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A case for the defence - Major overhaul?
Posted:
Wed Mar 17, 2010 3:32 pmby stmichael
Having been talking about Insua and how he gives me kittens defensively this got me thinking about our defence in general. In recent weeks we reverted to grinding out wins when Carragher was playing at fullback and sacrificing our attractiveness as a result. Now Johnson is back it raises more questions than answers for me, mainly because playing him and Insua leaves our centre backs too exposed imo as we saw earlier in the season. Hell even Pompey created some decent chances against us but their finishing was generally woeful. The fact that Mascherano was woefully out of form earlier in the season hardly helped the defence either back then.
I suppose the point is that the defence needs a major overhaul in the summer if we're being realistic. We always go on about our lack of creativity which is true to a certain extent but if you look at the stats, goalscoring isn't our main problem, especially now that all our players are fit. The question is what positions in the defence would you be looking at strenthening next year?
Right back I think we are ok. Johnson is fine (I still think he'll justify his transfer fee) and I'm more than happy with Kelly as backup for now even though he is young and has flaws obviously. I don't like Carra having to cover there all the time.
At left back Insua has major weknesses in a one on one situation and also positionally. He's decent enough going forward but I don't see him as being good enough to be first team regular in the future. Aurelio just can't be relied on to stay fit enough to nail that spot down either so we really need to be looking at bringing someone in. Gareth Bale would have been great when we had the chance a while back. Looking at him now he's playing as well as anybody in the League in that position.
Now what happens at centre back is anybody's guess. I think the general consensus is that over time Daniel Agger will eventually become first choice CB at the club. Now I love Carragher to bits but everybody can see that he is on the way down now. He'll still do a more than decent job for us but we really need to be looking at signing a long term replacement for him. Skrtel has good attributes and bad ones but is he really good enough to be a first team regular either. This is not to mention that we are still significantly weak in the air defensively since Hyypia left. Whatever anybody says, he is a massive miss. The Greek has done a more than adequate job when coming in but lets be serious here, he was brought as nothing more than backup but found himself forced into the team due to injuries.
So what type of player do you bring in? We were linked with the Danish lad from Palermo who would be a brilliant signing to play alongside Agger. With Agger being more of a ball player you really need to be looking at someone who is aireally dominant but can still play a bit.
Whatever the case, just wondered what you feel about the defence going forward?
Posted:
Wed Mar 17, 2010 4:23 pmby Redman in wales
It’s a good point st mick and I agree with the vast majority of it.
With Johnson/Kelly right back, Agger CB and Carra there for the near future, I’d sell Skrtel to generate some funds, and keep Soto as back up. THen look for a new CB and a LB.
What we need is a Sami Hyypia mark II in the centre, and new left back.
Now this young Kjaer seems to fit the bill and would work well with agger – question is would he come to us if we’re not in Europe and other clubs (who are in europe) are in for him, and also can we afford him?
Left back – I also agree that Bale was the answer but we failed there. He’s a great young prospect, one of the best left backs in the league at the moment – and he’s still only 20.
Belhadj looks quite good at Portsmouth, and might be an “affordable” option, or Ilunga of west ham looks ok, but I haven’t seen either of these two play in great detail. we’ll probably need to look further ashore
However – as with everything else it all comes down to money. And we’re gonna have to prioritise where we spend our money. With the fact that we definitely need some more attacking options, then we probably can’t afford to buy a CB and a LB that would be good enough to replace what we’ve got.
Posted:
Wed Mar 17, 2010 5:19 pmby Reg
I´m happy with Insua, he´s come on in leaps and bounds this season and I´m sure he´ll continue to improve.
Far bigger a priority to bring in a second striker.
Posted:
Thu Mar 18, 2010 12:37 amby Fauxy
Im quite happy with Insua, he is a bit shakey at the back at the moment but he will get better.
The players that imo rafa should prioritise are Kjaer and Turan.
We have got this guy coming over from Standard Liege to use as backup striker. We will also have Nemeth back from his loan and Pacheco is coming of age and gradually getting into the squad.
Kjaer is just frighteningly good for his age. If we can get him for the £10 Million buyout clause in his contract then it is a steal.
Turan already said he would like to join us and he is a class player.
We are talking around 20+ million for the two of them.
If Aurelio does leave then we would probably need a cheap left back for cover. Belhadj would be fairly cheap from pourtsmouth id imagine...
Posted:
Thu Mar 18, 2010 7:37 amby Owzat
Reg wrote:I´m happy with Insua, he´s come on in leaps and bounds this season and I´m sure he´ll continue to improve.
Far bigger a priority to bring in a second striker.
I agree in the sense there are bigger priorities. One major flaw on these boards are people will talk about a lack of money and in the next breath start talking about bringing in players that will cost a fortune!
Posted:
Thu Mar 18, 2010 8:21 amby The Good Yank
Okay I'm going to totally throw a wrench into this thread buy suggesting something I've been thinking of
Reina
Carra Greek Skittles/Agger
Johnson Insua/Aurellio
Mascher
Aqua Babel
Gerrard
Torres
Posted:
Fri Mar 26, 2010 2:45 pmby stmichael
Fauxy wrote:Belhadj would be fairly cheap from pourtsmouth id imagine...
I'd take him for £2-3mil. But because there is a bit of hype around him, he'd probably cost nearer £5-6. Redknapp will probably try and sign him.
Posted:
Fri Mar 26, 2010 2:45 pmby stmichael
Fauxy wrote:Belhadj would be fairly cheap from pourtsmouth id imagine...
I'd take him for £2-3mil. But because there is a bit of hype around him, he'd probably cost nearer £5-6. Excellent going forward but not really sure about him defensively.
Redknapp will probably try and sign him.
Posted:
Wed Apr 07, 2010 7:32 amby leep33
Insua will be a quality player in a few years but he needs a more experienced player to learn from Taiwo would fit the bill, and hopefully in the centre Kjaier will join although it has all gone quiet on that front.
Posted:
Wed Apr 07, 2010 10:43 amby Sir Roger
leep33 wrote:Insua will be a quality player in a few years but he needs a more experienced player to learn from Taiwo would fit the bill, and hopefully in the centre Kjaier will join although it has all gone quiet on that front.
Insua has been rope for a while. Partly because of his own lack of ability but also because of support
Posted:
Wed Apr 07, 2010 11:32 amby blurblur
stmichael wrote:Having been talking about Insua and how he gives me kittens defensively this got me thinking about our defence in general. In recent weeks we reverted to grinding out wins when Carragher was playing at fullback and sacrificing our attractiveness as a result. Now Johnson is back it raises more questions than answers for me, mainly because playing him and Insua leaves our centre backs too exposed imo as we saw earlier in the season. Hell even Pompey created some decent chances against us but their finishing was generally woeful. The fact that Mascherano was woefully out of form earlier in the season hardly helped the defence either back then.
I suppose the point is that the defence needs a major overhaul in the summer if we're being realistic. We always go on about our lack of creativity which is true to a certain extent but if you look at the stats, goalscoring isn't our main problem, especially now that all our players are fit. The question is what positions in the defence would you be looking at strenthening next year?
Right back I think we are ok. Johnson is fine (I still think he'll justify his transfer fee) and I'm more than happy with Kelly as backup for now even though he is young and has flaws obviously. I don't like Carra having to cover there all the time.
At left back Insua has major weknesses in a one on one situation and also positionally. He's decent enough going forward but I don't see him as being good enough to be first team regular in the future. Aurelio just can't be relied on to stay fit enough to nail that spot down either so we really need to be looking at bringing someone in. Gareth Bale would have been great when we had the chance a while back. Looking at him now he's playing as well as anybody in the League in that position.
Now what happens at centre back is anybody's guess. I think the general consensus is that over time Daniel Agger will eventually become first choice CB at the club. Now I love Carragher to bits but everybody can see that he is on the way down now. He'll still do a more than decent job for us but we really need to be looking at signing a long term replacement for him. Skrtel has good attributes and bad ones but is he really good enough to be a first team regular either. This is not to mention that we are still significantly weak in the air defensively since Hyypia left. Whatever anybody says, he is a massive miss. The Greek has done a more than adequate job when coming in but lets be serious here, he was brought as nothing more than backup but found himself forced into the team due to injuries.
So what type of player do you bring in? We were linked with the Danish lad from Palermo who would be a brilliant signing to play alongside Agger. With Agger being more of a ball player you really need to be looking at someone who is aireally dominant but can still play a bit.
Whatever the case, just wondered what you feel about the defence going forward?
good point... johnson/kelly at rightback... agger/carra/skrtel at centrebacks... needs another first choice dominant centreback such as kjaer of palermo/subotic of dortmund...
a total overhaul will be required in the leftback position and i would suggest throwing insua into the bin... no fee required... 
Posted:
Wed Apr 07, 2010 12:20 pmby damjan193
I've said it in a diffrent threat, I'll say it here as well.What about the russian left back from CSKA?He prommises to be a grat player and bigger teams will sign him sooner or later.The same goes for Kjaer, though he kind of started to anoy me, saying that hed move to any club if they offer him a big pay and prommis him to be in the starting eleven... well wait a minute kid, you have to prove your self first, then demand stuff.If he countineus like this, he'll end up nowhere.Anyway, he said that he'd like to play with someone like Agger.
Posted:
Wed Apr 07, 2010 12:24 pmby Owzat
Sir Roger wrote:leep33 wrote:Insua will be a quality player in a few years but he needs a more experienced player to learn from Taiwo would fit the bill, and hopefully in the centre Kjaier will join although it has all gone quiet on that front.
Insua has been rope for a while. Partly because of his own lack of ability but also because of support
It's hard to say he has a strength, his tackling isn't top drawer, his positional sense is questionable and his marking is at times non-existent. He can cross but isn't consistent enough at that either, he's no great scoring ability or pace to mention. Quite how anyone could conclude he will become a quality player I don't know, where is the evidence?
Posted:
Wed Apr 07, 2010 2:44 pmby RUSHIE#9
The defence is going to need an overhaul in the very near future, but this summer for me the attack needs to be strengthened as a priority. We don't know whether this Jovanovic is gonna be decent or be another Voronin so we need a good partner or back up for Nando bringing in.
The midfield needs a tweak as Lucas just isn't the answer (somebody please tell Rafa - if he's still here then), dropping SG back there with us reverting to two up top is the way to go IMO.
As the saying goes, attack is the best form of defence and with what we have at the back I think we could cope for another season if our tactics were more positive and not so negative all the time (but that's for another discussion).
Posted:
Wed Apr 07, 2010 2:54 pmby Fauxy
RUSHIE#9 wrote:The defence is going to need an overhaul in the very near future, but this summer for me the attack needs to be strengthened as a priority. We don't know whether this Jovanovic is gonna be decent or be another Voronin so we need a good partner or back up for Nando bringing in.
The midfield needs a tweak as Lucas just isn't the answer (somebody please tell Rafa - if he's still here then), dropping SG back there with us reverting to two up top is the way to go IMO.
As the saying goes, attack is the best form of defence and with what we have at the back I think we could cope for another season if our tactics were more positive and not so negative all the time (but that's for another discussion).
I agreeee