Job too big for Rodgers?

Liverpool Football Club - General Discussion

Is the job too big for Rodgers and last season was a flash in the pan down to Suarez carrying us?

Yes
43
55%
No
28
36%
Not sure
7
9%
 
Total votes : 78

Postby killerp » Tue May 26, 2015 9:13 am

If Rodgers does leave that does not fix our situation. FSG are still the driving force behind the whole show and financiers. The next manager whoever that might be will run into the same issues Rodgers had, perhaps better managed but quality players will still avoid us, transfer negotiations will be slow and result in poor deals with ***** players coming for double their worth, transfer committee will spend 3 months anal-ising data only to have all top targets reject our offers and end up with the rejects of European football.

Fans should protest out in force against the lack of involvement/interest from the top. When is the last time Mr Henry actually watched a game? does he really care? The mark 2 yanks are frustratingly disconnected from our game. This has been my gripe all along.

Our club should be an insanely rich mans mistress which involves passion for the game, pursuit of glory regardless of cost. This club should not be just part of an investment portfolio on a spreadsheet run by inadequate muppets who are too busy watching baseball to notice us slipping down the ladder while their 'boy' is busy improving his teeth and banging his new girlfriend instead of working out tactics.
Last edited by killerp on Tue May 26, 2015 9:18 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby leeroy74 » Tue May 26, 2015 9:18 am

nice little personal attack at the end there, just as your post looked like being a good one. well done you.
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Postby killerp » Tue May 26, 2015 9:22 am

leeroy74 » Tue May 26, 2015 8:18 am wrote:nice little personal attack at the end there, just as your post looked like being a good one. well done you.


Had to slip that in   :rasp

I'm holding back the rest of my rage...
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Postby Kash_Mountain » Tue May 26, 2015 9:56 am

kazza » May 26th, '15, 09:01 wrote:Brendan Rodgers warned Liverpool's poor season CANNOT happen again - and that changes are coming
19:41, 25 May 2015
OPINION BY DAVIDMADDOCK
If Rodgers can’t accept the changes – and they could yet include the ­appointment of a director of football – he will be asked to quietly step down

If Brendan Rodgers has been given firm assurances over his future, then they come with an even firmer caveat.

The Liverpool manager may have received confirmation that the club’s US owners will not hit the panic button, and their backing for him has not changed despite the 6-1 humiliation at Stoke.

Yet, along with that message, came another crucial one that will determine the direction in which the club will head as they contemplate a season of disappointment.

The word from the Americans is clear.

This season cannot happen again, so not only will there be a review, with their manager asked some brutally direct questions about his role in the failure, but there will be no sense of Rodgers being asked to simply continue in the same manner as this year.

There will be major changes, a “beyond robust” examination of the structures and cultures currently in place at Anfield - demanding alteration to ensure there is no repeat.


At present, the mood within the ownership group – made up of chairman Tom Werner, principal shareholder John Henry and director Michael Gordon – is those changes will stop short of the manager.

Gordon will direct the review and ask Rodgers to buy into not only the long-term strategy, but also deliver firm guarantees of rejoining Europe’s elite in the Champions League.

In short, they will gauge if he can meet his targets. It is here the manager’s future will be determined.

If Rodgers can’t accept the changes – and they could yet include the ­appointment of a director of football – he will be asked to quietly step down.

Likewise, the same message will be offered if he feels he can’t work within the club’s very closely defined transfer and wage policies which emphasise homegrown talent.

So far, all the indications are that the Ulsterman IS prepared to buy into that philosophy.

The review will get underway in earnest by the first week of June, when Rodgers is likely to travel to Boston to meet Gordon face to face, and sit down with him and Henry - and possibly Werner - to thrash out the changes.

Until then, the Americans will keep their powder dry.

They have made NO approach for any other manager, and will not make any enquiries, even if it means losing out on the available Jurgen Klopp.

The plan remains the same – Rodgers will continue into next season unless the review makes his position untenable.

It promises to be a pivotal month for Liverpool.

Analysis: 'Big club' Brendan Rodgers is looking increasingly small-time


:D  :D  :D , this review has been going on for months now, i mentioned that ages ago., his position is part ofthat review.  All the other stuff he is saying is basically him covering his backside. He is not learning anything at all, and needs to go quicksmart.
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Postby Kash_Mountain » Tue May 26, 2015 10:03 am

leeroy74 » May 26th, '15, 08:57 wrote:I hope he stays. He's learning as he goes, you just don't go from coming 2nd one season to being the sh!ttest manager ever (as some on here rate him) in one season. The loss of key players was crucial to this decline. He signed a boat load last summer thinking that was the correct tactic but he's learnt it isn't, he even said so himself in his Talksport interview not so long since. If he stays on I'd expect one marquee signing hopefully to replace the 20+ goals LS took with him. Then maybe one or two good signing to replace the leavers (Johnson, Gerrard, Sterling etc) then start the rebuild from there. He's not stupid, he's not an idiot , he's just made an error in how he tried to take us forward last summer. Hope he stays. Just my opinion though.


Well all other clubs lose 'critical' players yet go on to do well. BR has learn't nothing at all in his 3 seasons at the club. He's got to go.  Which top qaulity players will want to play for him, exactly, no player worth their salt. The players at LFC currently know that he is not good enough, he has lost the dressingroom bar 1 or 2. He has also lost the backing of influential people at the club.

You mention marquee, there will be no marquee signings this summer. He's wasted a lot of money. There is nothing left (not much anyway). Also, there is no way that i'd trust BR with any money.  If FSG persist with BR, total chaos will ensue at LFC, way more then there is now. For the good of the club, and fans and everything  in between, he has to go.
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Postby Kopite-Jud » Tue May 26, 2015 10:34 am

Harsh realisation is that we are no longer what we once were.

We need to stop looking backwards and look forward. 

Yes we were great

Yes we are the most successful team in England

But at this moment in time we are a mess and in steep decline.

We are a nailed on just above mid table team.

Best players leaving every year, owners that don't seem to know an awful lot about football (but know how to make money) unable to compete with big wages or transfer budgets and a mid table manager with no track record of anything.

How many of our players would get into teams above us ?  How many of our starting 11 would get into a Chelsea, City,Arsenal or United team ?

Sturridge ? (half crocked) Sterling (massively overrated)?  Coutinho - Yes at a push ?

Gary Neville done an interesting collumn for SkySports last week and maybe he's right.  We are stuck in the mud looking over our shoulders at what we once were.

Even when it came to moving grounds many of us turned our noses up at moving away from Anfield. Look at the BIG teams in Europe they have all moved grounds and increased revenue.

We are stuck and failing massively, we need to stop the rot before we can even think about competing again, IMO we are a million miles away from being a good side again.

Who ever comes in this summer whether its Brodge or someone else has their hands tied with the current owners, financially we are a million miles away. Especially with fans high expectations of what we once were.  Not even sure Jesus Christ could save us under the current regime. Even he would be nailed to the cross (again).
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Postby red till i die!! » Tue May 26, 2015 10:50 am

I'll be disappointed if he is allowed to continue  :nod

He has taken us as far as he can and he has massive problems to deal with in that dressing room. Too many absolve him but yet if one of the changes coming happens to be a D,O,F then its obvious the set up we have was heavily influenced by him and he has more control in transfers than he lets on. With any luck his Ego will prevent that from happening and he will walk.

If he stays not much will change  :no  No one will be any wiser as to what is happening and who does what. He will bring in plenty of new faces that will be average or past it and get little or nothing from them. All we will get is excuses.

The majority of the Fan base do not want him and should he have a nightmare start like in his first season or last year then what do people think is going to happen ? Its unbearable to think we could pick up were we left off this season but it is a possibility.
We have a heavy preseason tour and europa qualifiers before the league starts. Will he have enough time to work his influence on the new players or will it be that statistically we will get better in january ? Will he rely on sturridge coming back sometime in october to start our season. Losing such a talisman in gerrard is also going to be a factor let alone johnson.

If we were talking about a manager of higher quality then you would say we have a better chance of turning this around but we haven't and all we are doing is hoping he can somehow turn into one over the summer. We are taking as big a gamble in his 4th year as we did in the 1st.
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Postby Kash_Mountain » Tue May 26, 2015 10:50 am

Written by Paul Parker:

Liverpool’s biggest problem is Brendan Rodgers - the time is right to call on Jurgen Klopp. Paul Parker gives his in-depth critique of what has gone wrong at Liverpool under Brendan Rodgers. By Eurosport- Paul Parker

"Liverpool manager Brendan Rodgers.

For Liverpool to move forward, they have to get rid of the dead wood. The dead wood includes the manager Brendan Rodgers, who has taken the club as far as he can.

Losing at Stoke City wasn’t the issue for Liverpool. It was the nature of their capitulation that hints at something badly wrong within their dressing room. You look at the body language of their players at the Britannia Stadium. Most of them didn’t appear to have an extra yard in them.  Some of them looked half-paced, and had no drive. There was nothing there at all. No ambition about proving a point for next season.

It concerned me, and I’ve felt that way for a long time. I looked at the Raheem Sterling contract situation, and I looked at the Steven Gerrard situation in wanting to leave the club. Even Gerrard’s uncharacteristic sending off against Manchester United in March worried me.

I really do believe there is an issue with the manager. As much as Sterling and his agent are wrong in certain ways, they are not completely to blame. When Sterling’s agent comes out to suggest his client would not sign a new contract at Anfield for £900,000 per week, you know there is a problem.

Everybody is calling Sterling greedy, former players like Phil Thompson are sitting wearing a big pair of red-tinted glasses, but he should be taking a deep breath by studying the facts.

It is not all Sterling’s fault. This is a kid who has been there for five years. He has practically grown up at Liverpool.

I think the issue is all with the manager. I think you have to ask why someone like Sterling does not want to play for Liverpool? He signed for Liverpool at the age of 15. Back then, he wasn’t signing a contract to win things. It was all about signing for Liverpool, one of the biggest clubs in world football.

Why are we suddenly getting someone at the age of 20 now talking about winning things? That isn’t right. I don’t think it is all about money. He has every right to get as much as he can because the game allows it now.

I think there is serious discontent in the changing room. I think there is more than meets the eye with Gerrard leaving Liverpool. He never got offered a new contract, but his sending off against Manchester United rang alarms bells for me.

Rodgers has been backing Gerrard up when in certain games he has been awful. I feel Rodgers has been covering things up about his relationship with Steven Gerrard.

He has to have a relationship with Steven Gerrard otherwise Liverpool fans aren’t going to take kindly to him.

His saving grace was finishing second in the Premier League last season, but he has not done much better than Kenny Dalglish, who at least won a trophy. They got rid of a living Liverpool legend like Dalglish yet Rodgers is expected to keep his job after spending over £200 million to get them where they are now?

It is a bit like Real Madrid in certain ways. Has Brendan Rodgers done enough to keep his job? If they had won the league last season, it would have papered over the biggest crater in the world because Luis Suarez would have gone to Barcelona, and all of a sudden there would still have been this massive problem.

When Suarez signed a new contract at Liverpool, it was only for 12 months of football. That is all it was. Rodgers never done his work when he knew the club would have to replace Suarez.

BRENDAN RODGERS IS NOT MOTHER THERESA

All of a sudden he became a lion tamer in trying to control Mario Balotelli when we all know that Balotelli could not be controlled back in his homeland. A bloke like Roberto Mancini called Balotelli his adopted son yet couldn’t deal with him yet Rodgers thought he was Mother Theresa and could control the situation, but he didn’t do it.

He then told everybody that the Manchester United Louis van Gaal had to be careful because he didn’t have experience of managing in the Premier League. So said the man who was sacked by Reading and Watford.

He did okay with Swansea, but everybody who has come in at Swansea since that point has taken the club on from the period when Rodgers was there.

The Everton manager Roberto Martinez did a great job with Swansea, but Rodgers didn’t take them on all that much.

You remember when he came to Liverpool, he talked about playing the Swansea way.  He brought that in. He brought Joe Allen in as a player who never gives the ball away, but he never passes it forward so it is quite easy to never give the ball away.

LIVERPOOL BOARD WILL BE AWARE OF JURGEN KLOPP

The board have to ask him what has gone on this season, and what they got back from the money they have spent. Of all the money he has spent, none of those signings have come to fruition for the supporters.

He signed a Spanish right-back Javier Manquillo, who has not been seen for months. Emre Can is a bloke who can’t defend. There are all sorts of problems.

I said a few months ago that when Jurgen Klopp became available, somebody like Brendan Rodgers should be fearful for his position.

A board of maybe 12 Americans running Liverpool  will be look at the team, and around 60 percent of them will be asking: “Who is this Klopp?”

The Americans will do their due diligence as business demands and will relate the club’s branding to their own in Liverpool. Liverpool is a blue-collar city just like Dortmund.

Klopp had 80,000 fans believing in his methods, and he led Dortmund to two Bundesliga titles and the Champions League final. This season they are in the German Cup final.

They will be looking at someone there who is player-friendly. Players love him, but more than anything he can bring top players to Liverpool because of his name.

They are not in the Champions League, but the owner John W Henry can look at Manchester United. They managed to attract some wonderful players to Old Trafford mainly on the name of Louis van Gaal. What player would not want to play for a man like Klopp?

The club hasn’t achieved anything tangible under Rodgers. How can the club move forward? They should be saying to Brendan Rodgers: ‘Thank you very much, but we need a more experienced coach'.

In Klopp, they have a guy who has taken on a big club and turned them into champions. Liverpool needs a manager who can sign top players and the level of quality that a club like Liverpool deserves to have.

Not ones like Balotelli that you have to mollycoddle to get the best out of him.

TREATMENT OF RAHEEM STERLING AT STOKE CITY NOT GOOD ENOUGH

He said that Raheem Sterling wasn’t mentally ready to play at Stoke yet puts the lad on the bench at Stoke. You either play him, or leave him out of the squad.

Leaving him on the bench allowed him to get abused by people. Is that going to help the lad to stay when all those folk are abusing him as he runs towards the tunnel?

I could imagine what he was being called too. He might have been racially abused by a few people there. Will he want to stay? No, he doesn’t.

So Brendan Rodgers’ man-management skills are very poor. Sterling should either have been playing, or nowhere near that match.

Rogders should have said: 'He wasn't playing today. The lad is going to go away over the summer, and get his head right. And will be back for pre-season'. But leaving him sitting in Stoke has not helped anybody.

A QUESTION OF TRUST

Liverpool need a manager they can trust. I wonder how much of those players really trust Brendan Rodgers with his big words, and soundbites that he is told to use. Rodgers is all pre-match and post-match. 90 minutes is all that matters to players, not these big words. Players only want a manager who they can trust. Not someone who is going to talk bad of them.

Kenny Dalglish was one of the best at that. No matter his own problems, he would never mention any players or blame them publicly. Even when Liverpool were having a bad time. He questioned himself rather than blame individuals.

Rodgers questioned Van Gaal, who has coached the Dutch national side, and won trophies at clubs such as Barcelona and Bayern Munich while he has been sacked by two Championship clubs.

Since then those Championships sides he managed have gone into the Premier League at different times. That says a lot.

Paul Parker"
Last edited by Kash_Mountain on Tue May 26, 2015 10:52 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby Doeboy » Tue May 26, 2015 10:51 am

Kopite-Jud » Tue May 26, 2015 9:34 am wrote:Harsh realisation is that we are no longer what we once were.

We need to stop looking backwards and look forward. 

Yes we were great

Yes we are the most successful team in England

But at this moment in time we are a mess and in steep decline.

We are a nailed on just above mid table team.

Best players leaving every year, owners that don't seem to know an awful lot about football (but know how to make money) unable to compete with big wages or transfer budgets and a mid table manager with no track record of anything.

How many of our players would get into teams above us ?  How many of our starting 11 would get into a Chelsea, City,Arsenal or United team ?

Sturridge ? (half crocked) Sterling (massively overrated)?  Coutinho - Yes at a push ?

Gary Neville done an interesting collumn for SkySports last week and maybe he's right.  We are stuck in the mud looking over our shoulders at what we once were.

Even when it came to moving grounds many of us turned our noses up at moving away from Anfield. Look at the BIG teams in Europe they have all moved grounds and increased revenue.

We are stuck and failing massively, we need to stop the rot before we can even think about competing again, IMO we are a million miles away from being a good side again.

Who ever comes in this summer whether its Brodge or someone else has their hands tied with the current owners, financially we are a million miles away. Especially with fans high expectations of what we once were.  Not even sure Jesus Christ could save us under the current regime. Even he would be nailed to the cross (again).


You've hit the nail on the head mate. We have some very serious issues and unless something drastically changes, are going to only continue to lose ground. If it were upto me,  I'd build a completely new ground. Tottenham look to be pushing ahead with a new stadium and my worry is if they start pulling in more revenue, even they could be a pulling away which would be a shocking state of affairs
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Postby Boocity » Tue May 26, 2015 11:44 am

With talk of BR staying and FSG bringing in a DoF, I really cant see that working. Ok he may accept a DoF as part of keeping his job but I'm sure he will be working against him rather than with him. He wouldn't accept the job initially with a DoF so why now? You can imagine that any players brought in by a DoF that BR didn't choose would get the balotelli treatment. IMO BR staying with a DoF would result in such a behind the scenes power struggle that next season would end up worse than this one.
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Postby Boocity » Tue May 26, 2015 11:59 am

This reminds you just how much rubbish he has spouted.
http://www.mirror.co.uk/sport/row-zed/brendan-rodgers-quotes-be-quiet-5763659

9 things Liverpool manager Brendan Rodgers probably wishes he never said

1) "Look at Tottenham. If you spend £100m, you expect to be challenging for the league."

2) "Judge me after three years" - (in 2012)

3) "My biggest mentor is myself because I've had to study, so that's been my biggest influence."
(Jurgen Klopp: "I learned everything, everything that I am as a coach, [from] Arrigo Sacchi")

4) "I always say a squad is like a good meal - I'm not a great cook, but a good meal takes a wee bit of time."

5) "I've always worked along the statistic that if you can dominate the game with the ball you have a 79 per cent chance of winning."
(Possession: Stoke - 45%; Liverpool - 55%. Score: 6-1)

6) “I believe a young player will run through a barbed wire fence for you. An older player looks for a hole in the fence, he’ll try and get his way through it some way, but the young player will fight for you.”
(Raheem Sterling laughs on the sidelines as Liverpool lose 6-1 to Stoke)

7) "When you’ve got the ball 65-70% of the time, it’s a football death for the other team. We’re not at that stage yet, but that’s what we will get to. It’s death by football. You just suck the life out of them."
(Liverpool 0-0 Hull – 66% , Newcastle 1-0 Liverpool – 65%, Liverpool 0-1 Aston Villa – 75% possession)

8) “We play with 11 men, other teams play with 10 men and a goalkeeper.

9) "We won't do a Tottenham"
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Postby Thommo's perm » Tue May 26, 2015 12:13 pm

The proof will be in the next few months when Gerrard and the dead wood have gone Rodgers will have to prove himself by actions, not words. I too am fed up with the constant jabbering and waffling that he seems to enjoy. He needs to shut the fu'ck up now and stop feeding the media with bullsh'it and golden quotes which come back to bite him on the ar'se.
We need to close ranks and start planning for next season, hopefully without the distractions which have had to endure this season
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Postby ycsatbjywtbiastkamb » Tue May 26, 2015 12:13 pm

I'm not a fan of DoF's, imo they are just another layer of beaurocracy which just further muddies the waters, there's already a distinct lack of accountability at the club and appointing a DoF will just make the issue even worse.
Besides we had one in Comoli and sacked him within a year, now we want one again? It's starting to look like FSG are just teetering around in the dark and haven't really got a clue how to put a competent managerial structure in place.
If they aren't happy then just sack the manager, I don't want him to go but I'd rather that than go through another year of who signed who?...who's in charge?.... he's not getting along with him....his best mate is the manager of such and such and he wants him in etc etc etc
Imo FSG need to give the manager full control of everything on the football side of the business just like the old days, yes I know it goes against their instincts and their philosophy to spend tens of millions on the say so of just one man but if it all turns pear shaped then at least you know who to sack!
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Postby Thommo's perm » Tue May 26, 2015 12:18 pm

Analysis and a thorough review should tell them where they went wrong. It would be interesting to see some sort of report into the month to month running of the club regarding staff and players, and how much various elements influenced decisions on and off the pitch?
???
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Postby leeroy74 » Tue May 26, 2015 12:19 pm

anyone got anything else they can turn into a stick and beat Rodgers with? come on, stand up and be counted after all it's a "kick Rodgers in the nuts" fest.
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