Madrid (on a four-year deal) who keep pace with Barca and are comfortably qualified for the UCL knockout phase.

My view: Probably the best there is right now. Over a period of eight years he has constintently delivered major trophies, and although he's often had significant money to spend, he's spent it well and moulded three highly successful teams in Porto, Chelsea and Inter; you just ask their fans. At Liverpool he would be starting from further back but would, with NESVs backing, have the opportunity to rebuild the team. The perhaps unfortunate reality is that he would receive a very frosty reception from a large section of our support and at a time when the club is in crisis on the pitch and the fans having been divided off it, introducing Mourinho into the fray wouldn't be such a good idea.

Pep Guardiola

A graduate of "La Masia", the Barcelona Youth Academy, Guardiola spent the majority of his playing career as a Barça player, a stalwart defensive midfielder in a great team. Only someone so well acquainted with Barcelona could be successfully fast-tracked to the job of first team manager while still in their 30s. The side he inherited hadn't won a trophy for two seasons and finished 17 points off the league leaders the season before. He had an instant impact as in 08/09 Barca won the treble, the first Spanish side to do so, winning another league title the following season with a record points haul and playing arguably the best football of a generation. They are currently two points clear at the top of La Liga and comfortably qualified for the UCL knockout phase, and looking in ominous form having recently thrashed Real Madrid 5-0. His contract runs out at the end of the season and has been touted as the next Inter manager.

My view: While the job he's done at Barca is very admirable, it could hardly be more different to the task he would face at Liverpool. At Barca, he's in very familar surroundings, tasked with keeping a great footballing side ticking over. We, on the other hand, are in need of a rebuild and a transformation in the we play football. For me there is also a nagging doubt about just to what extent he (as well as Rijkaard before him) is responsible for their success. The bulk of the first team progressed through the youth ranks together under a coaching philisophy that permeates the club, and that gives me the impression that they already had the momentum, and that this more than manager underlies their success. I'll admit that I am not as keen on him as I know a lot of people are but, again, worth keeping an eye on.

Didier Deschamps

Most will remember him from his days as a player at Juventus and Chelsea, and as captain of France during their World Cup win. It turns out that he's also a decent manager. His first job came at lowly Monaco. The side he inherited finished 11th in Ligue 1 the previous season, and at the end of his first season they fell even further, to 15th place. Surprisingly (or perhaps not, such turnarounds in France and elsewhere are not uncommon), in the following season he took them to a second place finish, thus ensuring qualification to the 03/04 Champions League, and a French Cup win. Having qualified for the UCL, his side made it to the final of the Champions League, going down to Jose Mourinho's Porto 3-0. Successive third placed finishes followed, before a poor start (9th after 14 games) to the 05/06 season led to his resignation. He then moved to Juventus, who had just been relegated to Serie 'B' for their part in the Calciopoli scandal. Juventus won the league and thus promotion back to Serie 'A' at the first attempt, before parting company with Deschamps and citing difficulties in their relationship as the reason. A couple of years on he got back in the game with his former club, Marseille, leading them to the Ligue 1 title in his first season, chasing down Bordeaux who had been 11 points clear of them at Christmas. His Marseille side are currently fifth in the league, three points off the leaders, Lille.

My View: It looks as if he's been reasonably successful wherever he's been, but I don't know enough about the context to be able to form a proper judgment.

Qique Sanchez Flores

Began his managerial career proper at newly promoted Getafe in 2004, who he guided to a respectable 13th place. Valencia snapped him up immediately after that, who he took to third and then fourth position in the league. In his debut UCL season he took Valencia to the quarter finals, being knocked out by Chelsea. He was sacked for what was deemed to be a poor start to the 07/08 season (3rd place one point of the top). He moved to Benfica, finished third and won the Portugues Cup, but this too was deemed unacceptable and so he moved back to Spain and to Atletico Madrid. Fourth place they finished the season prior to his arrival, but were 9th by the end of his first season. That season they also won the UEFA cup, beating us in the semis and Roy's Fulham in the final. With ambitions of making the qualifying for the Champions League, his side currently sit 6th in the league, 2 points off fourth spot, 7 points off third.

My view: It's an unremarkable record punctuated by a UEFA cup win, and with a concerning blip here or there. I'd want to see more before taking a punt on a guy like him.

Joachim Loew

Best known for his role in the German national setup, his journey there started with a string of short-term appointments as manager of: Stuttgart, Fenerbahce, Karlsruhe, Adnaspor, Innsbruck, Austria Vienna. Only at Stuttgart did he last longer than one season, winning the German Cup and reaching the Cup winners cup final. The only other domestic title to his name as a manager is an Austrian League title. He joined the Germany setup as assistant manager to Jurgen Klinsmann between 2004 and 2006, where he was, according to wikipedia, "the main tactician and strategist among the management crew"; Germany finished third in the 2006 World cup. Klinsmann made way for Loew in 2006, but the good work continued as in 2008 his side made the final of Euro 2008, losing by a solitary goal to nil, to Spain, thanks to Mr Torres. In last summer's World Cup, Germany again finished third, thrashing both England and Argentina on their way to the semis, where again, they were defeated by Spain. Perhaps just as relevant to where they finished is in how they played, and that's with great cohesion and style.

My view: He in the summer because of the way Germany beat England and Argentina. Without many players who you could confidently have called "world class", they played as a cohesive unit that managed contain and then on the counter, completely demolish, two of the initial tournament favourites. You could see the discipline and the organisation in their play, the pace and enthusiasm as soon as they were on the attack - the way Muller would get on his bike as soon as Ozil picked it up... They always seemed one step ahead.

Laurent Blanc
Andre Villas Boas
Unai Emery
Owen Coyle
Martin O'Neil
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