Page 5 of 6
Posted:
Sun Mar 09, 2008 11:07 pmby redtrader74
metalhead wrote:redtrader74 wrote:I didn't like the way Owen left us, hated it, but i can't believe people are already forgetting his goals for us the way he played and already putting Torres ahead of him. He won a FA cup final on his own FFS, and given a choice between him and Crouch, Voronin and Kuyt, even now it would be Owen each time, although i doubt it would happen because he would be expected to work for the team a lot more, and we all know he can spend large parts of the game not even getting a touch.
IMO Torres is playing with slightly better players than Owen did for most of time and i don't think Torres is really that clinical in front of goal, i'm not allowing his current run to cloud my judgement. It is his first season, he seems to have everything, but lets wait and see what happens next season after all the defences have seen him at least twice, fantastic start but no sainthood yet.
If torres isn't really clinical infront of goal, then I don't think he would have scored 25 goals for us this season.
Torres has more to offer but IMO if we only had one chance in a game, at their peak, (which is where i assume Torres is close to right now), i would put Owen, Fowler and Rush ahead of him in being more likely to score, thats why i speak of being clinical. On the other hand he is the only one of them that could regularly go past a couple of players and score.
Posted:
Mon Mar 10, 2008 12:48 amby jono
don't feel sympathy for Owen he's a big boy and turned his back on Liverpool for pastures new
the grass is never greener n all that
you can only judge Torres on what we have seen and so far looks to have made a better impression in his first season than owen(the last quality striker we had upfront)
Posted:
Mon Mar 10, 2008 12:58 amby god_bless_john_houlding
1997/98 season...top goalscorer...Chris Sutton 18, Dion Dublin 18 and Michael Owen 18. Owen's first full season in Liverpool's starting 11.
Move it on ten years, Torres has scored 18 in the league (I think) but that won't be enough to claim the golden boot in his first full season in the Liverpool starting 11. So Torres has showen he can score as many as Owen if not more. Obviously Owen was only 18 himself when he won the golden boot but it's still some achievment by the spaniard to equal Owen's record of 18 in a first full season.
Torres impresses me more and more with each game that goes by. But it's the thought of "can he do for 3/4 years" that bugs me. I'm confident he will, but until then I have to choose Owen over Torres.
Posted:
Mon Mar 10, 2008 1:07 amby zarababe
There's no contest - Michael looks like a pale shadow of himself - Martins holds more threat then him - says it all ay !
Posted:
Mon Mar 10, 2008 2:51 amby LFC2007
The_Rock wrote:LFC2007 wrote:The_Rock wrote:Owen at his best never scored 20 league goals for us....Torres is pretty close to getting 20 goals....
Torres rules.....
Agreed, what a great signing by Rafa.
He must be some sort of genius.
And also hicks and gilette for signing the cheque.... 
Yes, but even you could sign a cheque 
Posted:
Mon Mar 10, 2008 3:18 amby Toffeehater
LFC2007 wrote:The_Rock wrote:LFC2007 wrote:The_Rock wrote:Owen at his best never scored 20 league goals for us....Torres is pretty close to getting 20 goals....
Torres rules.....
Agreed, what a great signing by Rafa.
He must be some sort of genius.
And also hicks and gilette for signing the cheque....
Yes, but even you could sign a cheque
if he had the cash 
Posted:
Mon Mar 10, 2008 10:09 amby SouthCoastShankly
Singing Torres over Owen is obvious but my question to Rafa would be whether he'd sign Kuyt over Owen? I know I wouldn't!
Posted:
Mon Mar 10, 2008 2:11 pmby Big Niall
Maybe if Owen runs his Newcastle contract down we'll get him on a free "pay as you play" basis.
I still rate him very highly and only injuries concern me.
Posted:
Mon Mar 10, 2008 2:20 pmby metalhead
redtrader74 wrote:metalhead wrote:redtrader74 wrote:I didn't like the way Owen left us, hated it, but i can't believe people are already forgetting his goals for us the way he played and already putting Torres ahead of him. He won a FA cup final on his own FFS, and given a choice between him and Crouch, Voronin and Kuyt, even now it would be Owen each time, although i doubt it would happen because he would be expected to work for the team a lot more, and we all know he can spend large parts of the game not even getting a touch.
IMO Torres is playing with slightly better players than Owen did for most of time and i don't think Torres is really that clinical in front of goal, i'm not allowing his current run to cloud my judgement. It is his first season, he seems to have everything, but lets wait and see what happens next season after all the defences have seen him at least twice, fantastic start but no sainthood yet.
If torres isn't really clinical infront of goal, then I don't think he would have scored 25 goals for us this season.
Torres has more to offer but IMO if we only had one chance in a game, at their peak, (which is where i assume Torres is close to right now), i would put Owen, Fowler and Rush ahead of him in being more likely to score, thats why i speak of being clinical. On the other hand he is the only one of them that could regularly go past a couple of players and score.
I don't know, everytime I see him having the ball in the opposition's box its a 90% probability he scores. I think he is clinical enough and I agree with John Craig when he said I don't agree that Torres isn't clinical in front of goal. The quality of his finishing isn't in question in my opinion. He does miss the odd chance like every other top striker, but the real sign of his class is that he doesn't let a couple of misses wreck his confidence.
Posted:
Mon Mar 10, 2008 2:22 pmby LegBarnes
i think i know what is gonna happen newcastle will go down and owen will get religation release clause and we will get him for like 2 mil or some thing cheap
Posted:
Mon Mar 10, 2008 2:26 pmby LegBarnes
metalhead wrote:redtrader74 wrote:metalhead wrote:redtrader74 wrote:I didn't like the way Owen left us, hated it, but i can't believe people are already forgetting his goals for us the way he played and already putting Torres ahead of him. He won a FA cup final on his own FFS, and given a choice between him and Crouch, Voronin and Kuyt, even now it would be Owen each time, although i doubt it would happen because he would be expected to work for the team a lot more, and we all know he can spend large parts of the game not even getting a touch.
IMO Torres is playing with slightly better players than Owen did for most of time and i don't think Torres is really that clinical in front of goal, i'm not allowing his current run to cloud my judgement. It is his first season, he seems to have everything, but lets wait and see what happens next season after all the defences have seen him at least twice, fantastic start but no sainthood yet.
If torres isn't really clinical infront of goal, then I don't think he would have scored 25 goals for us this season.
Torres has more to offer but IMO if we only had one chance in a game, at their peak, (which is where i assume Torres is close to right now), i would put Owen, Fowler and Rush ahead of him in being more likely to score, thats why i speak of being clinical. On the other hand he is the only one of them that could regularly go past a couple of players and score.
I don't know, everytime I see him having the ball in the opposition's box its a 90% probability he scores. I think he is clinical enough and I agree with John Craig when he said I don't agree that Torres isn't clinical in front of goal. The quality of his finishing isn't in question in my opinion. He does miss the odd chance like every other top striker, but the real sign of his class is that he doesn't let a couple of misses wreck his confidence.
owen had pace and finishing
Rush had finishing and great footballing brain
Fowler had great finishing and great heading
Torres has great pace , can go past players , great finishing , great heading , great footballing brain , can pass well even key passing , links up well
I aint saying he better then any of the above only time will tell but come on he is more exciting prospect we have had at liverpool since kenny and i personaly think he could have just as big an impact.
Posted:
Mon Mar 10, 2008 2:29 pmby maguskwt
just thought this little discussion in the other thread should be brought over here:
bigmick wrote:maguskwt wrote:bigmick wrote:Fair enough John, agree with nearly all of that. BTW in your four point plan which is part of your signature, I would expect Torres to have comfortably surpassed sixty league goals in his first four seasons if he is still here.
owen's first 4 full seasons with us = 23 + 23 + 12 + 24 = 82 goals... surely torres needs to beat that to be able to claim that he's better than owen...(note: I didn't count the 96-97 season as his first because he only had 2 appearances)
owen's best 4 season with us = 28 + 28 + 24 + 23 = 103 goals...
I like torres alot but come on... he still has a way to beat owen's accomplishments...
Definately impressive numbers there mate. Things to consider though are firstly Owen took penalties, secondly are those his LEAGUE goals you are talking about, and thirdly, something else which has temporarily slipped my mind. Shame that, because out of the three things to remember it was the one above all others which categorically proved Torres was much the better player. It'll come back to me.
Anyway, Fowler was better than Owen as well.
those are total number of goals in all competition mick... no matter what... it shows how consistent he was season after season... and perhaps we should continue this discussion in the other thread "why rafa chose torres over owen"... so i'm gonna copy and paste over there...
Posted:
Mon Mar 10, 2008 2:35 pmby maguskwt
all arguments and discussions aside... we have torres now and I'm really really glad...
Posted:
Mon Mar 10, 2008 3:14 pmby account deleted by request
Maybe we should have another thread......"Why I signed Bellamy, Kuyt and Voronin and not Owen"
Posted:
Mon Mar 10, 2008 3:21 pmby Reg
Daft thread this, Owen passed his sell by date years ago.