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Posted:
Wed Sep 02, 2009 1:38 amby ElJefe
Scottbot wrote:ElJefe wrote:I think Rafa finally worked out two holding midfielders is pointless in 90% of games and now even though Aquilani may not be as good as Xabi I think a CM group with two holding players and an attacking midfielder is gonna be better than a higher quality group of three holding midfielders.
I agree and that makes it all the more perplexing to see the manager persist with the current Masch- Lucas partnership.
Lucas is trying to play as an attacking midfielder though, he just hasn't got any end product.
Posted:
Wed Sep 02, 2009 1:49 amby account deleted by request
I think Alonso was overrated by some, but he was still a very good player. He had a great last season with us and I was sad to see him go.The price we received softened the blow some what 
but I prefer points to £'s and unless Aquilani is as good as we all hope and settles quickly we may bear the cost in points lost.
I think the loss of Alonso has been made to look worse than what it really is because we as a team have struggled as usual early on, we did last season and in truth we have most if not every season under Rafa. Last season we got away with it a little more than we have so far this season , but our form was just as poor even though our results were better.
Placing our hopes on an injured player new to the prem who most of us have hardly seen play worries me more than the sale of Alonso, but I honestly think that we needed a little more from our midfield and maybe Alonso wasn't the one to supply it.
A good player but not a great player is how I will remember him.
Posted:
Wed Sep 02, 2009 1:51 amby sully0182
lucas just needs to work on damage control. He should just do his bit and try not to 
up too badly til the aquaman comes back from injury. On the topic of overated players, i don't think lucas, vorinin or babel are overated...we all know they're utterly useless.
However, I am going to say something highly controversial now and say that jamie carragher has been overated since last season. He has become slow, clumsy and on top of that, if i see the lad point the finger one more time after a goal goes in, my heads gonna explode. I recognise that he's been a great servant to the club but if we're gonna win the league, a certain degree of ruthlessness needs to be involved i.e. drop him as soon as dan the man is fit again (or if the Greek lad proves a decent signing, i'd do it now)
Posted:
Wed Sep 02, 2009 1:57 amby Lando_Griffin
maguskwt wrote:Alonso was definitely not overrated... I've said this before Alonso was the key to making the 4-5-1 formation work and maximises the potential of the Gerrard/Torres partnership. A person with a lack of vision and passing ability will just make this formation fail.
Spot on.
I have to say that the inane ramblings of some of the Rafa-bashers in this thread beggar belief. The "proof is in the pudding" and we are playing the worst football we have seen since Rafa arrived.
The difference?...
Posted:
Wed Sep 02, 2009 2:05 amby GOAT
What's wrong with some lovely worms for tea yum yum
Xabi was obviously very important to us last season, I do think people are overrating him a bit now he's gone though
Posted:
Wed Sep 02, 2009 2:22 amby bigmick
Lando_Griffin wrote:maguskwt wrote:Alonso was definitely not overrated... I've said this before Alonso was the key to making the 4-5-1 formation work and maximises the potential of the Gerrard/Torres partnership. A person with a lack of vision and passing ability will just make this formation fail.
Spot on.
I have to say that the inane ramblings of some of the Rafa-bashers in this thread beggar belief. The "proof is in the pudding" and we are playing the worst football we have seen since Rafa arrived.
The difference?...
There are a few, but the main one is that Alonso is a far better player than Lucas.
Posted:
Wed Sep 02, 2009 3:01 amby JoeTerp
bavlondon wrote:JoeTerp wrote:that picture reminds me of Martin Luther
..King?
How so? Is this more wierd American humor Joe?
No as in the 95 theses Martin Luther
Posted:
Wed Sep 02, 2009 10:40 amby redbeergoggles
Alonso overrated, he has just virtually transformed the style of Real Madrid's play ,where it was once hurried and played with no small degree of impatience ,it is now languid patient and played with purpose all mainly due to the introduction of Alonso .
I think overrated is perhaps the one word Alonso could never be associated with ,he simply makes teams tick and gives a midfield fluidity .
Posted:
Wed Sep 02, 2009 10:49 amby stmichael
Scottbot wrote:You're deffo right about the lazy journalists and dumb as fook ex-player/pundits who claim we should have kept Alonso at the club as if their was any choice. I agree that the fans have also gone a bit OTT (meself included) with rants about how much we're missing him. I think most of us forget that their were times last season when our performances (not the results) were almost as cumbersome and awkward (with Xabi in the team) as those we've witnessed this season.
The majority of pundits are clueless. I heard one the other day say that we are now suddenly the most vulnerable out of the top 4 after 4 games because we are "weaker than last season" (like United and Arsenal aren't). You couldn't make it up.
The fact is, last season when Alonso was here we were branded "a 2 man team". One of them, Torres, missed half the season through injury and Gerrard also missed several games throughout the season. Despite them only starting 14 games together we still finished the Leagues top scorers. People just conveniently overlooked the fact that with the exception of Ronaldo and Lampard, Kuyt and Benayoun scored more League goals than any other midfield players in the top 4 by a country mile (12 and 8 respectively).
Yes Alonso is a miss but despite being brilliant last season nobody really mentioned him. Now he's gone, acoording to some we have no chance despite the fact that out two main players are still here. I don't get it. Ok they site Alonso's ability to pick a pass but at the end of the day even if he was here we'd still be struggling to get results because we're defending so abysmally at the moment. Is it me or do players always become better once they leave? I didn't hear people saying United were missing Ronaldo after they lost at Burnley.
Posted:
Wed Sep 02, 2009 11:01 amby DrPepe
redbeergoggles wrote:Alonso overrated, he has just virtually transformed the style of Real Madrid's play ,where it was once hurried and played with no small degree of impatience ,it is now languid patient and played with purpose all mainly due to the introduction of Alonso .
I think overrated is perhaps the one word Alonso could never be associated with ,he simply makes teams tick and gives a midfield fluidity .
"transformed the team"? they're struggling to qualify in the uefa cup at the moment ....
Team P W D L F A Pts
Getafe 1 1 0 0 4 1 3
Barcelona 1 1 0 0 3 0 3
Malaga 1 1 0 0 3 0 3
Mallorca 1 1 0 0 2 0 3
Valencia 1 1 0 0 2 0 3
Real Madrid 1 1 0 0 3 2 3
Posted:
Wed Sep 02, 2009 11:01 amby bigmick
stmichael wrote:I didn't hear people saying United were missing Ronaldo after they lost at Burnley.
Well if the media in England didn't come to that conclusion there is something wrong with them. I watched the last hour or so of that, and Man Utd were missing him like someone who's missing something a lot (I can't think of a metaphor right now).
They missed him in that game unbelieveably. Had he have been playing, he would have got them a penalty and probably scored one of those silly free kicks as well (which I notice Drogba seems to have perfected during the close season). Apparantly you hit it on the valve or something, I don't think they'd invented it when I played football.
Posted:
Wed Sep 02, 2009 11:03 amby DrPepe
they call it a toe-poke where i come from
Posted:
Wed Sep 02, 2009 11:08 amby redbeergoggles
Ok that was quick (but thats your freebie )
Posted:
Wed Sep 02, 2009 11:10 amby heimdall
bigmick wrote:stmichael wrote:I didn't hear people saying United were missing Ronaldo after they lost at Burnley.
Well if the media in England didn't come to that conclusion there is something wrong with them. I watched the last hour or so of that, and Man Utd were missing him like someone who's missing something a lot (I can't think of a metaphor right now).
They missed him in that game unbelieveably. Had he have been playing, he would have got them a penalty and probably scored one of those silly free kicks as well (which I notice Drogba seems to have perfected during the close season). Apparantly you hit it on the valve or something, I don't think they'd invented it when I played football.
I'm fairly certain that the media have commented on Manure's loss of Ronaldo. Manure look much weaker at the moment and anybody who thinks than Fergie chose not to spend the £80 million is very very delusional.
Posted:
Wed Sep 02, 2009 11:11 amby stmichael
bigmick wrote:stmichael wrote:I didn't hear people saying United were missing Ronaldo after they lost at Burnley.
Well if the media in England didn't come to that conclusion there is something wrong with them. I watched the last hour or so of that, and Man Utd were missing him like someone who's missing something a lot (I can't think of a metaphor right now).
They missed him in that game unbelieveably. Had he have been playing, he would have got them a penalty and probably scored one of those silly free kicks as well (which I notice Drogba seems to have perfected during the close season). Apparantly you hit it on the valve or something, I don't think they'd invented it when I played football.
I agree with you Mick. Without him they're miles weaker, even a blind man can see that. Poeple say we overrely on Gerrard and Torres, jesus they're going to be completely reliant on Rooney this season.
The point is, the media won't mention it because it's United. They were garbage against Arsenal but somehow won thanks to two howlers. The day after people in the media were just saying "yeah they were the poorer team but they won, that's why they've won 11 titles blah blah blah". At the same time we played average and won and yet "we were lucky and don't look anything like potential champions".
There's no consistency in the media over here. How people can draw conclusions after 4 games is beyond me.