Liverpool FC Forum

LFC2007 wrote:

Bad Bob wrote:

LFC2007 wrote:There isn't a shred of (reliable) evidence to back up any of the claims made in Igor's post; it relies inference alone. Those who believe all or any of it want to believe it because, amongst other things, it ties in with their own favourable view of Rafa; a view that seeks to absolve him from as much of the blame for the team's past failings as possible.

I 100% believed the bit where he said that Rafa f.ucked Alonso around, though. 

  The majority of it, then. I think enough can be inferred from the circumstances of Alonso's departure (Barry-gate, being touted around Europe, and leaving even after such a successful season) to make it believable that their relationship suffered.

That's an exception.

Let's take at some of the other claims made:

He says Carragher and Gerrard "suggested and approved" of Roy's appointment. He suggests they were motivated by self-interest: His appointment would increase Carra's chances of the contract extentions he desired, and Gerrard's chances of playing in his favoured position, CM.
   
He claims this to be a fact before confirming it as hearsay. He doesn't posit a reason for Carragher believing that Roy's appointment would increase his chances of receiving a new contract (and says nothing about the nature of the "approval" he supposedly gave), as against any of the other candidates for the job. Carragher's contract renewal coincided with the NESV takeover. If I deployed a similar logic to that above, I might conclude that his contract renewal depended on the takeover rather than the choice of manager; but it is not suggested that he influenced the choice of owner. At any rate, even if it's true that Carragher "suggested and approved" of Roy's appointment, it doesn't follow that he did so with his mind firmly set on a contract extension (Furthermore, if he was going to confess such a thing to anyone, it wouldn't be a steward, a chauffeur or anyone else imbued with the spirit of lakes). And, just how cynical is it of Gerrard to express a preference for a manager who he believes will play him in his best position? It says nothing about his loyalty or love for the club.

Gerrard has "bullied" Roy into playing in his preferred position of CM.

Another unsubstantiated claim typical of the accusations Gerrard has to deal with over the years.   

When looking for Rafa's replacement, the only managers we could attract were those in the following bracket: Curbishley, Allardyce, Martin O'Neil.....therefore we should have kept hold of Rafa.

Pellegrini was available at the time - the club reportedly interviewed him - and he has since taken over at Malaga: I dare say he would have prefered the LFC job. Is he in the same league as the managers listed above? Kenny was willing and available to take the job, is he, too? It's a myth that we "had to settle..", those taking the decison chose to settle.

Peter Crouch turned down a four-year-deal on £60kp/w and moved to Portsmouth purely because of the London lifestyle. (to allow him to live near London)

It was pure coincidence, then, that moving to Portsmouth virtually guaranteed him the regular first team football that had eluded him at Liverpool. Just how strong was his desire to live closer to London? I don't know, but neither does the author of Igor's post, so I'll settle for believing that regular first team football at Liverpool would have been enough to persuade Crouch to stay at the club. His departure, in other words, was avoidable: We haven't had a good backup striker since.

Purslow instructed Rafa not to play Aquilani between Dec 09 and Jan 10 because to do so risked activating a costly appearance clause.

The details of the transfer published on the official AS Roma website at the time said otherwise: that the money due in January was not dependent on appearances, but a fixed amount of €3m. Moreover, Aquilani remained in and out of the team for the remainder of that season and was typically left out of away games against physical opponents (Blackburn, Everton, Wolves, Wigan amongst others) Far from having been "instructed" by Purslow not to play Aquilani, Rafa quite simply didn't trust him enough to pick him on a regular basis. No escaping this one: Rafa fecked it up.

The club medical staff, instructed by Purslow - in turn instructed by the previous owners - lied to Rafa about Torres' fitness before the Birmingham game; a risk made necessary by the club's need to make the top four - a prize that would increase the club's value. When confronted by Rafa, the medical staff stayed silent and Rafa cottoned on.

We are encouraged to believe that the club's medical department were complicit with, essentially, a consiracy designed by the owners to deceive the manager over the fitness of Torres. Again, there isn't a shred of evidence to support the claim, and a grand one it is; the club doctors risked being struck off the medical register had they been found out. One other glaring inconsistency also strikes me: to risk Torres' fitness was to risk the opportunity to sell him that summer and so pay off the debt; as was argued to have happened with the Alonso money and was expected to occur again last summer (their primary intention, we were told, was to sell off our key players to pay down the debt), but never came to fruition.

Rafa was forced into moves for Johnson and Aquilani as the club was owed money by Portmouth and Roma. That meant we could use their "credit notes" to fund part of those transfers.

We were only forgoing what we would have received in the form of the Crouch and Riise money, so at the end of it the net result is exactly the same as if we had signed a different £18m full back, or a different €20m midfielder. Furthermore, there were plenty of right backs cheaper than £18m and plenty of midfielders cheaper than €20m, so Rafa was hardly stuck for choice.

Believable? 

J*o*n*D*o*e wrote:i guess people should just take it that your views tie in with your unfavourable view of Rafa.

mramo wrote:

Igor Zidane wrote:In May he told me about the fall out between Benitez/Gerrard and that it had broken down and was irrepairable. In other words one had to go. He said that due to the fact that Benitez was at fault for the departure of Alonso ( Benitezs' refusal to aplogise to Alonso and his wife after the Inter game in 2008 being the issue), the worry was that players who he had also fell out with ,would leave. So Benitez left.

Funnily enough, I had an interesting conversation with Xabi's Alonso's brother (Mikel) last week in Tenerife.

Mikel's take was that Xabi was upset at being the one considered for transfer after funds couldnt be released to buy Gareth Barry outright. He went on to say that Rafa actually wanted Keane and signed him as his first priority signing! He continued by saying Rafa couldnt get funds released by the owners to buy his next signing (Gareth Barry), so owners told him to sell expensive before buying expensive. This is were Benitez coined the idea of selling Xabi. The rest is history.....Mikel also mentioned (as the majority would) that Liverpool have gone downhill since his brother was sold and Roy Hodgson doesnt seem to be good enough.

My final message to Mikel was that we miss Xabi so much and we need him back at the club sometime soon. Mikel replied saying that Xabi is not aware the fans miss him in such a way. He then promised that evening he would ring Xabi and pass on my message (as a fan) to tell him how highly he is thought of, and how much respect and affection we have for him as a Liverpool legend.

mramo wrote:

Igor Zidane wrote:In May he told me about the fall out between Benitez/Gerrard and that it had broken down and was irrepairable. In other words one had to go. He said that due to the fact that Benitez was at fault for the departure of Alonso ( Benitezs' refusal to aplogise to Alonso and his wife after the Inter game in 2008 being the issue), the worry was that players who he had also fell out with ,would leave. So Benitez left.

Funnily enough, I had an interesting conversation with Xabi's Alonso's brother (Mikel) last week in Tenerife.

Mikel's take was that Xabi was upset at being the one considered for transfer after funds couldnt be released to buy Gareth Barry outright. He went on to say that Rafa actually wanted Keane and signed him as his first priority signing! He continued by saying Rafa couldnt get funds released by the owners to buy his next signing (Gareth Barry), so owners told him to sell expensive before buying expensive. This is were Benitez coined the idea of selling Xabi. The rest is history.....Mikel also mentioned (as the majority would) that Liverpool have gone downhill since his brother was sold and Roy Hodgson doesnt seem to be good enough.

My final message to Mikel was that we miss Xabi so much and we need him back at the club sometime soon. Mikel replied saying that Xabi is not aware the fans miss him in such a way. He then promised that evening he would ring Xabi and pass on my message (as a fan) to tell him how highly he is thought of, and how much respect and affection we have for him as a Liverpool legend.

Just a thought like, but Mikel Alonso was in the Bolton team last weekend against us and also the midweek game against Chelsea.

I find it very surprising that Owen Coyle would allow Alonso to go on a break to Tenerife! A lovely stroy nonetheless.

Could be like the he said she said report that Igor posted up from RAWK.

Not knocking anyone, but we cant take all this info as fact!

boodiddy1 wrote:

mramo wrote:

Igor Zidane wrote:In May he told me about the fall out between Benitez/Gerrard and that it had broken down and was irrepairable. In other words one had to go. He said that due to the fact that Benitez was at fault for the departure of Alonso ( Benitezs' refusal to aplogise to Alonso and his wife after the Inter game in 2008 being the issue), the worry was that players who he had also fell out with ,would leave. So Benitez left.

Funnily enough, I had an interesting conversation with Xabi's Alonso's brother (Mikel) last week in Tenerife.

Mikel's take was that Xabi was upset at being the one considered for transfer after funds couldnt be released to buy Gareth Barry outright. He went on to say that Rafa actually wanted Keane and signed him as his first priority signing! He continued by saying Rafa couldnt get funds released by the owners to buy his next signing (Gareth Barry), so owners told him to sell expensive before buying expensive. This is were Benitez coined the idea of selling Xabi. The rest is history.....Mikel also mentioned (as the majority would) that Liverpool have gone downhill since his brother was sold and Roy Hodgson doesnt seem to be good enough.

My final message to Mikel was that we miss Xabi so much and we need him back at the club sometime soon. Mikel replied saying that Xabi is not aware the fans miss him in such a way. He then promised that evening he would ring Xabi and pass on my message (as a fan) to tell him how highly he is thought of, and how much respect and affection we have for him as a Liverpool legend.

Just a thought like, but Mikel Alonso was in the Bolton team last weekend against us and also the midweek game against Chelsea.

I find it very surprising that Owen Coyle would allow Alonso to go on a break to Tenerife! A lovely stroy nonetheless.

Could be like the he said she said report that Igor posted up from RAWK.

Not knocking anyone, but we cant take all this info as fact!

boodiddy1 wrote:Just a thought like, but Mikel Alonso was in the Bolton team last weekend against us and also the midweek game against Chelsea.

I find it very surprising that Owen Coyle would allow Alonso to go on a break to Tenerife! A lovely stroy nonetheless.

Hes no relation to Xabi mate

Ciggy wrote:As much as I have wanted The Hodge out, I think its humiliating not only for us but for him aswell for him to be in the dugout at OT tommorrow they are the cruelest fans in the world and there will be no place for him to hide.

Henry & Werner should have flown over already and sorted this dreadful mess out !!!!